Pirates 7, Marlins 4: Bucs Sweep Baseball's Hottest Team
by Charlie on Apr 22, 2009 3:42 PM EDT
59 comments
So much for the hottest team in baseball--the Pirates swept the Marlins today, bringing their record for the year up to 9-6. It was a big day for the LaRoches: Adam went 4-for-5 with three doubles, two runs scored and a RBI. Andy was 1-for-3 with a double and two RBIs. Believe it or not, Andy now has a seven-game hitting streak going.
Starting pitcher Paul Maholm allowed four runs, which is more than he allowed in his first three starts combined, but he was generally effective before hitting a wall in the sixth. The Pirates' decision to have Jesse Chavez relieve him in the seventh with a 6-4 lead was interesting: granted, the Bucs don't have a ton of options, but Chavez handled himself well, throwing hard fastball after hard fastball, before being replaced by Sean Burnett after recording two outs. Chavez has now allowed just one run and three hits in seven innings of work. Granted, he has three walks and just three strikeouts, but it will be interesting to see if the Pirates continue to trust him in tough spots. It looks like Chavez may be in Pittsburgh for a while; it may be time to regard him as more than just a replacement for Evan Meek.
The Pirates have a travel day tomorrow, then head to San Diego to face another hot team. Of course, the fact that San Diego and Florida have been among the better-performing teams so far mostly just proves that it's early. The Marlins simply aren't very good. The middle infield is great, Cameron Maybin and Jeremy Hermida have promise, and the young pitching is interesting, but today the Fish had Wes Helms batting cleanup and playing first and Ronny Paulino behind the plate. That tells you a lot of what you need to know. The Marlins aren't bad, but they're more like the 2003 Royals than a legitimate playoff team. It's great that the Pirates swept them, but that need not say much about the Bucs. Don't be surprised if they continue to play well against the Padres, but don't read much into it either.
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I guess Capps will be calling MLB Tonight again.
I'd rather be dead than singing "Satisfaction" at forty-five. -- M. Jagger
by cocktailsfor2 on Apr 22, 2009 4:19 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
It’s nice to start so well…this team isn’t all that talented, but it’s a lot of fun.
by Suffering Buc on Apr 22, 2009 4:32 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I'm really excited by this team so far
I realize that the season is young and Doumit’s injury could have some unpleasant long-term implications (particularly for my fantasy teams) but I’m really enjoying the ride and very pleasantly surprised by the performance of the team (particularly the starting pitching).
I made most of my life decisions at a Foghat concert... I stand by them.
by Chester J Lampwick on Apr 22, 2009 4:34 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
No idea
I had no idea that Chavez could throw that hard! 96-97?!?! Wow. You’re right, he may be in Pittsburgh for awhile.
by thelumberco. on Apr 22, 2009 4:59 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
agreed
hes looking so solid so far. and lumberco can we call a truce? our team is 9-6..
I GOT MY STREET BUZZ BEFORE I GOT MY PEACH FUZZ
by omar moreno on Apr 23, 2009 8:35 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Watch your back, Yates
…and if Yates doesn’t get it together, Chavez may take his spot. I know it’s very early, but still.
by thelumberco. on Apr 22, 2009 5:00 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Grrrreat stuff!
Is Nyjer Morgan starting to look a lot like the next Jose Reyes, or what?
Really nice to see the bats and bulls pull the W out for Maholm when he had a less than stellar day. Has to do a lot for his already high confidence.
-David, www.piratesmix.com.
by pascaldupweevil on Apr 22, 2009 5:56 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Reyes is two years younger than Morgan.
And a shortstop.
Nyjer’s off to a decent start, but let’s not get carried away here.
by Vlad on Apr 22, 2009 6:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I didn’t realize Nyjer was that old
-David, www.piratesmix.com.
by pascaldupweevil on Apr 22, 2009 9:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
San Diego
Charlie, any chance you’ll catch the Bucs in SD?
Paul
Morgantown, WV
by GoldNeck on Apr 22, 2009 5:59 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, I’ll be there Friday. I won’t be there Saturday. Not sure about Sunday.
How are you doing, Paul?
by Charlie on Apr 22, 2009 7:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Doing fine.
Just learning more and more about my Pirates and your uncanny memory. Enjoy!
Paul
Morgantown, WV
by GoldNeck on Apr 24, 2009 4:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
What is this BB Stat?
I looked at tbox score for today’s game. The Pirates drew 5 BB and the Marlins only 1. When was the last time the Pirates drew more BB than the opposition? When was the last time the Pirate Pitchers issued 1 BB in a game? WOW!
by zogger on Apr 22, 2009 6:10 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
After 15 Games, Morgan, Sanchez and McLouth...
are all on pace to score 100 runs.
This is a small sample, and it is probably unrealistic to expect all of them to reach that benchmark.
But far and away, the most important of the three to do it would be Morgan because “speed” is his game and what he brings to the lineup.
All three of them are also on pace to have more than 100 strikeouts. I don’t think that the Pirates can be successful with Morgan and Sanchez striking out at this pace, especially Morgan.
He needs to make contact, keep the ball on the ground (including bunts) and get on base.
by thegunner on Apr 22, 2009 6:35 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Obligatory reminder:
There’s virtually no correlation between the percentage of an offense’s outs that come from Ks and the number of runs that it scores.
by Vlad on Apr 22, 2009 6:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Right, but isn't there a little more too it than that?
I understand the stance that an out is an out is an out, and when looking at past performance that is certainly true (at least materially). But when talking about moving forward, if Morgan strikes out less he should make less outs. If he avoids making an out, he gets on base. I’m not touting him as the left fielder of the future, but if he makes 390 outs instead of 400 over the course of a season, isn’t there a little bit of value there?
by DITO on Apr 22, 2009 8:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's not exatly right.
When players work on reducing their K rate, they generally sacrifice some amount of hard contact in order to achieve that goal (since they’re swinging at more borderline stuff which is harder to convert into line drives or HR). Nyjer doesn’t have a lot of pop, but if he tries to focus more on just putting the ball in play, he’s going to gain some extra singles, but also gain some extra DPs and lose some doubles/triples/homers.
It still might be a good idea for Nyjer, but the interaction between Ks and offensive productivity is more complicated than a lot of people realize. That’s the only point I was trying to make here.
by Vlad on Apr 23, 2009 1:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Who Implied That There Was?
But when Morgan strikes out, that’s bad.
When he puts the ball in play, he has a chance to get on base.
by thegunner on Apr 22, 2009 11:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes.....
I think his OBP might be slightly more significant. And, look, we may all be right about Nyjer’s long term success or lack thereof, but let’s enjoy the moment. He’s off to a great start. The team couldn’t ask for anything more through 15 games.
by dtoddwin on Apr 22, 2009 7:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
and it's nice to see
that this year he appears to have reigned in his speed. At least so far, he is playing like a fairly seasoned baseball player instead of just flying around pell-mell showing how fast he is. It’s a good thing, because using that quality to his advantage is exactly what he needs to do.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
by poorboywilly on Apr 22, 2009 7:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just because I have to:
It’s “reined,” instead of “reigned.” Like one “reins in” a horse.
And – it’s also good to see him not oversliding bases, as well.
I'd rather be dead than singing "Satisfaction" at forty-five. -- M. Jagger
by cocktailsfor2 on Apr 22, 2009 7:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
And -- this is redundant, as well
Because I have to too, as well, also.
by azibuck on Apr 22, 2009 7:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
There I go, being redundant all over again.
I'd rather be dead than singing "Satisfaction" at forty-five. -- M. Jagger
by cocktailsfor2 on Apr 22, 2009 9:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Let's not reserve a place in Cooperstown just yet
Morgan is only 5 for his last 25 AB (and 10 of 39 AB since his BA was last over .400). His fantastic first 25 or so ABs has kept his BA looking proud.
Not that I’m trying to harsh your righteous buzz, dudes. :)
by WstCstBucco on Apr 22, 2009 8:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He’s a .300 average/.350 OBP hitter so far in the Majors over parts of 3 seasons, and also in the minors if you take away a bad ‘04. Plus can cover a lot of ground in the outfield and steal bases. That’s fine by me so far.
by ddff22 on Apr 22, 2009 8:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's fine by me, too,
if he can sustain .300/.350, keep hitting for extra bases and keep stealing bases at an 85% clip. I’m sure we all have our doubts about that, though.
by DITO on Apr 22, 2009 9:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think he can keep close to the ratios, I’m more skeptical on the other points though.
by ddff22 on Apr 22, 2009 9:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
So if you take away the part of his minor league career where he didn't play well...
…then he played well in the minors? Just like the way this sandwich is fine for vegans, if you take out the beef and scrape off the mayo! Awesome!
And of course, guys typically don’t post the same line in the majors that they posted at AAA, since the level of competition in MLB is generally considered to be higher. A guy who averages .300/.357/.366 in AAA the way Nyjer did is almost always going to lose a little off the top of all three when he’s promoted to The Show. Walk rates on AAA guys with no power often get hit particularly hard, once pitchers realize that the hitter can’t make them pay for throwing meatball strikes.
by Vlad on Apr 23, 2009 1:41 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Does This Reasoning Apply To Minor League Phenom ...
Andy LaRoche?
by thegunner on Apr 23, 2009 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Sure.
You always have to be careful about giving a guy credit for a bad season – there’s always going to be a human impulse to want to cut someone a break. If you’re going to give credit, there needs to be some sort of well-defined natural boundary that’s imposed on the guy’s performance from outside. An injury, or a position shift, or a real-life trauma like the death of Veal’s parents.
As far as I know, Nyjer didn’t suffer any serious injuries in 2004, or anything like that. He just didn’t play well. So there’s no reason to cut him slack for playing badly in that season. LaRoche, as we all know (and has been widely reported), was playing hurt for almost all of last year, so there’s a much better case to be made for credit for him. It’s not ironclad, and you can argue against it if you want. But it’s a totally different situation than with Nyjer.
by Vlad on Apr 23, 2009 4:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You’re right, Vlad, but ‘04 is so far back in time I’m not sure it means much going forward anyhow.
A couple problems I have here: Vlad’s also right that when a no-power guy has a .350 OBP in the minors, he’s generally going to give some of that back in the majors, both because hitting in the majors is harder and because pitchers at that level throw more strikes and have no reason to fear a hitter with no power.
Also—really? A .350 OBP with no power? We’d be cool with that for a starting corner outfielder? Whatever Morgan’s other virtues, they’re not enough to make up for the lack of power. If he’s in center, MAYBE that’s a different story, but because of the stuff in the paragraph above, I’m dubious.
by Charlie on Apr 23, 2009 6:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Let’s not etch that .350 OBP into stone either.
The Gunner (Bob Prince, not the guy who posts here) used to repeat every April that its not worth even talking about a player’s batting average until after he’s had 100 ABs.
Now Bob Prince didn’t capiche OPS, but he’s totally right if you substitute plate appearances. Morgan’s only got 65 AB’s and 4 BB so far in 2009. So while I could point out that he’s dropped about 100 points in BA over his last 40 AB’s, I will follow the Gunner’s sage advice and just hold my tongue for now.
But as I said above, let’s not order the plaque for Cooperstown just quite yet.
by WstCstBucco on Apr 23, 2009 8:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Worthwhile point about 2004.
Anything much more than three years in the past has very limited predictive value in a machine projection.
by Vlad on Apr 24, 2009 12:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Suppose Nyjer meets his Bill James projection of .292/.339/.367, which is optimistic but plausible. In that case he’s worth 27 runs as a left fielder at the plate and +26 runs in the field over 600 PA and 150 games respectively (all per Fangraphs and UZR). Baserunning is probably a wash - his poor basestealing percentage is likely to be offset by the extra bases he’ll take and DP avoidance — and his arm is about average from what I’ve seen. That all adds up to (shock and horror) a league average left fielder. Obviously a .340 OBP belongs nowhere near the leadoff spot, and the projection is a little generous, but we’re not paying him tons of money and handing him the position forever. He’s a stopgap until McCutchen comes up. In that role he’s perfectly adequate.
I seem to remember making a very similar post before the season started, now that I think about it. I don’t particularly love Nyjer, but the defensive stats are kind enough to him that he appears mediocre instead of awful.
by shayborg on Apr 24, 2009 4:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hm. That strikethrough was not intentional. I estimated he is worth negative 27 batting runs as a LF (12 runs below an average hitter, and 15 more for the difference between an average LF and an average hitter).
by shayborg on Apr 24, 2009 4:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Who'd a thunk it...
ex-Pirate Krissy Benson to the DL again…with elbow tendinitis.
by Thunder on Apr 22, 2009 7:24 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Hey, Benson has pitched in 2 games in 2009
And he’s only given up 11 ER in 11 IP. And he and Mrs. Benson have had zero embarrassing interviews this year
I didn’t think that’d happen. If he closes it down now, that’s way better than his 2007 or 2008 ML seasons.
by WstCstBucco on Apr 22, 2009 8:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Know what's really funny?
Calling a guy who spent a whole bunch of his own money on better equipment for local cops and firefighters by a female diminutive of his name, to imply that he’s a wuss.
It’s the best!
by Vlad on Apr 22, 2009 8:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, even apart from Benson, I really think the whole feminization of names thing that’s happened here a few times in the past couple weeks really ought to stop.
by Charlie on Apr 22, 2009 9:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Duly noted, Charlie.
I plead guilty in this case (and to my knowledge, the only time I’ve done it)…but am certainly not the Lone Ranger in doing it. It will stop, at least from me, anyway.
by Thunder on Apr 22, 2009 9:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thanks. And no, you certainly weren’t alone.
by Charlie on Apr 22, 2009 10:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I apologize
for typing “Benita Santiago” the other day.
by bucdaddy on Apr 22, 2009 11:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I've only ever made fun of the guy
because his wife is absolutely certifiable in that every interview with her seems to end up in a discussion of (a) unusual locales where they’ve had sex, or (b) her contingency plans to cheat on Kris.
by WstCstBucco on Apr 23, 2009 1:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Glad to hear that, Charlie
Kris Benson has been conducting a social experiment for all American sports fans over the last five years.
The subject of the experiment is: “How much will a multi-millionaire ballplayer put up with to hang onto his extremely hot wife?”
The results so far — “Plenty!”
But the experiment is ongoing, and as Kris moves beyond his ML career and Anna Benson moves into her mid-30’s, the experiment may get even more interesting. Personally, I am fascinated.
by WstCstBucco on Apr 23, 2009 3:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Can I sill use my handle . . .
is does it somehow offend those with different pant-wearing preferences?
by chicos_pants on Apr 23, 2009 10:16 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I believe that this team can be a winning team. Especially since we seem to have better options at position players than we used to.
The weakness I fear is Pitching depth. We have a rotation that has good potential, and some key relievers doing a good job, but if one or two key parts are down for a few months, there goes the team.
Either way I think we can at least say the Bucs are heading in the right direction without getting laughed at as much as before the season started.
by Phantaskippy on Apr 22, 2009 11:18 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I've always liked Benson for some reason
and remember being kinda choked up when he hugged lloyd McClendon good bye in the dugout after his final start as a Buc. His 2000 season was really good, who knows what would’ve happened but for the injuries. Wasn’t it an uneven mound at the Twins’ spring training camp that was the culprit, or am I drinking the Pirates’ kool aid?
by Scranton on Apr 23, 2009 12:27 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Give Credit where credit is due
The Pirates are a legit contender I am not going to read to much into this, but c’mon we just swept the Marlins. Sure they don’t seem that great but they were 11-1 coming into it and undefeated on the road. Our pitching is being talked about nationally, we are hitting the ball and coming through when we need to, and NyMo is getting on base and stealing, the numbers and facts don’t lie here guys.
by baseballssp3 on Apr 23, 2009 8:59 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
New Olney Article
Buster Olney has a new article up about Jamarillo, his thought son the Buc’s staff and the team in general. Nice to finally get some coverage from a non Pirates-centric writer
note: I think Dejan is a fantastic writer, the Pirates blogs and other team-focused writing is great also. I just mean someone who in covers baseball in general, not specifically the Pirates. I see it as a positive sign they think we’re worth writing about in something besides a punchline
McLouth is The Trouth
by GTrain on Apr 23, 2009 11:42 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
http://insider.espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?entryID=4091151&name=olney_buster
McLouth is The Trouth
by GTrain on Apr 23, 2009 11:42 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Intangibles?
We quantify everything in baseball with stats, but IMHO I think that NyMo is a catalyst. I think the team feeds off his energy. Do I think he belongs in the starting lineup….not really, but I think he is a valuable pinch runner/hitter and defensive replacement in the late innings and can be for some time to come. I like what he brings to the team and his energy. It is always good to have a clubhouse guy who is well liked, plays hard and is an all around good guy.
We can sit here and argue all day about his stats, but it is good to have a guy who earned his way onto the team, plays hard and is a good citizen.
by vanslyke on Apr 24, 2009 10:35 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
No matter how much I may criticize Nyjer's play...
…I still like him on a personal level, and want him to do well.
by Vlad on Apr 24, 2009 12:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nyjer Will Never Be A Bench Guy
He’s either going to make things happen by playing nearly everyday and doing the things he needs to do (make contact, get on base, score runs) or his career in Pittsburgh, and the Major Leagues, will not last long.
by thegunner on Apr 24, 2009 11:24 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
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