Neal Huntington Speaks at Piratefest

by Charlie on Jan 26, 2008 4:47 PM EST in News Comment 26 comments

Watch this video over at the Post-Gazette's website and explain to me how Neal Huntington's comments would've differed from Dave Littlefield's if Littlefield still had the job. Huntington repeatedly talks about how many players last year underachieved, and he talks about how "when you build around starting pitching, great things happen." He talks about how Paul Maholm and Zach Duke's problems last year amounted to a lack of "consistency." He talks about how the Pirates have a "good young core" of position players. (Despite the fact, I guess, that every single offensive starter is at least 26.) He also brags about taking "a patient route" with the 2008 Pirates, by which he means he didn't look at the team, assume they would stink, and "blow it up." (Which is odd, to me, because patience to me means doing the right thing and taking a hit in the short term, rather than pretending a team is ready to contend when it's not.)

I realize this is Piratefest, and that part of Huntington's job here is to drum up excitement about the '08 team. I also realize that not everything he says should be taken at face value. But jeez, 80% of this sounded like Littlefield minus some "with where we're at"s.

Huntington made an interesting comment in reference to how he would balance prospect development against won-loss records in the minors:

"...[W]e don't block a player's development - ever - for the sake of winning a ballgame."

But blocking Steve Pearce's development to keep a 68-win team together is A-OK, I guess.

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You've got the wrong justification

Huntington is keeping Pearce in the minors not to keep a 68-win team together, but so that he has more time to trade Nady. I'm not saying it's the right decision, but I'm pretty sure it's not about wins.

by Willton on Jan 26, 2008 4:59 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

If he had traded other players this offseason...

I'd have a much easier time believing that. Instead, the only player he dealt was a washed-up Salomon Torres.

by Charlie on Jan 26, 2008 6:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Pearce

It's fair to note that Huntington hasn't actually kept Pearce in the minors yet. I mean, being bloggers we can only go on what people say they're going to do, but he hasn't actually gone and done it yet.

http://whereisvanslyke.blogspot.com
http://sports.aol.com/fanhouse/mlb

by whygavs on Jan 26, 2008 5:04 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Kind of liked what they had to say

Some was fluff, but there were pointed comments about the the need to get away from having older players on the single-and-double A rosters and the need to stay away from high-priced players who've done things in the past, but won't in the future -- randa, burnitz, m. morris etc.

Even if NH sounded 80 percent like DL, his actions this winter haven't been. He definitely seems focused on building for 2010 and beyond.

The news that the Padres are still trying to trade for Nady suggests Huntington wants Pearce in right field. Towers is probably offering one of those "27-year-old guys in A ball" that Huntington disparaged in the video. I know we can't get Antonelli or Headley for Nady, but I'd like the Pirates to at least get one of San Diego's top-15 prospects.

by bolton on Jan 26, 2008 7:51 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Actually...

To be really literal about your comments, the Padres didn't have a single guy older than 26 at any of their A-ball affiliates last year, except for a couple of major league guys on rehab assignments. Most of the guys on those teams were age-appropriate.

More to the point, though, the Padres actually have a good amount of prospect depth right now, including several interesting-but-flawed hitters. If the Pirates were willing to take one of their middle-of-the-pack prospects, I'm sure the deal would be done by now. Instead, I bet what's happening is that Huntington is holding out for a top-five prospect or something. That's probably not going to happen. Kevin Towers isn't an idiot, and Nady isn't such an upgrade over Scott Hairston that that would be worth it for him.

by Charlie on Jan 26, 2008 8:35 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

...I know

I wasn't being literal. Which flawed hitter would you accept? Will Venable is 25 and slugged less than .400 in Double-A. We could probably get him.

I'd try for Nick Hundley. He might develop into a middle of the road starting catcher or a good backup.

by bolton on Jan 26, 2008 8:59 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Hundley was specifically who I was thinking of.

Although I might start by asking for Kyle Blanks, who the Padres might be willing to get rid of with Adrian Gonzalez entrenched at first. Blanks' conditioning will probably be a big problem, but he's an interesting power prospect with good numbers.

There are all kinds of arms who might be interesting as well, like Drew Miller.

by Charlie on Jan 26, 2008 9:09 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Blanks

I'd definitely take Kyle Blanks for Nady. But if Towers is offering a Brian Rogers-type prospect, then I'm content to keep Nady for now. If the Pirates trade Nady for next to nothing and Bay for Cliff Lee and Kelly Shoppach, then I think we get the worst of both worlds -- we're not playing for now and we've got no future.

by bolton on Jan 27, 2008 3:29 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

If Towers isn't an idiot

It's possible he's not offering more than a bag of balls. It works both ways. Just because Towers is the established GM with a good track record, doesn't mean he puts a fair offer on the table in the middle of January.

You seemed overly negative here. (Perfunctory: although the team has certainly given you cause in the past...) E.g., taking NH to semantical task over what "patience with the 2008 team" means. And what good would it have done to say Duke needs to stop sucking instead of being vague about consistency and not even naming him? Some of the comments did echo DL, but many didn't too.

by azibuck on Jan 26, 2008 9:06 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

It isn't the semantics I'm concerned about

It's the idea that the virtuous thing to do here is to just let this mediocre team keep trying to contend instead of acting aggressively to improve the health of the franchise.

by Charlie on Jan 26, 2008 9:13 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Those aren't mutually exclusive

and I'm not sure you think they are, but it comes across that way. Assume for a moment that the players we get for the Nadys on the roster are decent prospects. They're still prospects, and almost certainly not ready to fill major league roles. For all of the backhanding he's taken here and elsewhere, Nady IS ready. (So is Jack, Bay, Freddy, Jose B.) Trade these guys, and there's no one there to fill the spots, and the Pirates lose 130 games. How does that help the franchise? It sure as hell doesn't help Coonington, and this fan base has shown some tolerance for 65-win seasons.

Coonington are rebuilding. Can't do that by trading any of these guys. Let them win their 68 games per year until the hypothetical great kids arrive thru the draft, int'l scouting, etc.

by KPatrick on Jan 26, 2008 11:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

charlie

Wouldn`t Pearce benefit from some extended time in AAA proving that he is ready to play the OF on a daily basis?

Just a little more time in spring training and he will be prepared to play a fundamentally sound OF that wouldn`t hurt the team too often over the course of a long season?

His transition to MLB as an OF is not just about his hitting.

by patthatt on Jan 26, 2008 11:05 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

i agree

I think he needs some more work out there before becoming a regular OF.

by EndlessMike on Jan 26, 2008 11:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

disagree

His hitting has reached a point where he needs to face major league pitching to further develop. He has earned that part. Sending him back to AAA where he already tore it up will do nothing to help him learn how to handle big leaguers. It will only retard his growth.

It's true he needs more work in the OF. He can also get that in Pgh. too. His mistakes while he learns do not matter. The Pirates aren't going to win anything.

They need to develop his bat in Pgh. and accept his mistakes in the field.

by rogero on Jan 27, 2008 12:34 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I just don't think...

that playing right field is all that hard, and I also think that Pearce looked remarkably good at it in his September trial. He's athletic and he got decent reads. I think he's already a better defender than Nady, and there's no reason he can't learn whatever else he needs to learn at the big league level rather than at AAA.

by Charlie on Jan 27, 2008 4:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

rogero

You`re convinced that Pearce`s short stay in AAA last season was enough for his game-both offensively and defensively?

I think the Pirates` brass feels differently and would like to see him get more reps in the field and ABs at AAA instead of just sticking him out there at PNC Park at the beginning of the season a time or two each week and hoping things work out.

I`m not saying that Pearce won`t be a good player for us. Hopefully he will be a big contributor and, if it is in 2008, great.

Also, I can see some part of the rationale for trading Nady now, but the consensus seems to be developing here that a suspect prospect or two would be enough in return for him. Sorry, but I disagree. And I think this is the reason that Huntington hasn`t made a move so far. Trade Nady for pretty much nothing. Yeah, that`s a good way to build for the future.

by patthatt on Jan 27, 2008 3:16 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

Pirates' brass

Actually, in the quote posted a few entries down the page, NH said Pearce ideally would get a shot at a major league job now, but they weren't in a position to do that. In other words, he's headed back to AAA because Nady is blocking him, not because he isn't ready.

I think the assumption that every player can benefit from a year or so at every level is wrong. The best players typically rocket to the majors with relatively little, or occasionally no, time in the upper minors. Pearce already showed he wasn't overmatched at the plate or in the field last September, despite Tracy's reluctance to play him. If he's as good as we all hope he is, he'll be able to handle it. And if the cost is a misjudged flyball once or twice a month for a while, I couldn't care less.

by WTM on Jan 27, 2008 10:59 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Lawyering up

As noted by another comment, NH could say that Nady is not blocking Pearce "for the sake of winning a ballgame." Maybe, if pressed, NH would admit Pearce is in fact being blocked, just for some other cockamamie reason, like maximizing Nady's trade value, which couldn't possibly get any higher than it is now.

Not replying to you here, WTM, but to the people thinking we can trade Nady to some team that loses an OF to injury in ST... how often does that happen? Just shy of never, I think. I hope NH is just acting content to keep Nady if he doesn't get a good offer, but eventually deals him before or soon after the season starts.

by azibuck on Jan 27, 2008 2:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Trade value

If his trade value isn't enough to bring in anything worthwhile now, you have to wonder what's going to change that. It's possible that some GM, most likely Towers, will get desperate with spring training approaching and up the ante. But if that doesn't happen, what then? Hope Nady has a big first half that increases his trade value in July? If that happens, will the Pirates really be willing to trade him, or will they cling to him hoping they can reach .500? DL certainly would have done the latter. Maybe things have changed dramatically, but I still see a team that's desperate to break the losing streak and won't reduce its chances of doing so in order to build for the future. NH more or less said so with his comment a while back about how you can't really win now and build for the future at the same time, yet they were going to try to do so. Maybe he'll surprise me if the opportunity to make a move arises, but I'll be skeptical until I see it happen.

by WTM on Jan 27, 2008 3:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Chacon

off topic, but there is a good hot stove piece in the gazette today. there was also a mention of chacon asking for $4m for 2008. i think that's too much. there's a vote on it at the link below if interested.

http://mlbfleecefactor.com/2008/01/27/is-chacon-trying-to-fleece-pirates/

by em3 on Jan 27, 2008 12:25 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Blah, blah, blah

Not impressed. Thus far the status quo has not changed much. I want to see positive steps, not here about them.

by josborn73 on Jan 27, 2008 12:56 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Rocketing to the Majors

WTM is right.

Many players are kept an extra year in AA or AAA when they could be putting up good numbers in the big leagues.

This is why Nady must be traded for whatever we can get, and Bay should be traded for the best package offered by March 15, especially after another club loses one of its corner outfielders to injury in spring training.

This is also why McCutchen should be our staring CFer in 2008 and get at least 400 ABs. The Pirates have to stop worrying about "starting the clock" on prospects and find out who can play the game.

There is a reason why McCutchen played CF and Morgan played LF in the AZ Fall League.

by thegunner on Jan 27, 2008 1:04 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Re:

"Many players are kept an extra year in AA or AAA when they could be putting up good numbers in the big leagues."

True. But some players are rushed too early and their development is stunted. There's a fine line.

by em3 on Jan 27, 2008 2:54 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Who knows

what Huntington's real intentions are, since we can't read minds. The reality is that, if he knows what he is doing, he's actively trying to deal Nady and avoid devaluing him further by announcing that he isn't good enough to start for the Pirates. Hopefully, he knows that the long-term growth of this team and Xavier Nady have nothing to do with each other. My hope is that Nady will be gone as soon as Huntington can get something for him (though he really is going to have to lower his sights). Then, hopefully, we'll see Pearce in right. What bothers me far more about Coonelly and Huntington's chatter is this rubbish about underperforming. It is that sort of thing that turns me negative. If they believe it, they are idiots. If they don't, they are baldfaced liars. To quote Vlad from one of his blog entries, "neither option pleases."

by RichieHebner on Jan 27, 2008 3:05 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Accelerating a Player's Development

em3 is correct. Some players are rushed too quickly to the big leagues

However, whether or not to advance a player to the major leagues in a more timely manner depends on two things: 1) The player's physical talent, 2) the player's readiness based on his "mental makeup".

The development process involves both areas, and both are very important. Based on what I have seen of the Pirates over at least the last five to ten years, they have been grossly deficient in both areas.

by thegunner on Jan 27, 2008 4:58 PM EST reply actions 0 recs