You're a good man, Charlie (Brown)

by Illinois Pirate Fan on May 11, 2009 2:38 PM EDT Comment 16 comments

But if your assessment of our prospects is accurate then our future is even more bleak than I thought. I was so depressed after reading your ratings that I had to go watch my 1960 World Series dvd to pull myself out of my depression.

After reading your note I am even more certain that several major deals must be made on our part so as to avoid another decade of losing. There simply isn't much to hang our caps upon in the minor leagues and so free agency and multiple trades are needed quickly. I still think management made a large mistake in not trying to sign Adam Dunne who's left-handed bat would have fit perfectly in PNC and since he signed with Washington I must believe that he would not have been opposed to playing in Pittsburgh.

In summary, we have very little talent in the minor leagues and we have even less at the MLB level as management has chosen to keep the same collection of stiffs that it used to win only 67 games last year. After seeing what KC has done so far this year I think it is obvious we have the worst organization in all of MLB. Unless some of you guys from the Pittsburgh area can convince Mark Cuban not to buy the Cubs but rather buy the Pirates then I think we're in for another decade of losing.

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I think a better time to evaluate the Pirates minor league system will be after this coming draft and the inevitable midseason trades.

I don’t think free agents are the answer though. Someone like Adam Dunn would not make the Pirates a playoff team or probably not even a .500 team. In addition I have problems with Dunn’s defense and am not sure where he would fit in on this team.

I made most of my life decisions at a Foghat concert... I stand by them.

by Chester J Lampwick on May 11, 2009 3:00 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Chester Is Right

Free agents are not the answer.

The Pirates are going to have to make some very astute trades between now and January 2010..

As I have said in earlier posts, absolutely NO ONE should be untradeable.

by thegunner on May 11, 2009 3:21 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

If you think that list of prospects is bad....

you ought to have seen the list at this time last year. These guys essentially took over an expansion level organization and have done pretty good to add promising names to that list. The Royals atleast had some commonsense in past drafts to get those players where the Pirates did not pre-2008.

by gorillakilla34 on May 11, 2009 3:34 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Worst organization?

I don’t think that’s obvious at all.

Houston, Detroit, Washington…others?

Also:

I still think management made a large mistake in not trying to sign Adam Dunne (sic)

How do we know who they tried to sign in the offseason?

“With respect to Adam Dunn, we never got close to what he was seeking. First, we liked our options in the outfield and second, we did not have the payroll availability to make a two-year, $22 million commitment to Dunn.”

from Frank Coonely’s 5/6 chat at the official website.

by dirtyfrank on May 11, 2009 3:38 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

IPF

I think you mean well, but you just don’t get it.

"After reading your note I am even more certain that several major deals must be made on our part so as to avoid another decade of losing. There simply isn’t much to hang our caps upon in the minor leagues and so free agency and multiple trades are needed quickly. "

Who do you want the Bucs to trade? Do you think we would get some overwhelming haul of talent for Wilson or Sanchez? A couple of C grade prospects in exchange for our 2B/SS combo would make us better down the road? Really? And I’m sure our starting pitchers would relish the thought of another half season or more with players the caliber of Bixler, Cruz, and Vazquez manning the middle of the diamond.

Since you’re talking about Charlie Brown, we’d be lucky to get anything more than Peanuts for someone like John Grabow.

If we put McClouth or Maholm up for grabs, do you think we’d be in the driver’s seat in the trade negotiations? Are you kidding?

You saw last summer what the team went through just to try and get some good talent for Bay, Nady, and Marte.

And for the gazillionth time, most quality FAs for many years now DO NOT want to sign with the PBC. Wanting to acquire someone and bringing it to fruition are two different things. The organization is hamstrung by more that Nutting’s budget. A decade and a half of losing makes Pittsburgh generally the last destination of choice.

Also, it’s Adam Dunn, not Dunne!

Adam Dunn really turned around the Reds and Nationals, didn’t he?

The Nationals suck, but there was a catcher who took less to sign with them a couple of years ago, rather than be employed by the Pirates.

Why in the hell do you think Will Ohman reportedly took less to sign with the Dodgers?

We’ve told you a bazillion times that McClatchy/Littlefield/Creech left the minors in terrible shape, and very little talent that would’ve been around at the MLB level after this year.

Huntington and Coonelly have only had one June draft, and one Latin America signing period to acquire talent to rebuild the organization. They need time! DO YOU UNDERSTAND IPF?

Yeah, let’s do it your way, IPF, and go the FA route to bring in the next Raul Mondesi or Jeromy Burnitz. Guys like them love a final multi-million dollar payday from any team.

The way for this team to go is to continue to make all efforts through scouting and spending to acquire and develop talent through the June draft, Latin America, and elsewhere around the world. I expect to see a sequel to last year’s efforts starting next month. It will take a few more years-best case scenario-to really reap the rewards of such efforts.

And if we can get something the front office likes for certain veteran players, let’s do it, but it won’t be the major part of the rebuilding process-not with what we have to offer.

The team is going to lose for at least a couple more seasons, IPF. If this is too much for you to bear, well, keep watching your old DVDs.

by patthatt on May 11, 2009 3:56 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Patthatt:

Do us both a favor and save us both some time writing because I can tell when someone is talking down to me like a father to a small child so just cut the charade. I don’t care how Dunn spells his last name because it’s not relevant to my point. If Dunn had no problems in playing for Washington then I’m certain a similar amount of money could have lured him to Pittsburgh where the Clemente Wall would have made him an instant run producer, something neither Hinske nor Moss can accomplish.

The St. Louis Cardinals had made overtures to the Pirates two years ago for some badly needed lefthanded pitching and so I know for a fact we could have Ludwick from them before he had his break-out year in 2008. In addition, the St. Louis papers indicated that the Cardinals would have listened to offers for Colby Rasmus, their top prospect, for a lefthanded starter. In addition, they desparately wanted Grabow for their bullpen before Isringhausen retired.

Drafts and FA are just two of the ways in which teams can be built and trades are still an important part of the process. At the beginning of last year the White Sox were trying to peddle Joe Crede who certainly would be an improvement over what we’ve had there but management chose to go after LaRoche (the younger instead). The point is that there are trades can work out well if you out-work your opponent and take some risks just like all FA signings don’t have to work out poorly just because previous management couldn’t get it right.

by Illinois Pirate Fan on May 11, 2009 5:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

The only things I've ever read...

…indicate that the Cards were NOT willing to trade Rasmus. They certainly pulled his name off the table quickly enough when they kicked the tires on Bay last year.

by Vlad on May 11, 2009 5:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

IPF

The spelling is important when other people repeatedly told you the same thing in the offseason, but you still can’t remember it. It shows a lack of attention to detail, if not a poor memory, which goes a long way to explaining the “quality” of your posts.

You wrote elsewhere:

“If you listen to some of the posters on this board they will want you to believe that drafting is the only solution to improving a club when in fact, both trades and FA are both excellent options that can work well in connection to wise trades.”

Who in the hell said that the draft is the only solution? I know I never said any such thing. Who said it, IPF?

I’ve always said a combination of all possible ways to acquire and develop talent is necessary to improve the PBC, but the farm system, first and foremost, must be infused with a ton of talent if we are going to be successful on a regular basis next decade. There are no quick fixes.

If you want me to lay off, start making some sense, especially with your nausea-inducing fan posts on a near-daily basis.

Nah, come to think of it, I’m done talking to you here. You are Ignore Pirate Fan from now.

by patthatt on May 11, 2009 7:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

IPF

Listen to patthatt, he has all the answers.

by thegunner on May 11, 2009 4:11 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

No, I'd rather listen to you

Because YOU have all the answers. "Trust me on this and “keep watchin!” add so much to the discussion! Thank you for imparting your wisdom to us lesser mortals. Maybe you could expound on the Meaning of Life while you’re enlightening us all.

by bucdaddy on May 12, 2009 12:18 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

e=mc squared

by thegunner on May 12, 2009 12:56 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I thought it was 42?

I made most of my life decisions at a Foghat concert... I stand by them.

by Chester J Lampwick on May 12, 2009 1:11 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Chester, You're Right! It was 42 Pre-Einstein

by thegunner on May 12, 2009 11:08 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Gunner

No, I don’t have all the answers, but I’ve learned a lot from the many knowledgeable baseball people on this site the past few years.

What answers do you have for what’s been ailing the PBC since 1993? Nothing other than trashing the current management, and blaming them for everything their predecessors screwed up.

You’re clueless, Gunner.

by patthatt on May 11, 2009 4:16 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs