Pedro Alvarez Isn't Reporting

by Charlie on Aug 26, 2008 1:33 PM EDT Comment 43 comments

I'm sure most of you have seen this already, but just in case:

Ten full days have passed since the team and its first-round draft pick agreed to terms on a $6 million signing bonus, but Alvarez has yet to report for his physical or introductory news conference. And there remained, as of late yesterday afternoon, no indication when he will.

The standard line in the days that followed the signing had been that Alvarez and his agent, Scott Boras, were having travel complications. But it became clear yesterday that this has much more to do with Boras' fairly regular practice of keeping his client away from the team an extra week or so, basically for no reason beyond drawing a line in the sand.

Whatever the case, the Pirates are getting antsy.

I know of several lawyers and law students who read this blog, so maybe one of you will be able to answer some questions for me:

1. What does Boras think Alvarez gains from doing this? Is the idea that by making the Pirates "antsy" here, he'll be able to get the upper hand in any negotiations that take place later?

2. If Alvarez' agreement to his signing bonus is good enough for Major League Baseball, then why hasn't he breached his contract by failing to report? Is it because he hasn't physically signed the contract? If so, why did the Pirates pay him half his bonus already?

Anyway, this is far from my area of expertise, but this is really annoying, and I don't think we can just dismiss this as Boras being Boras. At some point, the responsibility has to lie with Alvarez, and we have to assume he approves of Boras' antics.

Maybe he shouldn't, because it's unclear to me how Alvarez will benefit from this. Since Boras likes to let his clients test free agency, it's unlikely Alvarez will be involved in any negotiations for the next seven years or so. So the person these tactics best serve is Boras, whose other clients may benefit from his reputation for being a stubborn jerk. Either way, this can only slow down the start of Alvarez's career, which is a shame for him.

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Alvarez

I’m assuming that the Pirates would be able to start fining Alvarez if he doesn’t report soon? If they wanted to,of course. Wouldn’t THAT be an interesting start to his Pirate career…?!

by rissaldar on Aug 26, 2008 2:15 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I am not a lawyer or a law student,

but I think the contract may actually need to be signed to be legally enforceable. As a general rule contracts don’t require a writing, but I think there is an exception for services that cannot be performed in a year or less. In this case, I think the Pirates would need a writing signed by Pedro Alvarez to legally enforce the contract.

The payment, though, may change things. If the Bucs started acting on the contract (paying Pedro), and Pedro accepted the payment, that may ratify the contract regardless of a writing.

Either way, the Pirates cannot force him to report—it would be a form of involuntary servitude—all they could do is try to fine him or something like rissaldar implies, or void the contract (which they would never do). I don’t think the Bucs would fine him and risk damaging the relationship.

Maybe Boras is just trying to show he has the upper hand, which he kind of does right now, even though he “lost” the initial contract negotiations.

by DITO on Aug 26, 2008 2:20 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Meh.

Boras drama ZOMG1

Like Mr. F said way back in the day, it’s a lot of sound and fury, signifying nothing.

by Vlad on Aug 26, 2008 2:20 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

N.B.

If the Pirates can fine Alvarez for failing to report, then they will in effect be forcing Alvarez to report. If Alvarez fails to report, then the Pirates will have failed to force Alvarez to report.

If Alvarez agreed to terms and money has changed hands, then it seems likely that Alvarez has an obligation of some sort to the Pirates.

Steve Z

by steve_z on Aug 26, 2008 3:43 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

This is utterly ridiculous.

If Pedro wants to be a professional baseball player then he needs to act like it. So far he appears to be a selfish jerk who cares only about money.

by houksyndrome on Aug 26, 2008 3:43 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

There is more to life than money . . .

If Alvarez had signed his $6M deal three months ago, he could be well on his way to the majors by now. He seems in no hurry to get there. But he needs to realize that he will only be able to play for so long, and this BS has cost him an entire year off his career. I bet there will come a time in his life when he wishes he could have that year back to play ball instead of trying to hold out for (and not receive) extra money like a greedy prick.

by houksyndrome on Aug 26, 2008 4:25 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I'd wager that Tim Beckham ...

has his first MLB at bat before “Manny” Alvarez.

by Pirate in Ole VA on Aug 26, 2008 5:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

something must be done

about Boras. This bull**** and the like is absolutely stupid.

The idea that people get millions of dollars to play a game is just one level of ridiculousness. It’s an entirely different level when someone has been paid six million dollars before he even puts on so much as a professional uniform and he thinks these kind of shenanigans are acceptable.

Of course, until he gains his free agency, the Pirates entirely have the upper hand in this little matter. We’ve got Luigi LaRoche with Neil Walker waiting in the wings, and failing that we can’t do any worse than Bautista (we’ve put up with terrible 3B play for some time now), so if he wants to play games let the Pirates send him to the GCL Pirates for the first 4 years of his professional career. Now that would be some comedy.

Jason
The Hanging Curve

by poorboywilly on Aug 26, 2008 4:29 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

That would work.

Keep him in the minors until Boras shuts up. Boras will eventually come around because frankly, the more added time Pedro stays in the minors, the less money he’d make in FA.

I see the future. I see cake.

by Blicks on Aug 26, 2008 4:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

This is ridiculous

Either he reports or the Pirates can fine him. They paid him a portion of his bonus already, there definitely was a binding contract in agreement.

Unless teams with top 10 picks simply stop (and I’m not talking collusion, but stop on your own will), signing unreasonable Boras clients. But, if you’ve got a top 10 pick, you’re struggling, and the draft is the best way to build a team. It’s a Catch 22.

I see the future. I see cake.

by Blicks on Aug 26, 2008 4:57 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

When you guys freak out...

…you’re just giving Boras what he wants.

Seriously, don’t be a drama llama. He has to show up and play sooner or later.

by Vlad on Aug 26, 2008 5:43 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Drama Llama...

I like it. You won’t mind it too much if I use that phrase on the IPF and his next rant, would you?

by ElliottBayBucco on Aug 26, 2008 11:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

It's not mine, either...

…so please feel free to pilfer at will. The world needs more alliteration.

by Vlad on Aug 27, 2008 9:41 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Maybe He is Hurt?

Alvarez might be slow coming to Pittburgh because he is not fully healthy. He has to have a physical, it he does not pass it I think the Pirates have some options. Remember Boras was oushing for a major league contract which DOES NOT require a physical.

Maybe more is going on here that we think!

by zogger on Aug 26, 2008 6:05 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Thank you!

Your last comment is the money line. He could be hurt, or it could be something else. I’ll wait for Dejan to flesh (flush?) out the story. Where is he? If he’s not reporting, what is he doing? Can he be reached? Does he have anything to say? Does his family or friends? The “Boras is an ass” angle just doesn’t square up with me.

by azibuck on Aug 26, 2008 10:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

If Alvarez doesn't pass his physical,

he has to pay back his bonus money AND the contract would be void.

by ElliottBayBucco on Aug 26, 2008 11:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

None of your readers is a client of mine, Charlie

so I can’t give them (or you) legal advice. But it seems to me this is simply posturing.

Alvarez cannot be a J.D. Drew. He’s presumably acknowledged his 11:59 p.m. deadline deal with PBC — if he was claiming he never agreed we’d have heard about that by now. So MLB will not let him back into the draft next year. And if he’s taken any PBC $$ he’s a pro, so under NCAA rules he cannot go back and play college BB.

Perhaps he could get a contract in an independent league. perhaps not. (I’d guess not — he’s agreed to play for the Bucs and in most states so long as the major terms of an agreement have been agreed to orally, it’s a binding contract which he’d breach by playing BB for an independent team.) Even if he does, what do they pay? He could bag groceries — 13th Amendment. But the Pirates probably hold his BB rights indefinitely (he’s not earning any credit toward free agency until her reports).

Seems to me so long as he does not report (a) the PBC and not Alvarez is earning interest on his $6M signing bonus, and (b) Alaverez is not starting the clock that will someday expire on the time he is property of the PBC. His best move is to get to the NL asap so he’s a free agent asap.

I think it’s just Boras being an ass. PBC made him lose big time face, so he can tell future owners — “I can make you wait one year longer for this top guy you drafted to get to your big league club. So how much is it worth to you for me to drop this issue and for my guy to report as soon as we reach agreement?”

by WstCstBucco on Aug 26, 2008 7:13 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

This is what happens

when you have a grossly unfair system that’s slanted towards keeping player’s salaries low by not giving players a chance to choose their employer at the outset of their careers: you get holdouts.

Everyone wants to jump all over Boras, but think of how fundamentally unfair the draft process is. Teams do not compete for the best available talent in a draft; they instead are given a spot in line for the best available talent, and then get exclusive bargaining rights with whoever they pick. Players have no choice in the matter: they can either take what the team gives them or go through the same process the next year. What’s worse is that this happens at a time when the player is of most value: when he is young and before his prime. This is when the player is most marketable, and instead of capitalizing on it, the players are forced into an anti-competitive regime that does nothing but help the owners line their pockets.

I don’t blame Boras or Alvarez; this is the one of the few ways they can exercise their negotiating power with the Pirates. I’d certainly like to see Alvarez report this year, but I think the Pirates should make it more attractive for him to do so.

Formerly known as Econolodge

by Willton on Aug 26, 2008 11:56 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Umm, excuse me.

And that spot in line is determined by record, not randomly assigned. And, by having the worst team pick first, it is a very good attempt at trying to even out the league (although obviously, it does not work as ideally as thought). I’d much rather the Nats/Padres/Mariners draft Strasburg than the Red Sox/Angels/Cubs. It’s like any other job, the more service time you have, the more privileges you have (negotiating own contract, right to choose team within reason, etc.).

The players do have “rights”; its called negotiations and the ability to hold out and enter next year’s draft. There isn’t a set signing bonus (although that might be a good idea, although the union would never OK that).

I see the future. I see cake.

by Blicks on Aug 27, 2008 7:32 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

"It's like any other job"

No, it’s not like any other job. To quote Joe Sheehan, "[e]ngineering firms don’t draft the top engineers and pay them below-market rates, and while the early careers of attorneys can be daunting, they get to choose a firm to give 100 hours a week to for a few years. In those industries, in fact, the top talent can have long, illustrious, profitable careers, so that even if we did hold a First-Year Lawyer Draft, we wouldn’t necessarily be cutting a chunk out the earning potential of the young barristers. We also wouldn’t tell them they had to work for a lousy firm, or in a city they might hate, far from their families.

“As a nation, we wouldn’t stand for that kind of thing, but we do in sports. In sports, we’re handing over the prime of players’ careers without ever giving them a chance to find out what they were worth. For many players, the step from amateur to professional is, in fact, the only time in their lives that they will have any leverage at all in their salary, if not their employer or place of work or management team. It is embarrassing to take so much away from them, then complain that they’re not being reasonable when it comes to the one thing that they can negotiate. If coming out of college I’d been told that I had no choice but to go copyedit for the Des Moines Register, you can be damn sure that I would have been a jerk about salary.”

Formerly known as Econolodge

by Willton on Aug 27, 2008 8:24 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

To respond to one point of your post: “This is when the player is most marketable…”

I think that playing a few years, putting up big or above average numbers makes one more marketable. Very few players get large endorsement deals as rookies. They need to establish themselves as stars first.

- – unless you meant “marketable” as in attractive to a number of teams – -

When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro. -- HST

by cocktailsfor2 on Aug 27, 2008 8:30 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

With all due respect...

Wilton is crazy. Among other things, players worth the rich money that is the subject of this string are not at their peak value before they play a single professional game. That is just crazy.

The draft process unfair? How unfair would it be if the richest 10% of teams had first pick of 95% of the players? If you aren’t sure, I would refer you to the free agent system. Or the system for acquring players not included in the draft.

The NFL has prospered for so long because it has operated as a league moreso than individual teams. Greed is now putting the NFL’s prosperity in jeopardy. It is the same greed that has governed MLB for years now and has it in the presently tilted competitive state. The draft – though hardly a novelty – is one of the few aspects of MLB that is aimed at league-wide competitive fairness. The draft needs to be expanded to include all of Latin America and the Far East – not eliminated.

Wilton: you need to determine if you are a bigger fan of the game or the players. Pedro is getting far more than he has earned or otherwise deserves at this point. If he doesn’t want to play MLB, he can play in Japan or elsewhere. In fact, he even has the option of staying in school, getting a degree and trying his hand at a real world job like the rest of us. But if he wants to play in MLB, he needs to follow the rules, all small percentage of which don’t give him everything his poor little heart desires.

Pedro needs to get in control of this situation – if he is not already – and start making some smart decisions. This post-signing holdout is frustrating, immature, selfish and a bad PR move, but probably doesn’t impede his progress to the majors by a whole lot. That said, if I’m the Pirates, I take this as a sign of things to come. I know right now that if Pedro is nearly as good as expected, he isn’t going to be with us beyond his final year of arbitration. Put another way, he isn’t going to be the exception who disregards Boras’ recommendations. This means that you hold him back after he is ready to get the extra half-season of work out of him – ala Longoria – no matter what. You give him nominal raises before his arbitration years and use every other available tool to maximize his value to the Pirates. It also means that you will be trading him after his 4th year of service to the Pirates.

And I do fault Boras for utilizing all of his “rights” and “tools” because he does so purely for greed and to the clear detriment of everything and everyone else.

Good day.

by Uncle Nate on Aug 27, 2008 7:04 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Good points

Pedro is free to test the open market. I’m sure he could pull in easily $12k/yr in an independent minor league. If he wants to play for the organization that pays the big bucks though, he has to play by the rules that that organization has made to maintain its profitability and ability to dish out $6M signing bonuses. If the Red Sox and Yankees were the only two teams in the MLB, no one would pay to watch them play a 162 game season against each other.

charity standing orders

by BadMaafala on Aug 27, 2008 9:09 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

The problem is that there isn't a true open market

Due to MLB’s antitrust exemption.

That’s a good development for us as baseball fans, but as a matter of intellectual honesty, it’s pretty clearly unfair to the players.

by Vlad on Aug 27, 2008 9:42 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Vlad is correct...

About the anti-trust exemption meaning that it isn’t a true open market, but:

1. That is just in regards to baseball in America and it ignores the worldwide market.
2. That only regards the baseball market. If he is so unhappy, he can do something other than play baseball.
3. He will have an open market available to him in about 6 years, which is pretty unfair to 75% of MLB.
4. When you balance the varying injustices, Pedro will get every cent due him plus some if he produces.
5. Never forget that wholly unfettered capitalism is a drag on the free market, thus monopoly/antitrust laws.

Bottom line: the system sucks, but the Pirates – who are disadvantaged by it to the greatest extent, should not be blamed for using what little advantage it provides. That that advantage still provides a huge pay day to a prospect makes it all the easier to move on without feeling bad for Pedro.

Good day.

by Uncle Nate on Aug 27, 2008 9:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Rebuttal

“If he is so unhappy, he can do something other than play baseball.”

You’re seriously advancing the idea that working outside your chosen field due to the existence and operation of a trust is a good thing?

“He will have an open market available to him in about 6 years, which is pretty unfair to 75% of MLB.”

Every team will have an equal opportunity to sign him for whatever salary they want, and he’ll be able to sign with whichever team he likes best. Nothing’s fairer than that. If he doesn’t want to work for an organization that will pay him less than one of their competitors, why should he be forced to do so? Sure, it sucks for us that our owner won’t pay as much as most, but that’s not the player’s problem. It’s a matter that we should take up with the Nuttings, if we don’t like it.

If you want to bring up the disparity in revenue streams among teams, then that’s also unfair, but it’s an entirely separate issue since that flows from the relationship between ML clubs, and has nothing to do with players.

“When you balance the varying injustices, Pedro will get every cent due him plus some if he produces.”

What if he hits like Albert Pujols for five years, then gets drilled with a line drive like Juan Encarnacion and has to retire? He’ll be out all the money that were denied him by his participation in the draft and the arbitration process, and he’ll have no way to recover those lost gains in the future.

It’s less of an issue for a first-rounder like Pedro, who at least gets a good signing bonus, but what about the 13th-rounder who develops into an unexpected star?

“the system sucks, but the Pirates – who are disadvantaged by it to the greatest extent, should not be blamed for using what little advantage it provides.”

Agreed. I’m not blaming them one bit. I’m just pointing out that they (like all clubs) are exploiting an artificial construct that deprives players of rights that are normal for workers in the marketplace, in order to generate more profits for the owners. Everybody is out to get theirs in this system – the players, the owners, the agents, the media companies, the fans… everybody.

“That that advantage still provides a huge pay day to a prospect makes it all the easier to move on without feeling bad for Pedro.”

This is, I think, at the heart of most people’s objections to player salaries: The feeling that because the player is rich (or soon to be rich), then it shouldn’t matter whether he’s being abused by the system. Of course, the owners are much richer (and deriving much more revenue from any given MLB season), but since ML teams aren’t required to open their books, it’s an invisible kind of wealth, and a lot of people will decry the greed of an athlete making $10M while ignoring the wealth of an owner making $50M.

by Vlad on Aug 27, 2008 10:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Vlad...

I think that we agree on more points than you realize. For example, your last point: the fact that one is loaded doesn’t mean it is okay to steal from him (or keep him from making more money). Further, I fully agree that a primary problem is that Nutting hasn’t/won’t cough up enough money to compete in major league baseball. My rule of thumb is to not bitch about the impact of MLB inequities on the Bucs until the Pirates demonstrate enough competence on the ownership/management side of things to make it relevant to them.

All of that said, the overriding point of my post was that the draft is a necessity and the least of the relevant evils when it comes to the issue of reasonable competitiveness in MLB – which is a major issue for the Pirates and the league as a whole.

I won’t respond to all of your points, but in response to your first counter-point, I want to stress that Pedro does not have rights that are being infringed in this process – which seemed to the theme of several contradictory posts.

Good day.

by Uncle Nate on Aug 27, 2008 8:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Sorry, I’m a little late coming back to this thread. This sounds like something out of “A Beautiful Mind”, but the goals sports leagues aim for (competitive balance, in particular) are in the best interest of the individual owners, the league as a whole, and the players. Things like revenue sharing and the draft make large market teams more profitable and players richer by putting a more compelling sport on the field. I’m not entirely sure what a free market would look like, but I’d guess something like college sports with money: a handful of loaded teams and bunch of D1AA teams as filler. Or it would be Manchester United and Chelsea in the championship every year, and teams like the Twins, Rays, Indians, and Pirates would have as good chance of winning as Miami of Ohio.

My point is that you could argue that the draft takes away the free market from the players, but it would be a harder argument to make that the draft doesn’t benefit the players, including draftees.

charity standing orders

by BadMaafala on Aug 28, 2008 4:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

And one other thing...

I’m not a big NBA fan so I don’t pretend to know all of the details, but at least one notable NBA player has left for a bigger money deal in Europe (and Kobe Bryant, I believe, is threatening to explore all of his options in that regard when his current contract expires).

This underscores the point that I alluded to above: there is no right to play in MLB and nor is Pedro required to join an MLB team. If he wants a better deal and can get it elsewhere, go for it. But the institution we are dealing with his MLB, not the individual teams.

Not that it is a particularly good analogy, but to use Wilton’s lawyer analogy, how often do you see different groups of the same law firm bidding against each other for a kid fresh out of law school? I’m sure it has happened in the rarest of circumstances, but I’m a lawyer and I’ve never seen it. What you see is two different firms bidding for the same lawyer. I think the fair equation is of a law firm to a league (MLB) and MLB teams to different departments/practices in the same firm.

Further, although I’ve been dealt a pretty good hand in life, I’ve learned the hard way that life ain’t fair. It should be, but it isn’t. Given this reality, I have a real hard time drumming up any sympathy for a kid who just signed a $6m deal based not on production, but potential. If they have any sense whatsoever, Pedro, his family and their heirs are incredibly wealthy for generations to come.

Good day.

by Uncle Nate on Aug 27, 2008 9:44 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

On firms bidding for lawyers

It happens all the time. Go to New York. You’ll see that firms like Cravath, Wachtell, Paul Weiss, Skadden, and others try to out-do each other in starting associate salaries in the hopes of employing the best law school graduates. That’s competition for labor. That does not happen in the MLB. Trust me, I know: I’m a law student now.

Formerly known as Econolodge

by Willton on Aug 27, 2008 4:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

If you are a law student now...

you ought to realize the major distinction between my point and your rebuttal. I was comparing it to the same law firm bidding against itself (ie the corporate law group of Jones White bidding agains the litigation group of Jones White for the same person). I can’t say it never happens, but I haven’t seen it and it certainly wouldn’t make much sense from a business perspective.

Good day.

by Uncle Nate on Aug 27, 2008 8:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Sorry, didn't notice your distinction

However, your distinction does not apply here. Yes, different groups within a law firm do not compete for candidates, but they also do not compete for clients, and they certainly do not square off against eachother in a legal dispute. MLB teams, however, do compete against eachother in “disputes,” aka games. If groups within a law firm did have such battles, you can be sure that they would compete against eachother for the best talent. Your analogy is way off. The competition between law firms is a more apt comparison to the competition between MLB teams.

Formerly known as Econolodge

by Willton on Aug 27, 2008 10:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Think about this...

For Alvarez to be AWOL this long there is likely more at play than we realize.

Posturing is one thing. But Boras wants Alvarez to hit the show as soon as possible to get his clock ticking. He gains more from that than from playing silly games.

Alvarez is 21 years old. What are the odds that he’s done something stupid (remember when you were 21)? Imagine yourself at 21 with 3 million dollars in your pocket. A night out at the club… feeling good… some jealous idiot takes a swing…

As previous posters have pointed out, it’s probably an injury thing. Either something preexisting that hasn’t fully healed, or he got himself in to some stupid young trouble.

Once he shows up the physical will quickly follow. So that’s likely the hold-up.

But before everyone goes into panic mode, also consider this: If he was seriously injured, and Boras withheld that information, I’d imagine there would be hell to pay. So I doubt that’s the case. More likely it’s something nagging and minor long-term, but significant enough at the moment to cause him to fail his physical.

Does the whole situation suck? Absolutely. But Alvarez is Pirate property and will be in our system next year. Let’s be grateful for that…

by JohnnyNez on Aug 27, 2008 9:17 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Boras is a moron if he hid medical information.

Had Alvarez had injury problems, Alvarez would most likely have signed with a lower bonus ala Allan Dykstra (1.15MM, also a Boras client). If Alvarez fails his physical, he could lose his entire bonus.

I see the future. I see cake.

by Blicks on Aug 27, 2008 9:26 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I have a J.D. and am an applicant to the PA Bar (took it in July). . .

and, as mentioned, it does not matter whether the contract was oral or written, they are equally as binding as long as the Statute of Frauds- which requires a writing or performance- does not apply and it would not in this situation. Most contracts have a series of “conditions” or perforamce occurences, each dependent on something else happening. So, Alvarez agreeing to sign was probably conditioned on a Bucs promise to pay 3 million up front, and the rest of the signing bonus is conditioned upon Alvarez showing up, with the whole contract conditioned on Alvarez passing a physical.

If Alvarez refuses to show, he’s in breach of contract. As mentioned earlier, he can’t be forced to show up, that is one form of equitable relief a court will not grant. But he can be enjoined from playing elsewhere and the Bucs could seek damages, although they would be hard to calculate and there may be a liquidated damages clause.

by Scranton on Aug 27, 2008 10:44 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Scranton

Thanks for the input. We probably could use your insight in the coming days because I think this issue is going to get much worse.

The guy has wasted 2 1/2 months of valuable time that he could have used to start his way up the ladder to the majors. I guess he didn`t learn much at Vanderbilt.

If he is so dissatisfied with the deal he got, he`s going to be nothing but trouble for the PBC.

by patthatt on Aug 27, 2008 11:11 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I just want to put this out there before I have to sign off

for the night.

If Boras contends that Alvarez doesn`t have a contract with the Pirates at present for whatever reason(s), then how can the MLBPA file a grievance on Alvarez`s behalf?

by patthatt on Aug 27, 2008 2:31 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Probably something about protecting the rights of a prospective member of their assoc.

by azibuck on Aug 27, 2008 4:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

They don't cover prospective members.

If they did, they’d have to let minor league players join.

The only reason the draft is included in the CBA at all is that it’s tied to free agent compensation, which does affect MLBPA members.

by Vlad on Aug 27, 2008 4:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Conspiracy theory alert / Calling RichieHebner

Curious what RH thinks. Semi-relatedly, my latest conspiracy theory:

RH said he thought Coonelly was going to operate the Pirates in such a way as to work with MLB to break the union (sorry if I misunderstood, that’s what I’m recalling without looking it up in old comments). But what if it’s Boras that breaks MLB? What if Boras is trying to exploit a loophole for Alvarez AND Hosmer, such that they become free agents (via the courts). They’ll either have to collectively bargain a close in the loophole, or the floodgates open, and huge money starts going to draft picks, or the draft is dissolved.

Or, OR! Coonelly orchestrated the whole thing to open those exact floodgates so that the NL will consist of NYM, PHI, LAD, and the Cubs, and the AL will consist of NYY, BOS, LAA, and DET, because that’s what MLB really wants.

Hey, I’m just firing from the hip. Don’t tell me I’m wrong, just call me crackpot (but I already know that, in this case.

by azibuck on Aug 27, 2008 4:10 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

No loophole

There are rules surrounding the deadline. If it’s a contract, it’s a contract, and they have to abide by it or go into default. If it’s not a contract, because the deadline passed without a deal, then it’s just like with Scheppers and every other player we didn’t sign: They all go back into the 2009 draft pool.

by Vlad on Aug 27, 2008 4:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

If there's anything underhanded here...

…it’s the Pirates trying to negotiate directly with Alvarez without Boras’s interference right before the deadline, and Boras trying to limit access to his client to prevent them from doing so, and then being petulant because they were at least partially successful in going behind his back (by listing figures in the media).

by Vlad on Aug 27, 2008 4:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs