Navigation: Jump to content areas:


Pro Quality. Fan Perspective.
Login-facebook
Around SBN: Jeremy Lin And How The Pac-12 Missed Him

Left Fielder Batting Ninth: Does Not Compute

I realize my seeming obsession with Nyjer Morgan is probably at least as awkward as Morgan himself sliding past second base, but I just can't let it go. Not really because of Morgan per se--he's a terrible hitter and he hasn't figured out how to turn his speed into an asset on the bases, but he might be better defensively than I've given him credit for, and I suppose there are probably worse fifth outfielders out there. And yet I keep talking about him, because in my view, there's no other player on the team whose contributions, or lack thereof, are more misunderstood. I actually dislike Morgan less than you might think, but I persist here because a very interesting player to write about.

Take John Perrotto's post about Morgan batting ninth. Perrotto's a smart guy and I enjoy reading his writing for Baseball Prospectus, but when I see something like this I have to shake my head:

While Russell says it is too early in the spring to begin thinking about how the Pirates’ 2009 batting order will look like, the composition of the probable starting lineup suggests he could very well hit the pitcher eighth again this season.

If Nyjer Morgan wins the starting left fielder’s job, he would be the ideal No. 9 hitter, particularly if center fielder Nate McLouth bats leadoff. Putting Morgan and McLouth back-to-back in the order would give the Pirates good speed and the chance to greatly improve upon last seasons’ 57 stolen bases, which ranked 15th in the 16-team National League.

In some alternate reality in which Morgan were, say, 22 years old and the best defensive shortstop in the history of the planet, I'd have no problem with this. If a guy has no real offensive skills (and again, that's pretty much just a statement of fact and I've already beaten that particular dead horse many times, so I won't flog it again here), doesn't get on base much, and can't do much more than run fast, but there are still incredibly compelling reasons to put him in the lineup, then sure--bat him ninth. Morgan, for all his speed, hasn't been a particularly good basestealer overall in either the minors or the majors, because he runs into so many outs that it offsets the value of his steals. He did, however, steal 44 bases against only eight times caught at Indianapolis last year (even though he did steal only nine against five times caught in the big leagues). So maybe, if he's 22, you look at those numbers and think he's on the cusp of turning his speed into an actual skill.

Unfortunately, Morgan isn't 22, and at 28 (29 in July) he's much more likely to lose a step than to get faster. The number of stolen bases is not an issue, because stolen bases are of limited value even when they're stolen efficiently, and Morgan isn't terribly likely to steal them efficiently. And unfortunately, he's not the greatest defensive shortstop in the history of the planet. He's going to play left field. I know PNC has a big left field, but that simply is not a very important position, which is why teams tend to stick sluggers who can't play defense there. The average left fielder makes about two plays per nine innings. Jason Bay, as the primary left fielder in PNC the last few years, averaged around that same number. The majority of those are routine plays that don't require a defensive specialist. (The average shortstop makes more than twice as many plays per game, and many of those are much harder.) So your left fielder really needs to be someone who can hit.

A few years ago I had a phone that required the use of an AC adapter. I picked an adapter with the wrong voltage. It fit, but when I plugged it in, smoke poured out. "Left field" and "No. 9 hitter" simply do not belong together, at least not if your ideas about what an "ideal No. 9 hitter" is supposed to be used are at all traditional. If your left fielder will fit into the No. 9 spot in your lineup, smoke will pour out. If you'd even consider making your left fielder your No. 9 hitter, especially if your offense is as weak as the Pirates', then you picked the wrong left fielder, and you won't even be able to call for help, because your phone will be broken.

Comment 26 comments  |  0 recs  | 

Do you like this story?

Comments

Display:

If Nyjer Morgan wins the starting left fielder’s job, he would be the ideal No. 9 hitter

I think that says all you need to know about Nyjer Morgan.

by WTM on Feb 20, 2009 10:28 PM EST reply actions  

*

In the last two years he’s stolen at a 79 percent clip between AAA and MLB. Losing a step isn’t really relevant. Speed is a tool, base-stealing is a skill. He may in fact still be honing that skill.

And everybody (sweeping generalization) likes to point out how OBP is more valuable than SLG until it’s Nyjer Morgan. Sure, it’s BA-driven, but…

He’s hit less than .286 once in his pro career.

I understand why others would disagree, but he is the most appropriate candidate to at least open the season starting in LF. I’ll be disappointed if he’s more than a placeholder.

I think you need to move past the Tracy era when he buried McLouth in favor of Morgan. Morgan isn’t holding anyone back.

Apropos of nothing, he doesn’t strike out like Bixler and is a better defender.

Not afraid to lean into one.

*This post is not an endorsement of Nyjer Morgan or any of his subsidiaries.

by azibuck on Feb 21, 2009 12:04 AM EST reply actions  

Morgan’s been about 3-4 years too old for every level he’s played at. He should have dominated, but instead he’s been just pretty good. The numbers don’t mean much by themselves.

by WTM on Feb 21, 2009 11:36 AM EST up reply actions  

Madness

“Y’see madness, as you know, is like gravity. All it needs is a little. . . push.” The Joker in The Dark Knight

Morgan is blocking Pearce, btw. He’s holding him back. Management has made it clear that Pearce is ticketed to Indianapolis no matter what he does. Right now he’s also holding back Hinske. That’s a guaranteed 20+ HR hitter being blocked by Nyjer, a guaranteed 0-1 HR guy. But who wants power from a LF?

If we’re lucky, we might get to watch Morgan block Cutch in a few months.

Nyjer Morgan is nothing but a sane Chris Duffy.

“This is madness.” C3PO.in Star Wars

by WstCstBucco on Feb 21, 2009 1:11 AM EST reply actions  

madness?

“This is Spartaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!” – King Leonidis in 300

by johnnycuff on Feb 21, 2009 2:29 AM EST up reply actions  

Nyjer Morgan is...

Pirates management’s biggest “excuse” for keeping Cutch and Pearce in AAA to start the season. They want us to wait until those two are “ready”. Definition of ready…1) When we can get an extra year out of Cutch…2) Pearce hits .380 at Indy with 20 HR by the middle of June. In other words…Morgan plays until it’s absolutely impossible to ignore Cutch and Pearce…even for a blind man.

I got rid of my MLB.TV subscription for this season for this type of idiocy. It’s not about having the best talent out there. Between that, and steroids, and the Yankees unbridled spending, I’m frustrated. I will follow the Pirates avidly, but I’m not giving MLB $130 of hard earned money this season. Maybe if more people express their frustration with their wallets…MLB (and the Pirates) will wake up.

by Thunder on Feb 21, 2009 11:56 AM EST up reply actions  

Funny stuff

Pearce hits .380 at Indy with 20 HR by the middle of June.

Why didn’t he do that last year?

by azibuck on Feb 21, 2009 1:00 PM EST up reply actions  

He is not blocking Pearce, Pearce is blocking Pearce

Nyjer’s bats are not afraid of magic curving balls, Pearce’s are. What “management has made clear” is that Pearce has to be able to handle a steady diet of breaking balls, and so far he hasn’t. That’s why he’s going to AAA. It’s got nothing to do with Morgan.

Hinske? We’ll see. I don’t know how you end up “blocking” a guy that was just signed.

*I’m compelled to note that I’m looking on the bright side, trying to use actual stats and facts. I’m not a member of the NyMo fan club.

by azibuck on Feb 21, 2009 12:57 PM EST up reply actions  

No...Nyjer isn't blocking Pearce...

he’s an excuse to not play those players (Pearce, Cutch, Tabata, etc) more able to contribute to a winning team. You can always find a reason to keep someone on the farm if you don’t want them in the majors. There aren’t too many players that have ALL facets of their game major league ready…and most of them…even in the majors…NEVER have all of their tools developed.

Is Morgan at least in the top 3 most talented outfielders in the Pirates organization (current talent level, not projected)?? If he is…we’re in deep trouble. He should not be starting…but it appears he will.

On a somewhat related subject…why place Morgan in left…if he’s such a good outfielder? If the Pirates management actually expects Cutch to take a regular spot before the end of the season…one would assume it’s in CF. Why not move Nate to LF now, and let him get used to playing it. If Morgan’s defense is that great…put him in CF. Oh yeah…that’s right…his defense isn’t strong enough to play CF…that’s why Nate is there.

I’ve seen enough of players like Juan Pierre and Michael Bourn…and Morgan is a similar player (talents and/or lack of). There’s a reason Pierre is sitting the bench in LA…and if the Astros had a halfway capable outfielder other than Pence…Bourn wouldn’t be playing either. If Morgan’s not hitting .320 with an OBP of about .380…his lack of frequent success baserunning and poor defense will cancel out anything else.

by Thunder on Feb 21, 2009 1:41 PM EST up reply actions  

Wrong again.

Nyjer is not the excuse. The excuse is that those players are not ready and rushing them to the big league too soon could ruin their development and possibly destroy what we all hope is a bright future. Quite frankly I believe they are giving Nyjer a chance to see what he can do in the hopes he will generate some trade value and can be dealt when Pearce or Cutch show they are ready. The beauty of the Hinske signing is that he can get more at bats shouuld Morgan totally flops like most of expect he will.

by Slick1 on Feb 21, 2009 2:33 PM EST up reply actions  

Why place Morgan in LF

Because he could tank badly, or he could end up part of a platoon, but Nate will play every day. So why jerk Nate back and forth between LF and CF this year. I don’t think Cutch will be up early, so just let Nate be the CF and then no one has to wonder who’s where in any given day’s lineup.

It’s a minor thing, but it makes sense on a couple levels.

by azibuck on Feb 21, 2009 10:47 PM EST up reply actions  

I disagree. Morgan is WORSE than a sane Chris Duffy. Chris Duffy was young when he was in the Major Leagues. He had actual upside, it just didn’t come to fruition. Morgan is not young. He has no upside, and he’s blocking Pearce, a player who does.

I have no problem with Morgan. In fact, I actually kind of like him as a fifth or even fourth outfielder. I just have a big problem with him starting when there’s an actual prospect fading in AAA.

www.sixtyftsixin.com

by Sixty Feet, Six Inches on Feb 21, 2009 1:42 AM EST reply actions  

If...

Pearce fades away in AAA it will be because he doesn’t learn to hit a curve ball. It doesn’t make sense for him to try and learn against MLB pitching and risk getting his confidence destroyed just for the sake of appeasing fans who want to see the future too soon. Cutch and Pearce and Tabata and whoever else will be brought when they are ready and not because there is a below replacement level starter “blocking” them. I find the whole concept that Morgan is blocking anyone amusing. Do you all really think that Huntington is that stupid? Really?! We could have signed Abreau to play left field this year and he would not block Pearce or Cutch or Tabata when they are ready. Those guys are our future plain and simple. The future will come when it it is time…or when it can hit major league pitching

by Slick1 on Feb 21, 2009 4:01 PM EST up reply actions  

KFC bucket of chicken.

Maybe Pearce needs to make a locker room sacrifice – a la Major League.

by RDV across the sea on Feb 23, 2009 1:58 PM EST up reply actions  

I don't want see Nyjer at LF either

I really hope Hinske wins the starting spot then when Cutch finally gets called up that will move McLouth at LF Cutch at CF and Moss at RF. Morgan will be a distant memory by this time next year.

by BadAndy on Feb 21, 2009 7:50 AM EST reply actions  

Exactly

That’s almost certainly the plan. And if Pearce is to play in the bigs, it’s as a platoon player. After all, he batted 321 against LHP and 222 against RHP. A problem with that idea is that Moss hits about the same against LHP and RHP. For the Pirates he actually hit worse against RHP.

Viva Clemente!

by Roberto on Feb 21, 2009 2:09 PM EST up reply actions  

Sample size, dude

You say that If Pearce plays in the ML, “it’s as a platoon player.”

You’re relying on splits on a total of 109 ABs. Wow.

I remember when Nady and Bay were traded and many fans (myself included) assumed Steve Pearce would get an extended tryout over the last 2 months of the ’08 season.

Instead Russel and Huntington made the bizarre decision to make Morgan a regular. Pearce got spot starts till the last week or so, thus the aforementioned 109 ABs. Morgan, who Charlie and others have proved over and over is simply not a prospect (I’m not going to waste time & repeat his evidence), got the regular playing time. Management gives us every reason to believe this is not about to change in ’09.

Management didn’t give the kid a chance, but reached its conclusion anyway.

All I’ve ever asked is for management to treat Pearce like Andy LaRoche, Hansen, Karstens, Ohlendorf, etc. As of 7/31/08 everyone agrees PBC is a very weak team and there’s no reason to block prospects from getting playing time. I think Pearce gets treated differently because Huntington didn’t acquire him — he’s a legacy.

P.S. In these 109 AB’s, Steve Pearce still managed to hit more HR than Nyjer Morgan has totalled in his last 4 professional seasons. WTF — how is there even an argument about this?

by WstCstBucco on Feb 21, 2009 5:53 PM EST up reply actions  

Nice to see

someone is actually paying attention. This isn’t about Steven Pearce. It’s about a guy (Nyjer Morgan) that doesn’t have enough talent, other than to run fast, to be a starting major league outfielder for ANY team, good or bad. Whether it’s Pearce, or Cutch, or Tabata, or Hinske, or Monroe, or Salazar…it doesn’t matter. Morgan shouldn’t be out there.

Management APPEARS convinced of 2 things…1) Morgan doesn’t have the talent to play CF, even with his speed (or Nate wouldn’t be out there)…and 2) no one else is a better option as a 3rd outfielder for this season behind Nate and Moss.

by Thunder on Feb 21, 2009 6:13 PM EST up reply actions  

OK...

This is an argument I can get ob board with. It is not about Pearce; it’s about Morgan. There is no way to debate you on this because you are correct. I’m kind of hoping that Salazar makes the team and wins the starting job. I believe he has some upside and his bat would play well at PNC. I guess we’ll have to wait and see how this all plays out but as it stands right now I just can’t envision Morgan as our starting LF. I don’t think it’s going to happen.

by Slick1 on Feb 21, 2009 6:42 PM EST up reply actions  

Paying attention?

Did anyone besides me pay attention to how disappointing Pearce was at AAA last year? Maybe he was moping because he didn’t make the big club, but given NH’s comments, I think opponents were finally able to get a book on him. It’s a short story more than book. I hope I don’t violate fair use here, but it reads, in its entirety, “It was a dark and stormy night. Don’t throw Steven Pearce fastballs. And nobody lived happily ever after.”

I’m reading between the line with this — but the org’s comments also seem to indicate that Pearce isn’t interested in changing anything. Well, good luck with whoever signs you to a minor league deal next year, Steve.

by azibuck on Feb 21, 2009 10:41 PM EST up reply actions  

Nope...

you weren’t the only one. I think he earned the playing time he received. I too remember reading that Pearce was relunctant to change his approach (or something like that) and until he learns anyone can hit fastballs he’ll be in AAA again this season and most likely playing for someone else next year. I don’t have a problem with that. Where did he play fall ball…Mexico? Don’t remember but I do recall he was absolutely horrible in a league that was heavy with off-speed pitchers. I do agree with most posters here though that Morgan really has no business being a starting CF let alone corner OF on any major league roster.

by Slick1 on Feb 22, 2009 2:56 PM EST up reply actions  

2008, that's how there's even an argument

Pearce, at age 25, out-OPS’d Morgan by .007 in AAA. And Morgan outplayed him in the bigs.

About that bizarre decision to play Morgan over Pearce late in 2008…

GS BA OBP SLG OPS
 27 .347 .391 .441 .831
 27 .245 .293 .415 .708

Yeah, sure, small sample size, but maybe Russell and Huntington know more than you. And maybe you should introduce your perception to reality. Same number of starts, but to you, Morgan was a regular and Pearce got stiffed until the last week. Pearce got first shot at the job and he failed miserably. He got 12 starts in 18 days in August. He slugged .311.

Management gave the 25yo “kid” a chance, first chance, in fact.

by azibuck on Feb 21, 2009 10:31 PM EST up reply actions  

You call that "a chance?"

Once Njyer was recalled in August he started 29 of 35 games until he was hurt with a few games left. Thank goodness Russell rested him now and then — like against CC Sabathia on Aug 31 — having to play in CC’s 1 hitter might have hurt Morgan’s fragile psyche.

After August 19, Pearce started 5 of the next 26 games, before getting to start the last week of the season. His .245 avg in 40 some ABs in the games he started in August — if that deserved benching, what about Andy Laroche? The PBC gave him a whole 40+ AB’s in August and then benched him — that’s giving him “a chance”?

You say “maybe Russell and Huntington know more than” me. No doubt. I guess Charlie should disable the comment feature and stop writing himself — this site should just reprint the team’s official press releases. I generally support management, but should they be immune from criticism?

Let’s move beyond Steve Pearce. It seems at least we’re close to a consensus that Morgan doesn’t deserve to start on a team that claims to be a major league franchise.

Read the Toronto blog that DK links to today — this guy claims Hinske will take over the clubhouse and make it the happiest one in the ML, will take Andy LaRoche under his wing like he did last year with Evan Longoria with identical results, and will hit (and drink) like Babe Ruth if he gets near 600 AB so long as you sit him against some tough LH SP. The guy doesn’t think much of NL pitchers, particularly those in the NL Central, and just maybe right about that. Gave me a good feeling.

by WstCstBucco on Feb 22, 2009 12:30 PM EST up reply actions  

How awesome would that be?

I don’t let myself get overly excited about opening day like I used to. The Pirates have sort of robbed that from me the last few years. I have to admit thought that I’m really excited, and rooting, for Andy Laroche and Adam Laroche to have solid years and prove everyone wrong. I really think they both will put it all together. No evidence, just a gut feeling, fwiw. If Hinske helps bring that together on top of hitting 25-30 HRs he may be a new favorite of mine. I don’t know about 600 ABs but I could see him getting 450 or more.

by Slick1 on Feb 22, 2009 2:50 PM EST up reply actions  

What the hell are we talking about?

If Pearce didn’t get a chance, then neither did Morgan. It was a small sample for both.

What’s clear is they favored Pearce because they called him up first and gave him a bunch of starts after they did. He didn’t produce.

Your first three paragraphs are all non-sequiturs. I don’t know what the 1st paragraph is supposed to answer/address. Your 2nd pulls AndyL into this discussion… for some reason I don’t know. And criticize all you want. Your peception was that Pearce was buried on the bench, when in fact, he was not, until he showed over almost three weeks that he was having serious issues with, you know, hitting a baseball. Giving Morgan a “chance” after Pearce stunk it up was not “bizarre” (your word).

I put two qualifiers in my earlier posts. I’m no fan of Nyjer, but in lieu of acquiring anyone, he’s the best candidate. But now I guess I’m not only his biggest fan, but a JR/NH apologist. No. Criticize them all you want. Just check the facts first.

Until late September, Pearce. Stunk. Period.

by azibuck on Feb 22, 2009 9:09 PM EST up reply actions  

Irrational Optimism

I catch myself thinking lately that if everything goes more or less right for everybody, this could be an interesting team — we’ve got some guys who might outperform the best of what they’ve shown so far, and that might actually be kind of good, so if about 17 different things all go right, etc etc. Then I realize Nyjer’s penciled in at LF right now, and I think “F, this is going to be a very long year.”

by KPatrick on Feb 21, 2009 3:36 PM EST reply actions  

Comments For This Post Are Closed


User Tools

Welcome to the SB Nation blog about Pittsburgh Pirates.

FanPosts

Community blog posts and discussion.

Recommended FanPosts

Small
A Meet & Greet with Joel Hanrahan
Smiling_small
Pedro Alvarez first in at-bats, Josh Harrison second in fWAR
Small
BD Community Top 30 Prospects
Small
Community Prospect #30

Recent FanPosts

Olz8s2gvbdn15zpl08hlumbr_500_small
Kevin Goldstein's Top 101 Prospects (Taking ?'s on Twitter Now)
Smiling_small
Did you know that Bryan Bullington was an All-Start last year?
Small
Point System Rankings
Towell_small
Color me skeptical, the sad story of Oswalt, Burnett and GFJ
Olz8s2gvbdn15zpl08hlumbr_500_small
Keith Law's Top 100 Prospects
Small
Best and Worst Free-Agent Signings In the Infield
Smiling_small
A look at some guys who didn't sign last year.
Small
Hopes for pitching

+ New FanPost All FanPosts >


Managers

Charlie_small Charlie Wilmoth

Editors

18470r_small Vlad

Authors

Davidtodd_small David Todd

Img_1692_small WTM

Mark_profile_pic_small MarkInDallas