Phillips: Pirates/Indians Keep Working on Jason Bay Deal

by Charlie Wilmoth on Dec 3, 2007 5:08 PM EST in News

The Pirates and Indians are talking about a potential Jason Bay trade. Pittsburgh would get catcher Kelly Shoppach and left-hander Cliff Lee for the two-time All-Star.

Why would the Pirates do this? Shoppach will be 28 early next season and hasn't put up an OBP above .310 in the majors. Lee has had a couple nice seasons in the past, but he was miserable last year and isn't assured a starting rotation job if the Indians still have him when the season starts. He's older than Bay, and he's owed over $10 million in the next two years. Shoppach and Lee are both interesting players, but they're not nearly interesting enough or young enough to make this trade a smart idea for the Bucs.

-P- From the same blog, Keith Law reports that the Nats have acquired Elijah Dukes from the Rays for a player to be named. Typical Nats deal, taking on a toolsy, talented outfielder with an attitude problem. Dukes is probably a bigger jerk than Lastings Milledge, and he's not quite as promising, but he's still got a shot at being a very productive starter in the big leagues. Would anyone be shocked if the Nats took a run at Milton Bradley next?

UPDATE: The excellent Nats blog Capitol Punishment's comments on the differences between Milledge and Dukes are eye-opening, and make me wonder if there's some point where you just have to overlook Dukes' talent and say, "Forget it, he's not worth it."

Also, because I forgot to mention it before, thanks to Slick for posting the Bay-to-Cleveland-rumor diary in the sidebar.

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Bay-for-crap

The one consolation there is that Steve Phillips is the one posting the report. If Phillips said that the sun would rise tomorrow, I'd take a flashlight to bed with me.

If Huntington actually makes that deal, though... wow, what a stinker.

by Vlad on Dec 3, 2007 5:15 PM EST reply actions

When OFs attack!

Adding Bradley would make sense for them. That way, when Dukes is suspended during spring training for punching a police horse or committing mail fraud or whatever, they'll have a fallback option in CF.

by Vlad on Dec 3, 2007 5:16 PM EST reply actions

Flaw in your plan, Vlad

Unfortunately, the reason Dukes attacked the police horse was because it breathed on Milton Bradley, powderizing all of his bones.

by scoreboard on Dec 3, 2007 5:41 PM EST up reply actions

Done Deal?

Wow.

From http://buccoblog.mlblogs.com/
(claims to have lots of inside sources at the meetings)

"6:24 PM: Bay to Indians seems to be nearly a done deal - Cliff Lee (owed $9.5M yet and a real makeup problem guy) and Kelly Shoppach. Wow.. wow.. wow.. not good folks. There has to be more to this than we know. Mitchell's report perhaps? Either that or the lobby is seeing pigs flying."

http://raisethejollyroger21.blogspot.com/

by Brian M on Dec 3, 2007 7:43 PM EST reply actions

Pretty funny

That's just a list of reports that appeared in legitimate news sources online during the day, with times added to make it look like he's on the scene in Nashville.

by WTM on Dec 3, 2007 7:55 PM EST up reply actions

Bay Trade

It doesn't make much sense. If they were going to deal for a catcher then they would have give up Paulino for Milledge, don't you guys think?

by bucofanNY on Dec 4, 2007 12:07 PM EST up reply actions

Well...

...Schneider, whatever his offensive faults, is a good defensive catcher. Maybe the Mets weren't willing to bite because Paulino never gives an honest effort back there?

by Vlad on Dec 4, 2007 12:25 PM EST up reply actions

Well...

You may be correct, but the word from all the Mets people I know around here is Minaya wanted Paulino from last season, and it is Huntington that wouldn't do the deal. Who knows what really happened....it's over now so whatever. Many met fans think Minaya is hell bent on having an all Latin team. This is the first big trade he made since taking over the mets that didn't acquire latin players in.

by bucofanNY on Dec 4, 2007 1:10 PM EST up reply actions

Inside sources?

I hear he's got a bridge for sale, too.

by Vlad on Dec 3, 2007 8:44 PM EST up reply actions

Jake's "inside sources"

are the voices inside his head.

by Willton on Dec 3, 2007 9:18 PM EST up reply actions

Dukes is going to be trouble

for any team. Taking on Milledge is one thing for the Nats, but Dukes...?
Well, at least he should be able to meet his child support payments for one more year.

Not that this is going out on a limb, but I think it`s becoming apparent that Huntington is going to tear the team apart and "rebuild" it again. There won`t be a "drive for 75" in 2008.
Something like "hope for 65 again" will be more appropriate.

by patthatt on Dec 3, 2007 8:37 PM EST reply actions

Bay

The Cleveland Plain Dealer says that the negotiations with the Indians over Bay have ended.

If we weren't going to get anything more than Shoppach/Lee/Marte for him, I'm glad to see Huntington was willing to walk away. Better no deal than a bad one.

by Vlad on Dec 4, 2007 12:53 PM EST reply actions

for sure

couldn't agree more. this is a trend that needs to be set with a new general manager. let the other guys know that you are not dave littlefield and you are not a push over. don't go into a discussion with the indians over jason bay asking for something ridiculous like hafner and sizemore and walk away with something equally ridiculous the other way like jason michaels...

let them know you're willing to deal for fair value, but you are not a foo who will take what's given.

by bryanzane on Dec 4, 2007 7:59 PM EST up reply actions