Pirates Deal Chavez for Iwamura
The Post Gazette reports that Pittsburgh acquired 30-year-old IF Akinori Iwamura in exchange for RHP Jesse Chavez..
Iwamura is coming off a season in which he posted a .745 OPS before tearing his ACL. Chavez, 26, was one of the lone bright spots in the Pirate bullpen last year.
More from Charlie once he has better access to the internet.
UPDATE by Charlie: Iwamura seems like a perfectly reasonable answer at second base, but to give up a guy who was one of the team's only semi-reliable relievers and would have been under team control for several more years strikes me as a bit strange. Iwamura basically is Andy LaRoche but without the upside, and Pedro Alvarez will presumably be ready to play in early 2011 if not sometime in 2010, so this seems like a move aimed squarely at this year. Which seems like something everybody loves, but of course it doesn't make any sense at all for the Pirates to play for this year, since they just finished cleaning house a few months ago.
This isn't a huge deal, though, and Neal Huntington's stated explanation--basically, that relievers are fungible because their performance varies a lot--makes sense, to a degree. The odds are against Chavez developing into a consistently excellent reliever, especially since he wasn't all that impressive last year, even for a Pirate. I'd generally rather the Pirates didn't send off decent players with years of team control remaining, but I think I can live with it this time--second base was a big hole.
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I would like to ask all BD members
not to refer to Akinori Iwamura as “Aki” while he’s in a Bucco uniform.
It’s too feminine, regardless of what the people in the Tampa Bay organization thought the past 3 years.
Anyway, let’s hope he can be part of an improved PBC in 2010.
by patthatt on Nov 4, 2009 1:37 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Agreed
If we must have an Aki, I would prefer a 2 or 3 year deal for Aki Hoshino.
by maguro on Nov 4, 2009 9:31 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Maguro
I’ve been meaning to ask you: Is your user name one you picked because you like sushi-grade tuna or is it related to popular slang about a girl who is a boring, silent lay?
Just curious….
by patthatt on Nov 4, 2009 3:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
A bit of both really...
double entendres are more fun when almost no one understands them!
by maguro on Nov 4, 2009 3:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Surely worse!
How about WAM? from iWAMura?
or WAMU, if someone has a real soft spot for W.A.M.
by BurgherKing on Nov 4, 2009 1:19 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Do you have any suggestions?
What would be a better choice?
by Vlad on Nov 4, 2009 1:15 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Vlad et al.
I don’t want to be a pain in the arse about this so I’ll just finish by saying that he should be called by his real name, or maybe we could have a BD poll for a better nickname than “Aki”.
If there are any Japanese or Japanese-American members of BD who disagree with me, then please say so.
by patthatt on Nov 4, 2009 3:18 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
As noted below,
he already has one nickname: Gan-Chan.
I’d suggest that since we have our own “AI” now, we call him “The Answer.”
[/tongue/cheek]
Free your ass and your mind will follow.
by cocktailsfor2 on Nov 4, 2009 5:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah...but this "Answer"...
appears to be much more team-centered than the one currently neighbors with Elvis. Plays 18 minutes after missing the entire exhibition season…and thinks he should be starting.
by Thunder on Nov 4, 2009 10:25 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
how about
just Ak?
Jason
The Hanging Curve
by poorboywilly on Nov 4, 2009 11:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
what
If he choose 47. We could call him AK47
by Danatural08 on Nov 5, 2009 2:43 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
Already one of those...
playing for the Utah Jazz…Andrei Kurilenko.
by Thunder on Nov 6, 2009 7:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not sure how I feel about this.
I admittedly do not know a lot of AI, but we traded away a demographic that seems more valuable to us than what we got in return. Me wonders if this does not signal a phase change from building the minors at all costs to now trying to put some legitimate big leaguers on the roster who can be the “mortar” to the “bricks” we are developing and plan to have in the bigs soon.
By “bricks”, I am referring to Cutch, Milledge, Pedro, Sanchez, etc.
It will be interesting to see what approach is taken with the bullpen. I am fairly confident (and hopeful) that we will not throw a lot of money at the bullpen, but at the same time I’m not sure that a throw a whole bunch of options at the wall and see what sticks approach makes sense if there is no going to be a more serious emphasis on winning at the big league level.
I’m curious to read what the regulars who know more about AI think about him and the apparent shift to a new stage in building the franchise.
Good day.
by Uncle Nate on Nov 4, 2009 8:09 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
I don't like the deal
Why give up Chavez with years of control for a guy who would’ve been a free agent in a month or so??? Sign him then if you really want him. I would much rather see Andy LaRoche’s .270/15/70 @ 2nd next year.
It only makes sense to me if Iwamura plays 3rd till Alvarez comes up cause I’m not confident in Walker in anything more than a utility player.
by atfox25 on Nov 4, 2009 8:42 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Well, the natural explanation...
…would be that:
a) Iwamura could have been traded to someone else (like the Cubs, who were interested), rather than non-tendered, if we hadn’t made a move.
b) Iwamura could have chosen not to sign with us, as 99% of free agents do, once he was on the open market.
c) Iwamura could have required more money/years on a new deal than he did from just picking up the option.
by Vlad on Nov 4, 2009 8:59 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
IMHO, an OK Move
While I liked Chavez, he is replacable. Love to control him for a few years but what good is control if he does not perform? He could be rotten in 2010. Such is the randomness of bullpen guys.
IW looks like he will give us a major league 2B for at least next year. It will make our defense up the middle better than it was in the 2nd half of last year. Will Cedeno and IW be better than WIlson and Sanchez? Not sure the new guys will be better, but they might be as good.
Who cares about the $s? We dumped alot of salary over the last 2 years.
As for a signal, yea I think NH is now trying to form some stable base around which he can plug the youngsters as they develop. It does solve on big hole for next year at least.
by zogger on Nov 4, 2009 8:44 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
BTW
Akinori means “blue-green seaweed.” May also have other, idiomatic meanings.
by JRoth95 on Nov 4, 2009 9:22 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
This is why we really traded for him
I mean, I know if I were in NH’s shoes I would have jumped at this chance.
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Nov 4, 2009 9:50 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I’m sure everyone’s reading the P-G article on this, but NH lays it out:
“Our goal for 2010 is to be a better team,” Huntington said. “We’ve made a lot out of having years of control, and our hope is that this is more than a one-year fit for us and for Akinori. But our expectation in 2010 is to play better baseball and to win more games, and we felt like this was an opportunity for us to begin to turn the corner, to move in a positive direction not just below the major league level but at the top level, as well.”
Read more: http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/09308/1010654-63.stm#ixzz0VttsWTFQ
by JRoth95 on Nov 4, 2009 9:23 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Honestly, this is surprisingly effective in getting an extreme skeptic (me) on board with the 2010 team. The odds of 100 losses – let alone 110 – just went down a chunk. Furthermore, it signals a willingness to not just spend but actually put something out there in order to be better next year, before the main wave of MiL prospects arrives.
Add either 1-2 real relievers (not just shit thrown against the bullpen wall) or a solid RF, and I could see this team returning to respectability (presuming no regression from our SPs and hoping for impact from Lincoln or someone).
God, I’m so easy.
by JRoth95 on Nov 4, 2009 9:28 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The odds of 100 losses – let alone 110 – just went down a chunk.
I think this is a lot of what’s going on here. It’s one thing in the abstract to say you’re going to flush a season in order to rebuild, but they don’t have a blank slate here. They’ve lost 94+ games five years in a row. They have to start showing some short-term positive accomplishments and this is a way to do it without sacrificing longer term goals.
by WTM on Nov 4, 2009 10:03 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Exactly, plus there will be relievers available
when the non-tender wave hits the beach. I expect that the PBC will be active in trying to sign some relief pitching. There are a few internal candidates as well.
Viva Clemente!
by Roberto on Nov 4, 2009 11:20 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
One thing
no one’s really thinking about, and might only have a marginal affect. AI was playing in what is regarded as the best division in baseball. His career numbers are based on playing against elite pitching of Beckett, Sabathia, Halliday, Papelbon, and Rivera. Not that I think our divsion is a weak division at all, though the overall records don’t reflect that, but maybe the guy puts up a better than average year for himself playing in this division. I’m not sure if there is any way to prove this, that a player can put up better numbers playing in a slightly weaker division, but it just seems like that division is like the SEC and our division is the Big East
by Danatural08 on Nov 4, 2009 9:29 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
That’s a pretty good point. I think if last year’s Blue Jays were in the NL Central, they probably would have been the second best team and very well could have given the Cards a run for the money. The AL East is loaded…
by wickethewok on Nov 4, 2009 5:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Heh
I’ve taken to telling the football fans here in my Big East town that you know you’re regarded as a second-rate league when they tell your teams to play games on Friday night (or Thursdays — ACC, Boise State) or Tuesdays, or Wednesdays (CUSA, MAC etc.).
Nobody EVER asks Penn State/USC/Florida/Texas to play any day but Saturday until the bowls.
by bucdaddy on Nov 5, 2009 9:46 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Not that I care
But USC played (and lost) at Oregon State on a Thursday night last season.
Nevertheless, your point is largely valid.
Good day.
by Uncle Nate on Nov 5, 2009 10:57 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Except...
The SEC consistently plays alot on Thursday nights. Thursday night games are a lucrative revenue source and one of the easiest ways to gain exposure on a national level for recruits.
The glare of the spotlight is harsh, and the pressure that success breeds immense. We revere our heroes, but expect much. And criticism can come as easily as praise.
by glass0941 on Nov 5, 2009 11:04 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The guys above me said what I was going to say. So I’ll just say right now the Big East is better than the Big X regardless of when they want to play their games.
by TravisDW on Nov 5, 2009 12:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
This sets the table for a mid-2010 callup for Alvarez. Whatever reservations some have about LaRoche at 3B, we can mostly agree on his excellent glove work. Moving him to 2B would present two unknowns in the infield (2B & 3B). The Pirates pitching staff doesn’t post high K #s and their success is highly defense dependent. The 1B option for Alvarez remains viable if they choose and Jones can move to RF where he’s better suited. Or if Alvarez isn’t MLB-ready at 3B (or at all) they maintain some stability for 2010.
Agreed on the $s — I’m not into spending or saving $ for Nutting and this is an OK way to spend it for a team that’s realized major savings elsewhere. I just want to see good baseball moves. This is an upgrade over the bottom feeder approach to journeymen middle infielders NH would otherwise be forced to employ. I’m a little leary of Iwamura’s age and recent injury, but the Pirates can evaluate his health and performance before considering extending him. Give Iwamura credit for returning from a serious injury and playing pretty decently in a season where his team was out of contention.
by chicos_pants on Nov 4, 2009 10:27 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
I like the trade . . .
and while I understand Chavez was one of our more dependable relievers last season, i am surprised at the number of those who do not like the deal. I think NH made 2 really good points. 1. Relief pitchers are very volatile, their performance varies more than any other position from year to year (and even more likely in this instance as Chavez’s FIP weren’t as strong as his other numbers) and 2. 600 plate appearances is more valuable than 60 innings.
Of course, all of that would be moot if Iwamura was a junk player, but he plays solid D and probably puts up a line around .350/.390. Further, considering our lack of depth in the MI, it makes more sense. And I don’t think we have even detracted from our future a little. I think Iwamura has value for at least 3 more seasons and if inked to a 2 year, reasonable extension, he could possibly help in 2011 and 2012 when maybe we have a chance to do something. And, regardless of what Iwamura does, I doubt at any point over the next half-decade we will be lamenting the fact that we would have made the post-season if only we had Jesse Chavez.
by Scranton on Nov 4, 2009 11:05 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Perspective
It’s clear that many Pirates fans are over-rating Chavez. It is true that he was one of the best and most consistent relievers for the Pirates this year. But when you consider that the Pirates relief corps as a whole was absolutely awful – well, the best of a terrible lot doesn’t mean one is necessarily “good”. In reality, Chavez seemed better than he really was simply because almost everyone else around him was awful.
As others have pointed out, the stats show that Chavez was a below average relief pitcher. Not terrible mind you, but nothing remotely special. Could he get better? Sure. But it’s unlikely he’s ever more than an average middle reliever. Certainly noone to lose any sleep over losing.
by Wizard Imp on Nov 4, 2009 12:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Actually
he had a very good first half, aided by some low BABips. Then he kinda blew up in July/Aug. (Aug. in part because of a .341 BABip). He gave up six of his 11 HRs in Aug/Sept. Makes me wonder two things: Did he wear down pitching 71 games, or did the hitters catch on to his stuff? If it’s the former and he’s in a pen where he doesn’t have to pitch every other night, obvious he’ll be very useful, probably better than above-average. He pitched to 61 batters in August, far more than any other month, and to 51 in Sept., one fewer than the second-highest month. It certainly seemed to me at times that he was the only reliever JR thought he could rely on.
True again, this doesn’t make him “good,” but he certainly showed for relatively long stretches that he CAN be good.
by bucdaddy on Nov 5, 2009 9:56 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Patthatt
So you’re saying Aki is taki?
(BTW, God bless the Interwebs, we can have our own resident expert in Japanese baseball (or at least a knowledgable contributor).
by bucdaddy on Nov 4, 2009 11:43 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Ignore Tampa PR guys
His actual nickname is “Gan-Chan” which is the name of a famous anime character.
All I know about the guy is that he carries around 5 different IF gloves (all made of crocodile skin), skin) so he’s gotta be flexible.
Pencil him in as the regular 2B for next season and bat him 2nd or 8th.
by WstCstBucco on Nov 4, 2009 12:18 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Since I don't think it's been posted yet...
…the 2010 ZiPS for Iwamura is here. That projected him in Tampa’s park/league, so the numbers would probably move a tiny bit within our context, but it’s a good approximation of what to expect.
On the whole, looks solid to me.
by Vlad on Nov 4, 2009 12:19 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Not that it really matters....
Why would ZiPs have Iwamura getting more ABs on TB than Zobrist or Bartlett?
by haven on Nov 4, 2009 3:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Because it estimates future playing time...
…based on past playing time, rather than trying to guess who’s going to start (and how often). Zobrist had 501 AB last year, but only 674 in 2007 and 2008 combined.
Not sure why he’d be ahead of Bartlett, though.
by Vlad on Nov 4, 2009 6:05 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I asked Dan on a thread at Primer...
…and here’s what he said:
As an experiment, for playing time purposes, ZiPS assumes that hitters with a huge year-to-year drop in playing time and are above replacement level but with little or no drop in ability are injured and for playing time purposes only, takes those numbers into less account. The 707 PA is a larger-than-usual component for his expected playing time.
Injured hitter playing time recovers, on a year-to-year basis, far, far better than injured pitcher playing time.
As I noted, it’s an experiment this year. It’s not really a big deal, I’m primarily worried about projecting rates.
Link’s the same as the one three posts up with the projections in it.
by Vlad on Nov 4, 2009 7:01 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Beyond the Box Score Trade Calculator
“As many have been mentioning in analysis of this deal, when taken in a vacuum, the Pirates clearly came out a winner. Pittsburgh gets to fill a gaping hole at second base with a player who is more than capable of performing at or above league average level. The Pirates should be quite happy to have Iwamura on their team to replace Delwyn Young at second base.
The Rays appear to have gotten very little in return for Iwamura, but this was to be expected. They had a logjam in the infield and Iwamura’s $4.85M option was unlikely to be picked up. In order to salvage some value from him instead of paying his buyout and receiving nothing, the Rays turned the $500K they would have paid to have Iwamura leave and instead received an arbitration-controlled arm that could presumably be plugged into their bullpen at a slight discount. The Rays had little to no leverage and came out with another player on their roster who will make very little and the difference between the buyout and the rookie salary. It cannot be considered a win, but the Rays simply cannot be blamed. Call it a win-neutral, if you will."
http://www.beyondtheboxscore.com/2009/11/3/1113726/rays-hand-pirates-some-free-wins
by God Loves on Nov 4, 2009 12:21 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Well I don't know how much this hurt in the long run or help
but he could really help us for the next couple years. So I quess Adam isn’t headed to second anytime soon
"Polamalu’s lineage can be traced through several roots. Chuck Norris mated with an Amazon Queen, and on the other side, Tony Hawk mated with Mother Nature. The two children of these spawned and fused in a tantric love session to create Troy Polamalu. The mother however died as he tore through the birth canal with a spin move."
Mechem on the roots of Troy Polamalu
by WVPiratesfan on Nov 4, 2009 1:00 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
It should be Andy my bad
should have proofred that but I didn’t
"Polamalu’s lineage can be traced through several roots. Chuck Norris mated with an Amazon Queen, and on the other side, Tony Hawk mated with Mother Nature. The two children of these spawned and fused in a tantric love session to create Troy Polamalu. The mother however died as he tore through the birth canal with a spin move."
Mechem on the roots of Troy Polamalu
by WVPiratesfan on Nov 4, 2009 11:12 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Todd Ritchie Keeps on Giving
Ritchie for Kip Wells for Chavez for Aki…
by God Loves on Nov 4, 2009 2:16 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Inverted bell curve?
I wonder if NH will reverse the fortune of the franchise, and the franchise’s graph can be plotted along this line? The trade of Ritchie was a good one when it happened, but the connecting of these dots, if Iwamura can be flipped into something even better, and so on, might be interesting in a few years.
by azibuck on Nov 5, 2009 9:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Not sure this helps the Bucs "turn the corner"
First, a disclaimer:
a) I don’t care a whit about chavez
b) I’m not criticizing the Sanchez trade
c) I understand 2B was a black hole in the org
d) My post is solely in relation to any thought that this deal makes the bucs better in the coming season
How does Iwamura help the Pirates, in NH’s words, begin to “turn the corner”? I know that’s standard GM spin, but it rings a little hollow.
Simply put, the team was awful with Sanchez at 2B, even though he performed reasonably well for the Bucs, with numbers comparable to AI’s. Lord knows, Young sucked at 2B. So, no problem with NH making an upgrade, but my point is, it’s an upgrade only above Young. Not a noticeable upgrade (and maybe not an upgrade at all over Sanchez). The point is, any Iwamura-related improvement is likely just back to the Sanchez level, and the team was dreadful with Sanchez.
Perhaps the reports on Luigi’s 2B progress in Florida were not hopeful. Lord knows Delwyn Young couldn’t cut it. So, the Pirates got a serviceable second baseman. That’s fine. Maybe AI will have a better than average (for him) year while playing for a contract; in fact, maybe that’s what NH is hoping, so he’ll have a trade deadline chip to deal for a serviceable prospect. Or, dare to dream, AI plays himself to a Type A level and we get a sandwich pick.
by mocasdad on Nov 4, 2009 4:04 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Based on What Friedman Said
Pittsburgh has been all over this for a month and…
And Huntington, who said – We scouted AI through this past September.
I don’t think it was a short sighted decision. Obviously, the Bucs needed to spend some $‘s (though not $10mm on 1 guy) and we had a huge hole at 2b. Other options to fill the position were Type A FA’s or Uggla types, which would have been more $’s or draft picks.
I think it’s a reasonable decision given the circumstance. We all thought the Buc’s had no trade chips left, yet we traded a guy for a good starting 2b with decent on-base skills. We received good value for not much cost.
Hard to question that decision, in my opinion.
by God Loves on Nov 4, 2009 4:45 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
He's not bringing back any picks.
We aren’t allowed to offer him arb, which is a prerequisite for receiving draft compensation.
Pedro isn’t going to be ready for the majors at the start of the year, so we need a 2B and a 3B for at least the first half of the season, and LaRoche can’t cover both at the same time. Thus, we needed to bring in another infielder.
Sure, Iwamura is not in and of himself going to make the team into a winner. But you could clone Pujols twice, give us all three, and we still wouldn’t win any titles. If you wait for one big move to turn everything around, you’re going to be waiting a long time.
by Vlad on Nov 4, 2009 6:08 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
gotcha on the arb thing
So, deadline trade is the only option for a prospect, and that’s a thin reed.
As for three Alberts in the lineup – I think I’d take my chances with that.
Look, I think it’s an okay trade, and I tried (apparently failed) to make that clear. NH had created a sucking wound at 2B, but we were all fine with that, given FS’ age, injury history, etc., plus the return. With this deal, we’re back to the FS level of competence.
As noted, no tears for Chavez. My ONLY point was related NH’s suggestion that this somehow represents a competitive upgrade for team that, when it had essentially the same player before, was solidly in last place.
Of course, if we see upward arcs from Cutch, Milledge, and Luigi, a bounceback from Doumit, avoidance of crash and burns by Jones and Cedeno, and reasonable consistency from the SPs, it won’t hurt to also have a competent 2B.
by mocasdad on Nov 6, 2009 5:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
not questioning the trade
just any notion that it will have a meaningful impact.
Bucs bad with sanchez; AI roughly = FS
Upgrade over young? of course. Upgrade in standings? Dubious.
by mocasdad on Nov 4, 2009 5:00 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
What is "meaningful"?
If we win three more games this year with Iwamura than we would’ve won with Young, then why is that meaningless? He isn’t blocking anybody, so it’s a painless upgrade, and he’s likely to deliver a Freddy-equivalent performance for less money (with us upgrading from Chavez to Alderson in the bargain). What’s not to like?
by Vlad on Nov 4, 2009 6:10 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
if I re-jig my thinking
I can kind of see what you’re getting at. But the thing is: Freddy isn’t coming back and hopefully Alderson will bring the goods for a few years to come.
Another question is how many of those losses could we have avoided if Freddy’s bat and glove was in the lineup all those games?
I think the point the FO was making was that we shouldn’t have another 99 loss season next year – assuming all else remains equal.
by BlindSquirrel on Nov 4, 2009 7:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
This might help improve our run production
My thought would be to have someone like him be on base in front of the someone like Garret Jones so He could actually drive in someone other than himself everytime he hits a homerun lol.
Of Course, Jones would have to improve his batting with RISP.
It’s no secret that our run production dropped after we made a ton of the trades midseason, so…I think NH was happy with our Starting pitching, but offensively we needed someone to play 2nd, and hit for decent average and steal some bases until the youngsters come up
by lfhlaw on Nov 5, 2009 12:30 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Sanchez = AI
It’s debatable who the better player is, Sanchez or AI, but this move makes the Sanchez look even better. If Sanchez = AI, then essentially, the Bucs got Alderson and 4 million dollars for Chavez. Even with Alderson’s loss of velocity, he is still far more valuable than Chavez. It makes it look like the front office almost knows what they are doing. I think Aki is a better player if only that his value isn’t as dependent on batting average as Sanchez’s. If Sanchez has an unlucky low BABIP, he’s almost worthless.
by uneasy rider on Nov 5, 2009 7:59 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Some thoughts...
If we can keep Akinori Iwamura on the field and he plays well over 120-130 starts, it will make us a better team than what we finished the year with at second base for sure.
If we can get Andy LaRoche to hit with more consistency and produce more power next season at third base, we will see some improvement with the team.
Can we get reasonable production at the plate and in the field from Ronny Cedeno?
If Pedro Alvarez comes up June/July timeframe and performs well at the plate, maybe with the above scenario working out he spends most of his time at first base.
Garrett Jones plays a lot of right field in 2010 if his bat shows up again.
Cutch in center.
Mostly Milledge in left.
Moss and Young get most of the backup ABs.
Doumit as the primary catcher til the inevitable breakdown.
I’ll believe Jose Tabata gets a lot of time in Pittsburgh next season when I’ve actually seen him there and he’s stayed healthy for an extended period of time. (And the people around him don’t get him involved in something illegal.)
by patthatt on Nov 4, 2009 5:30 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
hmm
so we seem to be moving away from dealing doumit… i strongly expect it to happen this winter… well, maybe not so much, if NH thinks he has a shot at a respectable finish…
the lineup does look almost major league, if GFJ continues to hit… I can see a Clement/Pearce platoon at 1st till/if Alvarez comes up, and if he does indeed go to 1B. Doumit is definitely an upgrade over JJ and Diaz, but given his susceptibility to injuries, NH might want to deal him this winter, rather than risk a May injury…
Cutch, Iwamura, GFJ, Edge(?), Clement/Pearce, Doumit, LaRoche, Cedeno, P- not a terrible lineup…
by BurgherKing on Nov 4, 2009 5:45 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Will Clement come up?
After last year’s swoon, he’d better hit well in ST to go the majors when camp breaks.
by lfhlaw on Nov 5, 2009 12:31 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
A point about Akinori Iwamura's defense-
I wouldn’t get too worked up about him winning 6 Gold Gloves in Japan at third base. Let’s keep in mind that he was competing against at best only 5 other guys in the Central League each year.
I did think he was a pretty good defender at the hot corner in NPB, but I think his stats in MLB the past two years at second base are more important now.
Let’s see how his knees hold up next year. He may be only 31 in February, but there’s a lot of wear and tear on his body from playing full-time in NPB and MLB from a very young age.
Some of you might not know that Iwamura hit a combined 106 HRs his last 3 seasons (2004-2006) in Japan, with 2 100+ RBI seasons.
by patthatt on Nov 4, 2009 5:55 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Where’d the home runs go? Is there really a large difference in power output in the Japan league compared to MLB, or is it just Iwamura getting older/more banged up?
by Adam Reynolds on Nov 5, 2009 4:04 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The former.
Japanese parks are, in general, smaller than parks in MLB.
by Vlad on Nov 5, 2009 8:50 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah,
the ballparks tend to be somewhat smaller, but not as much the bandboxes they used to be.
Off the top of my head, 7 of the 12 teams also play in domes which I think helps.
I’m not going to look up the specifics, but I recall that Iwamura’s home stadium was really short down the lines-around 90 meters(294 feet)-and was expanded a little the year after he left.(Roberto Petagine and Alex Ramirez got some unbelievable cheapies during their time with the Yakult Swallows.)
When Hideki Matsui came to the U.S. and didn’t hit for anywhere near the power he hit for in his last year in Japan-50 HRs in about 140 games-he was asked about it and I remember him commenting somewhat along the lines that it was harder to get the ball “squared up” for HRs in the majors because the velocity and movement of big league pitchers were better overall than in Japan.
I also recall another Japanese player in the majors-I think Tadahito Iguchi-saying something along the lines that it’s more difficult in the majors to face the level of pitching that you do on a daily basis for the longer grind of the big league season. I guess you could say that the top-level guys in Japan like Matsui, Iguchi and some others-could take a break from time to time facing inferior pitchers.
Iguchi played for the Chiba Lotte Marines this season for Bobby V and here is a list of foreign pitchers he probably faced in the CL:
John Wasdin, Jonah Bayliss, Alex Graman, Ryan Vogelsong, Jon Leicester, Brian Sweeney, Darrell Rasner, Marcus Gwyn, Matt Childers, Kameron Loe, Brian Falkenborg, Justin Germano and Dennis Houlton.
Sometimes it happens that guys who don’t pan out in MLB go on to improve in Japan for a variety of reasons, but I think only Dave Littlefield would put together a pitching staff with the cast of characters above.
by patthatt on Nov 5, 2009 10:59 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Cubs fan coming to congratulate you guys on acquiring a player that i would have loved to see on the Cubs at 2B next year. Nice pickup.
by Gleebo on Nov 4, 2009 11:34 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Also, sorry about you guys ending up with Ronny Cedeno…im not sure what your organization was doing during the years he played against you on the Cubs but it obviously wasn’t watching Ronny Cedeno attempt to play baseball.
by Gleebo on Nov 4, 2009 11:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Cedeno's actually been pretty good for us so far.
But thanks for the positive wishes, anyway.
by Vlad on Nov 5, 2009 8:50 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Just a couple of weeks ago......
the talk was about moving Andy LaRoche to 2nd base,and how he was fine with the idea and would do anything to help the team. Then this trade for a 31 yr-old middle inf who will be a free agent after next season? Not sure I get it. Iwamura is a solid player,when healthy,but the move kind of echoes the fuzzy-headed things the Pirates have done for so long now.
Is the thinking keep LaRoche at third,and move Alvarez to first? That would make more sense to me.
by havildar on Nov 5, 2009 9:00 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
LaRoche probably still will be moving to 2B.
Just not until Pedro’s ready. Which he won’t be until at least the middle of the year. So we still needed a 2B or a 3B until then, because Andy can’t play both positions at the same time.
by Vlad on Nov 5, 2009 9:57 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Nothing wrong with having options
It’s OK to acquire players, and see how things shake out.
Will Luigi handle 2B well, and will he also progress offensively to the point of meeting his expectations?
Will Iwamura be back to 100% physically and produce like he did in 2008?
Will Pedro dominate AAA like we think he will? I’m not sure it’s an absolute guarantee he comes up this summer. I’d like to see him rake in Indy before coming up.
by biggyv on Nov 5, 2009 10:42 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Plus Andy seems to respond to competition
When Walker was called up, he got his head out of his you know what and turned on the green light. If nothing else, Andy (who has been learning 2B in instructional league) sees that if he doesn’t perform out of the gate in 2010, he might not get another shot at a starting gig in MLB.
If Andy performs and can move to 2B when Alvarez is called up in June or July, then he gets the 2B job and Aki is shipped out. Otherwise, LaRoche heads to the bench and Huntington approaches Aki about an extension.
Options are good. There are more positive outcomes possible.
by MarkInDallas on Nov 6, 2009 3:59 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Trade LaRoche?
It seems like LaRoche is on the outs with Huntingdon and that he’s just holding a spot for Alvarez. With a ton of 3B on the free agent market and the certainty that the Pirates own the cellar again next year, does anyone think they’ll shop LaRoche for a good middle infield prospect or otherwise and look to bring in a vet on a 1 year deal to fill 3d?
by BucsInNLEast on Nov 6, 2009 4:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I think you're reaching.
I’m sure they’d trade LaRoche for the right offer, but I’m sure they’d do the same for anyone, so that’s not really significant.
by Vlad on Nov 6, 2009 5:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
“…It seems like LaRoche is on the outs …”
What leads you to this conclusion? Evidence? Links?
Also – who on this list are you thinking might be a good singing?
Free Agent 3B, according to MLBTR:
Rich Aurilia (38)
Brian Barden (29)
Adrian Beltre (31) – Type B
Wilson Betemit (28)
Aaron Boone (37)
Craig Counsell (39)
Joe Crede (32)
Bobby Crosby (30)
Mark DeRosa (35) – Type B
Pedro Feliz (35) – $5MM club option with a $500K buyout
Chone Figgins (32) – Type B
Nomar Garciaparra (36)
Troy Glaus (33) – Type B
Adam Kennedy (34)
Mike Lamb (34)
Mark Loretta (38)
Melvin Mora (38) – Type B
Pablo Ozuna (35)
Robb Quinlan (33)
Miguel Tejada (36) – Type A
Juan Uribe (31)
Free your ass and your mind will follow.
by cocktailsfor2 on Nov 6, 2009 9:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Or, instead of "singing," signing...
Free your ass and your mind will follow.
by cocktailsfor2 on Nov 6, 2009 9:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Would you settle...
…for a singing catcher?
by Vlad on Nov 8, 2009 6:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It seems though.....
that the Pirates need to start establishing players at positions,with not so much mix-and-match all the time.
by havildar on Nov 5, 2009 2:13 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
what if he does?
So what if Chavez develops into a consistently reliable reliever? That’s what, 1 WAR per year? That’s easily replaceable. And that’s only if he develops. Right now he’s a 26-year-old replacement-level pitcher. Any time you can get a 2-2.5 WAR player (with a cheap contract) for a replacement-level player with 1 WAR upside, I think you do it, even if it’s only for one season and even if that one season is still very likely to include 90 losses. It’s not like this means we’re “playing for this year.” It’s just a smart upgrade. I’d feel differently if Aki were going to block someone, but 2b was the one position that we don’t have an adequate young player. If LaRoche can play the 2b, Aki can slide right on over to third until Alvarez is ready. This is really a great trade for the Bucs, and the remote possibility that Chavez turns into an elite reliever at some point shouldn’t distract us from how much we upgraded with this trade.
by epoc on Nov 5, 2009 2:47 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
al
for minimal cost we acquired a player who can fit any role 3b, ss, 2nd. he is a quality player who atleast can hit for average IMO. with the upside has a great glove, leadership and a great spirit. i say we call him tanaka after the movie guy. NO MARBLES!
by karreemofwhite on Nov 5, 2009 7:07 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Benefit of the doubt
My concerns are similar to Charlie’s but overall I am ok with the deal. I think that the front office may know something we don’t know. It did seem like down the stretch NL hitters caught up to his fastball. Maybe, they do not see him ever developing his secondary pitch and considering his fastball seems pretty straight it might be the right move. Iwamura is clearly a stop gap and giving up on a potential quality reliever seems dumb, but I’ll give NH the benefit of the doubt and only time will give us the answer.
by kjcity520 on Nov 6, 2009 2:45 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
When there's an outcry that we gave up one of our relievers that didn't completely suck
Rather than ask how is that possible, we should ask why we want a reliever who is only better than horrible. We need to find actual good relievers, and Chavez isn’t likely to become that.
by MarkInDallas on Nov 6, 2009 4:06 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
I think I can sum up my feelings this way:
If it means we never ever seen Brian Bixler in a Pirates uniform again, I’m all over it.
by bucdaddy on Nov 6, 2009 10:11 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
On a fannish level, I'd rather toss Bixler
Neither one is a good player, but at least Cruz is a positive guy with a realistic assessment of his own abilities. All that poor-me bullshit last year about Bixler being discriminated against because he’s a Littlefield product really rubbed me the wrong way.
by Vlad on Nov 6, 2009 12:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I hear you...
although I thought it was Walker doing the crying and he included Bix as an example. Either way, I want be sad when he is off the roster. Kind of funny that with all of the house cleaning NH has done there is still a lot of crap on the roster.
by Slick1 on Nov 6, 2009 1:07 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You can’t make up for over a decade of ineptitude in just two seasons.
I made most of my life decisions at a Foghat concert... I stand by them.
by Chester J Lampwick on Nov 6, 2009 1:54 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Of course, the other upside is that players may be more attracted to a 70s win team on the rise than a 100 loss team. Every bit helps even next year.
by Adam Reynolds on Nov 6, 2009 9:36 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
A LOT TO DO ABOUT NOTHING
either fold the team or kick the owner out of Pitt. What a pathetic operation.
by PICKLEDICK on Nov 7, 2009 1:17 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
What would a person have in their head that they came up with the name “PICKLEDICK” to represent themselves? Not much I guess.
by MDBuc on Nov 7, 2009 5:12 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

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