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Around SBN: Jeff Sullivan's MLB Trade Deadline Primer

Pirates Lose Luis Cruz, Sign Vinnie Chulk

The Pirates have signed reliever Vinnie Chulk to a minor league deal, and have lost Luis Cruz to the Brewers on a waiver claim.

I like the addition of Chulk, who I identified a while back as one of the more interesting minor league free agents. He'll pitch next year at 31, and there's really no reason to think he can't be solidly mediocre. That sounds mean, but "solidly mediocre" is a good thing for a minor league signing to be, especially in a bullpen that's been solidly terrible over the past year. There's really nothing special about Chulk--he doesn't strike out too many batters, but he strikes out enough. His ERAs aren't low, but they aren't terribly high either. He's not young, but he's not old. He had shoulder issues in 2008, but he wasn't shut down for too long. You can joke if you like about his not even being able to stick in 2009 with a terrible Indians bullpen, but he still looks like a better bet than a lot of the relief possibilities the Pirates already had.

As for Cruz, he obviously has a big-league glove, but that means nothing without some hitting ability. If major league rosters were 35 deep instead of 25, he'd be a useful bench player, but on a 25-man roster he's as bad a misuse of resources as, say, a pinch-running specialist. Cruz posted a .274 OBP last year in AAA, and apart from a fluky burst of offense in a brief sample at Indianapolis in 2008, has never shown much with the stick. The Pirates won't miss him, and they should be able to sign a Cruz-like player this winter without having to use a roster spot.

UPDATE: The Bucs have also removed Jeff Sues from the 40-man roster and sent him to Indianapolis. This is no surprise, since he had a disappointing season and is only a reliever to begin with. There are two spots open on the 40-man, so I'd expect some action in the upcoming Rule 5 draft.

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Interesting.

Wonder who they’ll take. NY doesn’t have a lot of room for developmental projects on their roster.

by Vlad on Dec 7, 2009 6:50 PM EST up reply actions  

They need help in the pen...

so I’d guess they go with Pino (I think that’s spelled right) from the Tribe. He appears to be the most major league ready. I’d be ok with that. We’d be free to get Rodrigues or the flame thrower from he Marlins.

by Slick1 on Dec 7, 2009 7:18 PM EST up reply actions  

I didn’t know you could trade rule 5 draft picks. I actually probably knew that and had just forgotten.

I made most of my life decisions at a Foghat concert... I stand by them.

by Chester J Lampwick on Dec 7, 2009 8:20 PM EST up reply actions  

I think the Nationals will officially pick the player for the Yankees, and trade him for Bruney, if I’m not mistaken.

by biggyv on Dec 7, 2009 8:31 PM EST up reply actions  

That makes more sense.

I need to get some sleep if I ever hope to figure out the rule 5 system.

I made most of my life decisions at a Foghat concert... I stand by them.

by Chester J Lampwick on Dec 7, 2009 9:02 PM EST up reply actions  

I think what they did was trade a PTBNL. They probably have some side agreement or something that says they’ll pick so-and-so, then he’ll be the PTBNL.

by WTM on Dec 7, 2009 9:08 PM EST up reply actions  

I would guess that this works because the Rule 5 player is currently under contract, whereas a Rule 4 pick is not. The choosing team in Rule 4 would have to negotiate with the pick, there’s no guarantee that you can get the player to sign, and the third party is not allowed to negotiate the contract.

by MarkInDallas on Dec 7, 2009 10:10 PM EST up reply actions  

You’re actually not allowed to trade a Rule 4 pick or international signing until a year after he signs anyway.

by ElDuce on Dec 7, 2009 10:29 PM EST up reply actions  

I guess that’s how they assure that’s not going to happen.

by MarkInDallas on Dec 7, 2009 11:45 PM EST up reply actions  

Pirates also outrighted Jeff Sues to Indy. Jen Langosch says he cleared waivers.

by ElDuce on Dec 7, 2009 6:13 PM EST reply actions  

Other notes

The Pirates lost out on Adam Everett who resigned with the Tigers and now probably will step up their efforts to sign Bobby Crosby. Crosby is still a solid defensive SS but other than a big rookie year has never produced much offense. Last season he played more at 1B than any other position for Oakland.

Also it’s being reported that as many as four teams are engaged in discussions with the Buccos about Ryan Doumit.

by Brakeman8 on Dec 7, 2009 7:20 PM EST reply actions  

"Lost out?"

Not the wording I’d choose. “Dodged a bullet” comes to mind.

by WTM on Dec 7, 2009 8:17 PM EST up reply actions  

I don’t know if they’re dodging a bullet if they end up with Crosby though.

by biggyv on Dec 7, 2009 8:34 PM EST up reply actions  

Is this what “crossfire” means?

by WTM on Dec 7, 2009 9:00 PM EST up reply actions  

If Crosby is still a defensive shortstop and the two most interested teams are the Bucs and Rockies, you figure we should have the inside track.

by Adam Reynolds on Dec 7, 2009 11:41 PM EST up reply actions  

if we miss crosby

i d say the same thing WTM did about Everett…

I really don;t know what Crosby brings that Vazquez doesn’t…

by BurgherKing on Dec 8, 2009 12:08 AM EST up reply actions  

we already have a glove-only prospect alex gonzalez out there…

by taiwania on Dec 8, 2009 10:55 PM EST up reply actions  

Argenis Diaz

sorry i meant the prospect is argenis diaz who is compared to alex gonzalez.

by taiwania on Dec 9, 2009 12:15 AM EST up reply actions  

I think the Pirates...

would like to see Diaz hit over .200 in AAA before they promote him.

by Slick1 on Dec 9, 2009 12:25 AM EST up reply actions  

Yeah.

It’s easy to conflate a guy like Crosby and a guy like Diaz under the same heading of “bad hitters”, but the reality of it is that Diaz is probably as far from being able to match Crosby’s level of offense as Crosby is from being a league-average starter.

by Vlad on Dec 9, 2009 9:29 AM EST up reply actions  

You'd think bulk pitching

like Chulk would be easy to find. Plenty of guys around who aren’t particularly good or bad, aren’t there? The definition of mediocrity.

And yet as we’ve seen over the years, especially out of our No. 5 rotation spot where even mediocrity would have been a vast improvement, it’s not. And the same could be said for a lot of teams (how many have average starters at No. 5? For how many is the last guy in the pen merely average, much less if you’re the Bucs and you can’t go 2-3 deep in the pen without covering your eyes?).

For this reason, as I keep insisting, mediocrity has value. Anybody who is better than the worst guy you have has value to you. Mediocrity in the majors still puts you among the best 400-500 pople in your profession, and better than all the rest.

by bucdaddy on Dec 8, 2009 9:33 AM EST reply actions  

If you had GUARANTEED mediocrity, that would be one thing.

But a lot of the guys who were awful last year looked like good bets to be mediocre… right up until the point when they fell apart or blew up.

Pitchers are fragile and flaky. There’s always going to be some risk of disaster.

by Vlad on Dec 8, 2009 9:49 AM EST up reply actions  

And relievers are worse

Because they only have a handful of pitches to be effective. A starter can throw 35 bad pitches and still get straightened out and be pretty effective; a reliever has maybe 10 pitches to get himself right, and if he were as talented enough to be an SP, he would be.

I wonder how many guys stay in the top 20 and top 40 relievers year after year. For the top 20, I’d expect no more than 10 guys to be there for, say, a given 3 year stretch, but I wonder about the top 40 – I could see a lot of turnover, or maybe just churn (a guy going from #10 to #30 to #22) among consistently decent guys.

by JRoth95 on Dec 8, 2009 11:40 AM EST up reply actions  

talks heating up

Per Dejan, we are talking to several teams about Doumit, but Toronto in particular. Also, we are close to a deal with Bobby Crosby.

Not enough info to comment on dealing Doumit. Crosby does not excite me in anyway, however.

Good day.

by Uncle Nate on Dec 8, 2009 3:51 PM EST reply actions  

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