Pirates Sign Robbie Grossman
The Pirates have signed sixth rounder Robbie Grossman, the Post-Gazette reports. Grossman, a high-school outfielder from Texas, appears to be one of the Pirates' best draft picks, so this is great news. Here are some profiles of Grossman:
UPDATE: His signing bonus is a million bucks, plus the Pirates will pay his college tuition. Nice work, Pirates.
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very encouraging
not that i think grossman is a future star (though i of course hope he is), but that new management has the financial flexibility it needs to get talent into the system.
dejan guesses 5 times the recommended slot money. this should probably close the door on the discussions of where frank coonelly’s loyalties lie. RichieHebner? interested to hear your thoughts.
Great!
Glad to see Grossman sign on the dotted line! I’m waiting to see if we sign any others outside of Alvarez and Scheppers before crack open a cold one in celebration… Ah, screw it, I’ll have a mini celebration!
by ElliottBayBucco on Aug 14, 2008 6:07 PM EDT reply actions
Good get by the Pirates
Even if Robbie Grossman amounts to nothing, I love what this signing represents.
Is it just me...
Or is anyone else a little concerned that this guy is only “Average”? I looked up his link on MILB and the word they kept using to describe his various abilities is “average”. Geesh! I was optimistic when I read about his signing until I read the link. Now, I’m depressed. What is it with these people? The only positive thing they said about him is that he won’t be out-worked. They claim he’s not fast enough for CF and doesn’t exhibit enough power for the corners. Well, hell, what’s left for him to play? 2B? Someone, please give me something to be optimistic about this guy.
by Illinois Pirate Fan on Aug 15, 2008 9:36 AM EDT up reply actions
I was wondering if you were on vacation or hiding in your bomb shelter...
nothing like the IPF to piss on the campfire with worries and concerns. I’m sure there might be a group of preschoolers playing on your street that you could tell that Santa Claus doesn’t exist or that the Easter Bunny is an average at best figment of their imagination.
Grossman is 18 years old, a high school kid that BA picked as the 49th overall prospect going into the 2008 draft. That list includes college kids and high school kids. If all you were getting out of the article is that he is average, then I would recommend reading it again, not skimming.
BTW, have you read this article or this one about the trade deadline, yet? I remember your concerns from the posts you read from Yankees fans and thought you might enjoy these reads.
by ElliottBayBucco on Aug 15, 2008 11:35 AM EDT up reply actions
ElliottBayBucco:
While your concern for the preschoolers in my neighborhood is admirable it seems that your reading comprehension skills are no better than your jokes. MILB summarized his strengths as hard-working, aggressive, and gets the most out of his skills. Hell, the same was said about James Brown before he died, yet I never thought of him as a baseball player. All he ever hit was his wives. Considering these comments were the best they could say about him then look at his weaknesses: he doesn’t profile well; he’s not good enough to play CF and doesn’t hit with enough power to play the corners. Given these, where are you going to play him? This isn’t softball and there is no rover position.
In summary, the kindest things they said about him him were his work habits. My wife also has terrific work habits but she still can’t hit a curve ball. What is it about him that excites you besides his work habits?
by Illinois Pirate Fan on Aug 15, 2008 3:24 PM EDT up reply actions
Grossman
Illinois,
Although you are clearly making this comment in regards to another poster, I thought I would give you my take. The thing that really excites me about Grossman is the simple fact that he was ranked as the 49th best prospect in the draft by BA. The Pirates as I’m sure you know full well, simply have to have these types of talented players in the minor league system if they ever hope to have a championship caliber season.
In regard to the so called “tweener” tag that has been applied to an 18 year old athlete, I really don’t put much stock in it. Sure he doesn’t look like he projects to be a 35 home run type player as a true corner outfielder, but not many players do. He can still be a productive player if he gets on base at a solid clip and “only” hits 20-25 homers will a fair amount of doubles.
Likewise, just because he does not have blazing foot speed does not mean he cannot be an above average center fielder at the big league leavel. A competent defender who has moderate power and “just” average speed is still a very valuable thing to have, especially from the center field position.
Also keep in mind that this kid is 18. He could very easily gain a ton of muslce and start hitting for power within the next 4 years, or he could just as easily slim down and become more of a slashing center field type. Thats the thing with the drafting players so young, much of their development is still unknown. The best way to go about it to to get as many talented athlets as possible, and see what happens in a few years. Obviously, it doesn’t hurt that this kid works his butt off as well.
That was really long winded, thanks for reading.
by baseballgg24 on Aug 15, 2008 3:40 PM EDT up reply actions
baseballgg24
NIce post. You beat me to the punch.
baseballgg24
Your points are all well-taken and I can understand your optimism because of his youth. In truth, I was actually somewhat optimistic for the same reason until I read the MILB website. Maybe I was expecting them to say more positive things about him or maybe they are simply not prone to praise for someone so young. I don’t know because I rarely read them preferring instead to rely upon Baseball Prospectus for my minor league information. Here’s hoping you are right in being so optimistic and thanx for sharing your thoughts with me.
by Illinois Pirate Fan on Aug 15, 2008 4:19 PM EDT up reply actions
IPF
Did you read this?
http://users.rcn.com/wtmiller/positions/2008draft/grossman.htm
Probably not, so here goes:
“I’ve found conflicting opinions about Grossman. Baseball America rated him the 49th best prospect in the draft and thought he had a chance of sneaking into the supplemental or late first round, but he apparently fell due to his commitment to Texas and the fact that he fell off in 2008 after hitting .450 in 2007. Scouts clocking him also found that he’d lost some speed, going from above average to average and leading to characterizations as a "tweener” rather than a centerfielder. He also does not have a good arm. MLB.com characterizes him as lacking any above-average tools and playing above his abilities, which combined with the tweener tag gives him some things in common with Nate McLouth, who’s a good example of why it’s a mistake to dismiss players based on tags like that. BA did characterize him as having raw power potential and he showed good power in a workout at PNC Park. Although the writeups at BA and MLB.com sounded rather negative, the fact is that BA rated him as roughly a supplemental first round talent. The negative scouts’ comments probably represent disappointment at his senior season rather than a negative overall assessment. I saw one post online saying that Grossman suffered from being pitched around his entire senior year."
WTM very clearly makes the point that there was a lot of conflicting info out there on the Internet about Grossman and his potential. This happens a lot. There are a lot of “experts” throwing info around on various blogs and other sites about this and that guy, but you shouldn`t take everything you read-positive or negative-as a definitive report about a guy`s baseball tools, even if it is from MILB.
You do know that Grossman is still a teenager, don`t you, IPF? There is room for growth and improvement all the way around. Sometimes it happens, sometimes it doesn`t. It`s part of the crapshoot with drafting and player development.
The Pirates obviously watched this guy over and over and we also impressed with his workout at PNC Park. They wouldn`t have given him the big contract if they didn`t think he could have a big league career down the road, just like they wouldn`t have given #16 HS OF Freeman reportedly so much money to sign.
BTW-I think ElliottBayBucco is pretty funny.
patthatt
Thank you for sharing that information with me. I have come to the conclusion that HS kids must not receive the same acclaim from these scouts and services as their college counterparts because of their age and maturity differences and so I believe I should lower my expectations when reading these reports. I do understand that HS kids are rated pretty much only on potential and raw athletic ability as opposed to collegiate guys who are rated mostly on their performance and so we might be talking about apples and oranges.
I remember reading in Money Ball how Billy Bean refused to draft HS kids and then later changed his policy after realizing their potential plus the fact he couldn’t pigeon-hole them based upon their statistics. I guess that shows that projecting collegiate kids is much harder than HS kids.
I suppose you are right about ElliotBayBucco’s sense of humor and do enjoy the “discussions” with him.
by Illinois Pirate Fan on Aug 15, 2008 4:35 PM EDT up reply actions
Likewise, IPF...
I too am frustrated with the PBC and the current losing streak. Unlike the previous front office, I feel that NH & FC are honestly working to make the PBC a legit MLB team, not the laughing stock it has been in the recent past. Saying that, I really feel that they deserve the time to prove themselves. Rome was not built in a day and as much as I would love to wake up tomorrow with the PBC in first in the NL Central it isn’t going to happen. High priced free agents for a year won’t make us a successful club in the years to come, bringing young talent in and building a solid foundation will.
I do enjoy our “discussions” as well. I can see where you are coming from being a long time Pirates fan. I have very fond memories of those great teams of the 70’s.
As far as MiLB draft scouting reports go, I thought you might enjoy seeing what they had to say about Pedro Alvarez, Tanner Scheppers and Eric Hosmer (KC’s 1st rounder, 3rd overall). Average and below average scores pop up for them as well and Alvarez and Hosmer are looking for big paydays. That said, I can’t take too much negative from Grossman’s MiLB draft report.
by ElliottBayBucco on Aug 15, 2008 6:21 PM EDT up reply actions
What's kind of funny...
Looking at the roster, I feel like the Bucs have a better shot at going .500 next year than we have seen in a long time.
It is mildly ironic that when the team hires management who eliminated the goal of driving for an artificial .500 season, and replaced it with the goal of building a long-run contender, they may have the best shot at stopping the losing streak than they ever had under DL.
Sort of feeling like....
I expect Alvarez and Scheppers.
Alvarez, Scheppers and Gagnon or Miller would make me happy.
Sort of feeling like if the Pirates signed Scheppers and Gagnon or Miller, but can’t sign Alvarez, I would probably not be too upset given what I have seen so far. Not that I don’t want Alvarez.
Pedro Alvarez
I can`t stop thinking that management is really playing hardball with Boras with the logic that this organization needs such a large talent infusion that just one stud like Alvarez is far from being enough, and getting Scheppers, Gagnon and one or two other late draftees signed would be better if Boras doesn`t want to let Alvarez sign for what the Pirates think is a reasonable amount-regardless of what happened with Buster Posey.
Spread the money out, get a wealth of talent-the big bucks paid to high-end HS OFs like Freeman and Grossman, for example-instead of devoting way too much money to Pedro Alvarez. We all want Alvarez in the organization, but I bet Boras` demands are viewed by Huntington and Coonelly as ridiculous, and they are not going to budge.
Gagnon to attend Long Beach State
Per the Trib:
Drew Gagnon, the Pirates’ 10th-rounder, also slid in the draft, but a deal wasn’t worked out. Gagnon, a high school pitcher from California, is committed to attending Long Beach State.
“We gave that one a good run,” Huntington said, “but there was a big enough gap between our value and his expectation that we weren’t able to close the deal.”
http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/sports/pirates/s_583008.html
That's too bad
Now……let’s focus on 20th rounder Q Miller, 23rd rounder, Austin Wright, and 26th rounder Zach Wilson.
GET IT DONE NEAL!
You missed a big one.
Haniger at 19. Given our system needs, I might take him over any one of those.
From the PG:
The signing of Robbie Grossman “raised the Pirates’ number of signed picks to 30 out of 50, three more than last year, and there are three targets remaining besides Alvarez: No. 2 pick Tanner Scheppers, plus two others not yet known.”
We need Alvarez, Scheppers and those “two others” for a really deep draft-especially now with Gagnon keeping his commitment to Long Beach State.
My guess is that they are working hard to sign #19 Haniger-as Vlad mentions our needs above-and the #20 pick, Miller.
Let`s hope for a successful finish to August 15 for the Pirates.
DK mentioned today that the Pirates feel they can sign three
others besides Alvarez (Scheppers being 1 of 3) today. It makes me curious who the other two could be now that #10 Gagnon has said he will honor his commitment to Long Beach State. One would think those two ???‘s would have to come out of the following picks, #19 Haniger, #20 Q.Miller, #23 Wright and #26 Wilson. Wilson is a Scott Boras client, maybe Boras & NH have been discussing Wilson as well as Alvarez on the phone lately? Guess we’ll all know by midnight tonight!
I have to agree with Vlad and say the organization would benefit from Haniger but would really love to see Q. Miller pass up UNC for the PBC. I just hope that NH & FC make us happy come 12:01AM Saturday morning.
by ElliottBayBucco on Aug 15, 2008 3:25 AM EDT up reply actions
This is too bad-
I feel like we have to bring in more arms in this draft.

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