Help is on the way

by bolton on May 22, 2007 10:12 PM EDT

I'll believe when I see it, but we might someday have good prospects.

PANTOJA, Dominican Republic (AP) _ The Pittsburgh Pirates are considering building a new training academy in the Dominican Republic in an effort to attract more of the country's top prospects. The team's owners and general manager Dave Littlefield ended a four-day visit to the country on Tuesday, saying they want to increase their presence there.

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Yeah, surrrre

This is the GM who said, almost within hours of being hired, that one of his top priorities was Dominican scouting because "that's where the players are." And now he's acting like this is some new issue that just came up. Fills me with confidence. As does this:

"Maybe not immediately, but it is something that you cannot rule out . . . ."

Sure imparts a sense of urgency, doesn't it?

Let's see . . . a couple years to ponder ways to do this cheaply, a year to build it, a couple more years for word to get around enough to help them sign players, six years for 16-17 yr old Dominican kids to develop, another couple years for them to reach their potential in the majors . . . . So, in about 2020 we should see some results.

Of course, that's not including 3-4 years for them to spend lobbying to have the taxpayers pay for it.

by WTM on May 22, 2007 11:59 PM EDT reply actions

Yes

Those rich Dominicans should have to foot the bill. What with their flying cars and golden toothbrushes.

by Dignan on May 23, 2007 2:00 AM EDT up reply actions

Am I missing something,

or have other teams been scouring the DR for talent (and finding it) for, like, 30 years?

by Ram25 on May 24, 2007 5:17 PM EDT up reply actions

It seems unlikely

That a team which has such a dismal record finding prospects in drafts is going to fare any better in a different location. I mean Nick Swisher, Prince Fielder, BJ Upton, Jeremy Hermida, Jeff Francoeur, Aaron Hill and Ryan Howard (3 times)were right their in front of their faces and they couldn't see good prospects.

First you need to the ability to recognize a good prospect, something the Pirates have shown they're incapable of doing, before you can acquire good prospects.

Matt LaPorta, he'll be there when they pick on the fourth, bet they pick another back of the rotation pitcher instead.

by RunRunRunAGround on May 23, 2007 1:45 PM EDT reply actions

Buscons

In the end, money won't play as big a part in signing premium talent in the DR as the relationships the Pirates develop with the local buscons will. A nice facility helps and throwing around some signing bonuses wouldn't be a bad thing, but in the end the power of the buscon to deliver talented prospects is what really matters down there.

International scouting is decidedly different than draft scouting. While some super talented prospects have agents and sign for top dollar, most don't. The reputation a team has with the community (how they treat the players in the DR and US) means a great deal. And as much as you may think the Pirates would be able to trade on the name of Roberto Clemente, I think that it won't matter as much as will the affiliation with some of the better buscons and showing that they do take care of their players (Cleveland has a great reputation in that regard - they offer education, language and lifeskill courses through their minor leagues for international players. Same for the Braves.).

Really, I think the "scandal" is overblown. A lot of teams get by without a huge investment in international scouting. It is a cheap way to find talent, but it isn't the end all of player development. If the Pirates were even remotely competent in scouting an developing North American talent, this wouldn't be as big an issue. It's nice they recognize they need to do some catch-up, but in the end I bet it's all talk.

The Pirates shouldn't try to compete in the DR against established teams like the Braves. The Pirates should be out and searching for talent somewhere else (like the Astros in VZ or the Twins in Australia, San Diego in independent baseball). The Pirates could be looking in new places for talent - Europe or maybe South Africa 9where the game of baseball is making some inroads). Instead they'll try and muscle up and play with the big boys and ultimately lose - again.

by Greg Schuler on May 24, 2007 9:44 AM EDT reply actions

Overblown?

Are you serious? The Pirates have the worst record of any team in international scouting since DL took over. I mean that literally, because I've put some time into researching this. Yeah, they need to improve their N. Am. scouting, but you're limited in making headway there to the # of draft picks you have. If you look at the teams with good farm systems, you won't find any that just blow off international scouting. It's a key component of nearly all the top farm systems. It's not an option; it's critical for a team that can't/won't acquire talent at the major league level. To the extent teams get by without it, or without good farm systems for that matter, it's because they can sign or trade for high-salaried veterans. That's not going to happen for the Pirates. And even the Yankees and Red Sox have concluded they need to improve their farm systems.

And what's the worry about competing with the higher-revenue teams in the DR? The top bonuses there are still much lower than in the draft. If Milwaukee can do it, why on earth can't the Pirates? This is exactly the sort of thing that the Nuttin's welfare check is supposed to be for. It's easily within their means. It is absolutely not true that lower revenue teams can't compete with the big boys in Latin Am. It's easier for them to compete there.

South Africa and Europe aren't going to provide an answer, either. It's certainly worth looking there in addition to the DR and Venezuela, but exactly how many star players can you name from there? The competitive level just isn't adequate. If it's ever a meaningful option, that's going to happen many years down the road. For now, at best, they might come up with a couple interesting middle relievers or something. It's not going to address their need for impact talent. If you want that and can't pay big dollars for free agents or Japanese stars, you talking about the draft and Latin America. That's where the high end talent is.

by WTM on May 24, 2007 12:13 PM EDT up reply actions

To be fair

I think part of Greg's point is that you can't name any stars that came from Europe or South Africa specifically because nobody's really scouting those areas and bringing guys over here. There are stars over there waiting to be made.

by matskralc on May 25, 2007 12:18 AM EDT up reply actions

People are scouting those areas

The Twins, for instance, have a Dutch prospect named Alexander Smit. There just isn't that much there yet. Think about how long it took European basketball players to get up to the competitive level of Americans. It's going to take decades, assuming baseball even catches on enough. It's certainly a good idea to get a presence in those places, but it's not remotely a substitute for scouting in the DR.

by WTM on May 25, 2007 9:08 AM EDT up reply actions