Pirates Work to Sign Pounders, Dodson, Stevenson, Cain
by Charlie Wilmoth on Jun 18, 2009 2:14 AM EDT
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PrintThis is pretty nice:
No. 2 selection Brooks Pounders, a 6-foot-6 pitcher from Temecula Valley (Calif.) High School, reportedly is set to sign today in Pittsburgh, after flying in for a physical and meetings with team officials. Pounders, a USC recruit, constituted the type of teenage pitcher with upside whom the Pirates aimed to snatch in a draft rife with them.
Meantime, Nos. 4 and 8 selections from Texas high schools, left-handed pitchers Zackry Dodson (Baylor) of Medina Valley and Colton Cain (University of Texas) of Waxahachie said they were in a two-week holding pattern before the Pirates -- working through major league channels for approval -- may extend them what might amount to above-slot contract offers. And No. 7 selection, pitcher Trent Stevenson (Arizona) of Scottsdale, Ariz., said he and his family are scheduled to meet with a Pirates representative Monday.
Stevenson and Cain are the ones to watch here--Stevenson has a projectable frame and was once described as the best high school prospect in Arizona, and Cain is a highly rated prospect as well. Cain and Dodson apparently want enormous bonuses, so it'll be interesting to see what they and the Pirates can work out. Pounders has a varied, polished arsenal that's unusual for a high school pitcher, but he doesn't throw especially hard, and he's already quite a big guy, and not in a good way.
In any case, all four of these guys would be solid additions to the Pirates' system. If they can get Stevenson and Cain, that'd be a huge coup.
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Sign 'em all!
And let the minors sort ’em out.
At least according to this article Von Rosenburg says he’s planning to honor his LSU commitment. We’ll see what happens when real money comes into play though.
http://www.neworleans.com/sports/lsu/147664-lsu-in-omaha-safe-to-say-von-rosenbergs-a-tiger.html
Well, that sucks.
He is by far the best of the arms we drafted. If he doesn’t sign, this draft is back down in “C” territory.
lots of time left
i still say Von Rosenburg is far from an LSU lock. the same was said about grossman and his full ride to Texas. I would have probably said the same thing as an 18 year-old local product, standing in a ticket line to watch LSU play, approched by an LSU reporter. If the pirates throw alot of money at him, i can see that stance changing…
No stock in this at all, except Dignan's comment
First of all, Ed Daniels may work for actual media outlets, but he’s clearly a fan. And first of all, he asks Von Rosenberg if he’ll be at LSU while Von Rosenberg was standing in the ticket line at the CWS.
it’s like asking a kid if his favorite sport is football or basketball. If he’s watching the Super Bowl, it’s football. Two months later while watching the Final Four, it’ll be basketball.
He may end up going to LSU, but what he says June 17 while at the CWS is meaningless. So like Dignan said, we’ll see what happens when he’s faced with a table full of cash.
I’ve seen lots of similar articles and posts—at the local paper, the blog dedicated to a particular school’s sports scene, etc.—and I’ve never yet seen one that quoted the highly touted recruit as saying, “Hell, yes, I’m going to turn pro.”
Well, maybe this isn't as adament as what you're looking for
http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/page2/47884542.html
Zack Dodson (#4 pick): Pittsburgh drafted Dodson, a left-handed pitcher from Medina Valley, in the fourth round with the 115th overall pick. He said Thursday that he’s close to signing.
"I’m pretty sure I’m going to sign, but I’m not sure about when," Dodson said. "There’s still a lot of stuff to work out."
That he likes playoff baseball?
Me too! And I don’t even live in the south.
Also
Huntington did say that he expected to sign all of the top 10 picks from this year unless they were to drastically increase their bonus demands after the draft. I imagine that they made sure to get a good handle on what each of them was demanding before picking them.
We’ll see. You never know what’s going to happen, and these players are kids just getting out of high school… not always the most rational beings.
Let me look
I believe it was from Perrotto and/or Dejan pretty soon after the draft. I’ll look for it.
Can't find it
I can’t figure out how to look at Perrotto’s “blogs” from the past. It doesn’t seem to give you the option to go back beyond the last few. Also can’t figure out how to go back through the PPG news stories beyond what shows up on the front page.
I believe I saw it on here. Maybe I’ll find it later, at the moment I’m too busy at work to keep searching.
it's cool
i was just wondering because i hadn’t seen that quote anywhere.
FWIW
I saw an interview with one of their draftees—Dermody I think—who made it clear he’d exchanged numbers with the Pirates before the draft. There’s also the fact that they clearly had a predraft deal with Sanchez. I’m not sure if this was always done so explicitly in the past, but I suspect the Pirates have exchanged numbers with just about everybody they drafted, or at least all the priority guys. Draft bonuses have gotten so high that teams probably have to do that. I’m sure some of the negotiations won’t go as planned, but I’ll bet the Pirates in most cases have a very clear idea which guys they can sign.
More than one indicated...
…that they exchanged numbers.
So far, I’ve seen confirmation of that from Cooper, Spangler, and Taylor. It’s pretty common practice within the industry.
Negotiating...
If I am Von Rosenburg I am wearing every bit of LSU merch I can find and presenting the impression that I am committed to attending. If he makes it easy on the Pirates, he doesnt get as much money.
Perhaps the Grossman parallel is appropriate here.
Odd Argument
Referring to last years draft party at PNC, when we took Pedro with the 2nd overall pick.
My buddy and I get into the Hall of Fame club and head for the food table and the first person we run in to is Bob Nutting. Nutting is in the mood to talk and for the next 10 minutes talks about how the Pirates are going to draft college committed high school prospects in the later rounds. Though not a direct quote, Bob says something like this:
“We’re going to convince these fine young men that they really don’t want to go to college, that their future lies with the Pirates. We’re going to be aggressive in offering them top dollar to persuade them not to go to college. That this is what’s best for them.”
Bob was serious as could be and I just found the argument kind of odd. When we were growing up, it was always “go to college, be the first in the family to graduate from college, make something of yourself”. Now here is Bob, telling us that is not really what is best for these kids.
Found the whole discussion amusing…
Sounds like they're trying to exploit
A realm of players they may have sway over, versus higher priced players coming out of College, or FA’s. I can’t blame them for the strategy, since they really do need all hands on deck, but I agree with you in that it’s maybe a little shady.
Whatever happens I expect it will be satisfactory to everyone involved. Plus didn’t we often hear (back a few years ago) about HS players going to the NBA for the money over college?
by Pensburgh Pirates on Jun 18, 2009 8:54 AM EDT up reply actions
College
I understand what they are looking to do but I dont think it to be shady…in fact if I recall didnt some of the bound for college guys end up getting clauses in their contracts that the Pirates would pay their tuition for college leaving them a safety net beyond the sign on bonus.
I am a strong proponent of getting an education but if someone offered me $900K to skip it and give pro ball a try I would do it just like Quinton Miller did. That money will go a lot further in establishing their lives. If they are smart, even if they dont make it to the show they are further along in life than the average 23 yr old kid wandering around with a BS in his hand right now.
Exploit the market
Tough economic times, some of these kids’ moms and dads undoubtedly can use the money NOW. I wonder if the scouting reports can possibly get that sophisticated.
“Five tools, parents behind on mortgage, dad drives ’95 Hyundai, just got laid off from the chicken-processing plant …”
It’s part of the scouts’ job to gauge signability and my understanding is that they do get into stuff like that.
Harrington had an idiot for an agent. In fact, he successfully sued the guy later. REALLY sad story. 99.9% of the time, in that situation, he signs.
What the Pirates are doing makes sense, because this is where you find guys with some ceiling. The problem with building through the draft is that you get only one first round pick. (Except for comp picks, which always end up helping the rich teams—stupid process.) Very few high-ceiling college players fall to the later rounds. They have less bargaining leverage and less projectability. If you’re desperate to get prospects with some potential into your system, HS players who fall due to bonus demands and college commitments are the way to go.
Nate had such an agreement. He was about as die-hard a Michigan fan as can be and his parents were pretty locked in on him going to college. There was a clause in his contract where they promised to pay up to 100K for him to go to college, I think only if he ended up not making it in the bigs, but don’t recall the specific qualifiers.
RIP NATE. LADIES AND GENTLEMEN...MISTER TONY PLUSH!
College tuition
Exactly. It’s standard for HS prospects to insist on a college tuition clause.
I have a friend’s family who will be going through that in a year.
It’s not exploitive. College baseball is exploitive. A player can get $1 million now and then go to college in the summers and still have a degree if MLB doesn’t work.
I keep waiting to be exploited at any age. Unfortunately I guess I have too much integrity or maybe I just intimidate potential exploiters.
I hear ya...
well, not on the integrity part. I’m wayyyy too old for that. ;-)
Free your ass and your mind will follow.
by cocktailsfor2 on Jun 18, 2009 6:54 PM EDT up reply actions
I’m not saying that the Pirates are shady or in any way exploiting high school graduates. What I am saying is that I thought it was odd the way Bob Nutting stated the situation and presented the argument.
your comment
seemed like it was saying Bob’s words were more counter-intuitive than exploitative or shady.
It is an interesting situation, though.
i'll exploit you wilbur
but i only have about 7 bucks and coupon to Dennys.
it sounds to me like bob was dead serious about getting a better baseball team. he can wear a big black hat and rub his hands together whilst laughing maniacally for all i care…as long as he ponies up the cash to get a better baseball team.
Not what I had in mind
But considering my athletic gifts, than and now, you’d be getting a raw deal.
Only 26 current major leaguers have college degrees. While the smart guys who would’ve gone regardless of athletic ability get these clauses in there and go. There are countless guys who just went pro. Im not saying they deserve it but they’d be better off with a college degree that they coasted to as an athlete than 6 years of minor league ball on their resumes.
Just wanted to mention that the “I didnt make it in ball, time for college” is more the exception than the rule.
RIP NATE. LADIES AND GENTLEMEN...MISTER TONY PLUSH!
Not Sure The Data Supports That...
The 26 are amongst those who made it to the majors…How many guys who dont make it after years in the minors end up getting degrees? I suspect that ratio is more telling and higher to boot.
True, probably much highER, but I would bet it is less than half, just a personal guess
RIP NATE. LADIES AND GENTLEMEN...MISTER TONY PLUSH!
I'd say...
much less than half go back to get their degrees. In fact…as an example…I believe 6 on the Pirates coaching staff originally went to college. Only one…Varsho…got even a bachelor’s degree (Wisconsin-Oshkosh).
risk vs reward
For any thoughtful high school player, especially pitchers, they realize the incidence of injury and the long odds to land big money in the draft. Taking $.75 – $1 mil guaranteed now makes sense. You may only be able significantly improve your bonus prospects by moving up in the draft in a later year, and you’re unlikely to do so with the cloud of a serious injury on your resume. Safe money now that will allow you to live reasonably well for your minor league career, maybe help out your family some, with an opportunity to work hard and move up
Guy who played for me in college is now southeast area scout for Rockies
He said the Von Rosenberg family gave $2m as the majic number. They were prepared to take him no later than pick #59 until Matzek fell in their laps. Matzek’s probable bonus made them go with guys with lower prices after that. Scott said that figure may come down a little but the family is upper middle class and they bleed purple and gold.
I have personaly seen Dodson pitch on more that one occasion
He will definitely be an above average pitcher once he matures. He has completely dominated south Texas. He is tall and lanky and appears to look like he is about 15 so he has so growing to do still. He has been heavily scouted even last year when Medina Valley was in the playoffs. I am a High School Umpire down here and I can safely say he hits at least 93 mph. by time he is 20 I can see that being 98 and he is left handed and a hard worker. Pittsburgh scored big by drafting Dodson. Congrats to the NH regime
When are we going to trade Cutch now
Brooks Pounders
Rooting for him on a personal note!!……my (not so far from) hometown So Cal product, might have been drafted to high….glad to see hes signing…..and yup its “Te-MEC-u-la” Valley High lol
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