Should the Pirates make a play for Delmon Young?
I was on a MLB Rumor site and I saw on Article say that Delmon Young of the Twins is "exceptionally available." Which got me thinking he's a former 1st Overall pick, Right Handed Bat with loads of potential, and is still only 24 years old. The only thing is the power hasnt really been there but in his 2nd year in the bigs with the Rays he did drive in 93 RBI's... I'm just wondering if you guys think the Pirates should take a chance and try and acquire him if it all works out he has the potential to be a middle of the order type of bat in my opinon...if the Twins don't ask for too much i think i make an attempt to acquire Young...Just my opinion though.
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didn't he have some kind of head thing?
I mean wasn’t he a head case of some kind for the Rays? I could be wrong. The Rays gave up on him pretty early. I would think that may be a red flag.
Although it may have been what the pirates had, was a ton of expendable OF’s.
I wouldn’t be opposed to bringing him here, but don’t know what they’d give up, or how long he’d actually stay here?
by Pensburgh Pirates on Jun 19, 2009 10:58 AM EDT reply actions
He is indeed a head case.
The Rays traded him because he was a dick. He threw a bat at an umpire.
www.sixtyftsixin.com
by Sixty Feet, Six Inches on Jun 19, 2009 12:22 PM EDT up reply actions
In my opinion having Delwyn and Delmon Young on the same team would be way too confusing so no.
I made most of my life decisions at a Foghat concert... I stand by them.
by Chester J Lampwick on Jun 19, 2009 11:15 AM EDT reply actions
Two points on RBI:
1) RBI is already a plural: Runs Batted In. “RBIs” is redundant.
2) RBI are next-to-useless for determining a player’s offensive value. They’re largely a function of opportunity, rather than performance.
I'm pretty sure that's not right
RBI technically stands for Run Batted In. It is pluralized by adding the apostrophe s
Apostrophe-S makes it a possessive.
I.e. something belonging to a single RBI. That’s twice as wrong.
Any of you guys have a record player? How do you measure the speed of the platter? In RPMs, or RPM’s? No. In RPM – Revolutions Per Minute.
What were we supposedly looking for in Iraq? WMDs, or WMD’s? No. WMD – Weapons of Mass Destruction.
It’s the same thing with RBI.
OK
Does RBI mean Run Batted In in some instances and Runs Batted In in others? As in, player x went 1-2 with an RBI (run batted in). Player x went 1-2 with 3 RBI runs batted in).
If you are right then...
How could anybody ever have one (1) RBI? It has to be “RUN” (singular) and not plural.
by Illinois Pirate Fan on Jun 19, 2009 9:51 PM EDT up reply actions
If something turns once per minute...
…then it’s turning at one RPM. If you find one nuclear warhead in Saddam’s garage, then it’s one WMD.
You don’t need to have different forms of a word for the singular and the plural. What’s the plural of deer? Deer.
But
RPM is referred to as RPMs when it’s plural. As in, I shifted my car at 2400 RPMs. How do you know for a fact that RBI literally stands for Runs Batted In?
"RPM is referred to as RPMs when it’s plural."
No, it’s not, unless you’re doing it wrong. Check your dictionary.
For the record, the section of the official rules of MLB dealing with the awarding of RBI (10.04) is titled “Runs batted in”.
Also, look at MLB.com’s statistical leaderboards (here). The categories that need the “s” in order to be plural have it (“wins”, “strikeouts”, etc.), but the RBI leaders? They’re listed under RBI.
So MLB’s internal usage would seem to be pretty clear. That being the case, I have trouble understanding why a different form would be preferred, especially insofar as it would disagree with common linguistic practice (re: RPM, WMD, etc.).
That reminds me of all the fools
who say “ATM machine” when the “M” already stands for machine. Everyone should know it is either an ATM or an AT machine.
by WestCoastBuc on Jun 19, 2009 7:39 PM EDT up reply actions
WestCoastBuc
Have you ever said PIN number?
No, of course not.
Exactly
Who knew you not only had to be a complete expert in all fields of baseball knowledge but also in grammar and acronyms to post a comment on Bucs Dugout.
Yes, I do spoon with my bat. I named it Jack. -Freddy Sanchez
by gorillakilla34 on Jun 20, 2009 11:45 AM EDT up reply actions
gorillakilla
Please bring back your previous South Park-inspired signature.
Gotcha buddy
Just rember that Freddy spoons with Jack.
"So you think 25 percent of the country is retarded?! Yea. Atleast 25 percent. Well lets so a sample. There are 4 of us an you're retarded. Thats 25 percent." Southpark; Mystery of the Urinal Deuce
by gorillakilla34 on Jun 21, 2009 10:00 AM EDT up reply actions
remember*
"So you think 25 percent of the country is retarded?! Yea. Atleast 25 percent. Well lets so a sample. There are 4 of us an you're retarded. Thats 25 percent." Southpark; Mystery of the Urinal Deuce
by gorillakilla34 on Jun 21, 2009 10:01 AM EDT up reply actions
Now, as for the move itself:
One problem with Young as a potential acquisition is that he’s already in his third and final pre-arb year. Even if he turns things around, he’s going to start to get expensive very quickly. I would worry that he might be on the Jose Guillen career path, where he doesn’t become a plus asset until he’s on his fourth or fifth team in 2014.
I’ve also heard mentions of character concerns with Young, and there were some troubling incidents in his past, such as the time he threw his bat at the umpire in the minors. It’s hard to know whether those are true, of course, but the FO would need to do their due diligence before pulling the trigger, if they were interested.
I might or might not be interested. It’d probably come down to price, along with the character factors that I’m not in a position to assess right now.
What if the price was an equally temperamental RH starting pitcher...
or a left handed reliever with proven set-up capability and an arm that we all know will drop off someday soon?
If they stall over the deal, throw in Morgan (while his stock is reasonably high) as outfield cover and ask for a raw SS/2B prospect in return.
by RDV across the sea on Jun 19, 2009 2:33 PM EDT up reply actions
There's absolutely no way I'd trade Snell for him.
And I’d only trade Grabow if the other offers for him sucked. I just don’t have much confidence that Young will turn it around before he starts getting large service time-based arb awards.
i wouldn't give up snell
but i would trade grabow for him for sure
fee fie foh fum. i think i smell the scent of a placenta.
No Way
I wouldn’t want this kid, he just hits singles, doesn’t walk and K’s too much, plus the attitude problem. Grabow could end up being a type A free agent and net us 2 early picks so the deal for him will have to be better than what you might think.
Grabow isn't going to net us 2 early picks.
If he qualifies as a Type A (and he might), then he’ll just go unsigned. Teams aren’t willing to lose their first/second for middling relievers anymore, and veteran situational lefties really sat on the market for a long time last offseason – look at Will Ohman, or Trever Miller, or Dennys Reyes, or Joe Beimel.
Look at the middling-quality Type A FA relievers from last offseason: Doug Brocail, Damaso Marte, and Darren Oliver re-signed with their original teams. Bob Howry and Russ Springer changed teams, but only after their original teams declined to offer arbitration, voiding any claim to compensation. And that’s it. All the other guys who changed sides were big-ticket closers like Wood and K-Rod and Fuentes.
The knock on him..
has always been his glove. I don’t recall reading anything about him being a head case. Well, he did throw that bat at an umpire, but I think that whole thing was overblown. His brother has had trouble and Delmon came up with Hamilton and Dukes. They both had/have problems. His minor league numbers indicate that he has the potential to be a decent hitter, so he might be worth a shot. I don’t think the Buc’s should give up that much for him. Certainly nothing close to Garza and Bartlett (Twins were hosed). Although, if the Bucs want to take a flyer on a guy like Young, I’d rather see them do it at a position that is more of an organizational weakness (Middle Infield!!).
Also, Runs batted in is plural, but does that mean that an “s” should not be added to the abrieviation? I’m not a grammer expert, so I’ve consulted Wikipedia. It was all very confusing, but here is what it says
A particularly rich source of options arises when the plural of an initialism would normally be indicated in a word other than the final word if spelled out in full. A classic example is Member of Parliament, which in plural is Members of Parliament. It is possible then to abbreviate this as M’s P.3132 (or similar33), as famously by a former Australian Prime Minister.[citation needed] This usage is less common than forms with s at the end, such as MPs, and may appear dated or pedantic.
The argument that initialisms should have no different plural form (for example, “If D can stand for disc, it can also stand for discs”) is generally disregarded because of the practicality in distinguishing singulars and plurals. This is not the case, however, when the abbreviation is understood to describe a plural noun already: for example, U.S. is short for United States, but not United State. In this case, the options for making a possessive form of an abbreviation that is already in its plural form without a final s may seem awkward: for example, U.S.’, U.S’, U.S.’s, etc. In such instances, possessive abbreviations are often foregone in favor of simple attributive usage (for example, the U.S. economy) or expanding the abbreviation to its full form and then making the possessive (for example, the United States’ economy). On the other hand, in speech, the pronunciation United States’s sometimes is used.
So, I think this is saying that, even though we say “RBI” stands for “Runs Batted In”, it actually should stand for “Run Batted In” or else it would be RBIs or RsBI. In fact, it is often used to be mean “Run Batted In”. If Wilson singled with a runner on third, we would say he picked up an RBI. So, I think BigB was correct in his usage, but yeah, RBI’s are not a very reliable measure of a player’s true ability.
The Associated Press
sets “RBIs” as the usage in its style guide. FWIW.
Or the Oxford English, eh?
Vlad, I have a huge amount of respect for you, your opinions and especially your baseball knowledge but you are the ultimate pedantic c***!
RBI, RBI’s, R’sBI, RBIs. Does it really matter?
by RDV across the sea on Jun 19, 2009 2:59 PM EDT up reply actions
Ha ha. (Belly laugh).
I searched ‘pedauntless’ and came up with this:
:-D
by RDV across the sea on Jun 19, 2009 3:46 PM EDT up reply actions
Found it!!!
Bring me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad). Posted: January 09, 2009 at 04:12 PM (#3047862)
Poster talking about Vlad – “I love Vlad as a poster, but Jesus Christ on a shoestring is he ever being mind-numbingly pedantic here.”
Vlad’s response – “What can I say? I’m pedauntless.”
by RDV across the sea on Jun 19, 2009 4:05 PM EDT up reply actions
Also
I say sonofabitches, just because sonsabitches never sounded right to me when my Dad said it.
I second that entire statement.
Vlad, you are the man, but I was marginally annoyed that you would even try to correct something so obviously ambiguous. There’s really no clear cut way to say RBI or RBIs. I’m overly perturbed by incorrect grammar just as much as the next arrogant, highly educated human, but that was just something I’d never take the time to address.
If you weren't going to do it...
…then that’s all the more reason why I needed to do it here.
Someone has to stand up for the language, or we’ll all start soundling like LOLcats.

Free your ass and your mind will follow.
by cocktailsfor2 on Jun 22, 2009 9:17 PM EDT up reply actions
It's "grammar"
not “grammer.”
Also, be careful how much you use Wikipedia for any answers.
Strunk and White is excellent, not only for the material it provides, but it’s that skinny kind of book you can always keep handy, instead of some overpriced, heavy grammar book you regret buying later on.
These days there is so much free information on the Internet that there is little reason to keep a stock of dictionaries and grammar books cluttering up your home.
Also
the Twins are far from idiots, if they thought Young was useful at all to anybody they’d be asking for something serious in return. I’m figuring it’s how they ended up with him in the first place, they took a chance on a cheap dump from Tampa. It’s how they manage to survive and succeed. We seem to be emulating that strategy, which I like.
I think we could make a move for Young as longa s we don’t give up to much. I hate his attitude, but he would immediately be the best starter we have for right field. I think he has more potential than Moss and will immediately be better than Delwyn Young. So if we get him, I think he should start every day.
That said, he’s been disappointing so far in his ML career. I don’t think we should give up much for him. He’d be a good buy low candidate, though.
Bucdady: I don’t think the Twins saw it as a cheap dump. They gave up Bartlett and Garza to get Young. That’s pretty significant. They lost that trade, hands down.
www.sixtyftsixin.com
by Sixty Feet, Six Inches on Jun 19, 2009 12:40 PM EDT reply actions
to be fair...
I think he had a couple issues with Tampa, but has had no publicized run-ins with anyone while in the Minnesota organization. At least none that I’m aware of.
Only public run in he’s had with the Twins is his failure to run in to the ball…
Looks to me like he got fat since the last time I saw him. He’s become a singles hitter with a bad glove.
His mother recently died. Both he and Dmitre were very close to their mom, which I saw as the only thing holding him (them) together.
I’d pass on Delmon and will venture to make a call that he will be in some sort of trouble within the next 2 months. Head Case.

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