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ESPN: Cubs "Finalizing" Deal for John Grabow

Photo

More photos » by Lenny Ignelzi - AP

ESPN Chicago:

The Chicago Cubs are in the process of finalizing a trade for Pittsburgh Pirates left-handed reliever John Grabow, a source close to the situation told ESPNChicago.com.

The Cubs have been in the market for a left-handed reliever to firm up their bullpen, and Grabow has been on their radar for a while. Sean Marshall is currently the only lefty in the bullpen.

The Cubs don't have the world's best farm system, but they won't necessarily need it to get Grabow. At the same time, there's no rush for the Bucs to trade him--twith the 2010 payroll as low as it now projects to be, there would be no particular reason not to offer Grabow arbitration after the season so that he could return a compensation pick or two if he left.

Thanks to UtesFan89.

UPDATE 4:21: Dejan Kovacevic says the trade, now including Tom Gorzelanny as well as Grabow, is "just about done."

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DK on Twitter

“Source: Grabow/Gorzelanny just about done”

www.twitter.com/dejan_kovacevic

by dirtyfrank on Jul 30, 2009 4:20 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

It's official

Grabow, Gorzelanny traded to Cubs

By Dejan Kovacevic | 5:41 p.m. Thursday

The Pirates have traded pitchers John Grabow and Tom Gorzelanny to the Chicago Cubs.

Details to come.

by richaude on Jul 30, 2009 5:46 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Return: Hart, Ascanio, Harrison

UPDATE 5:50 p.m.: Pitchers Kevin Hart and Jose Ascanio are the return, according to ESPN Chicago.

5:52 p.m.: The above is official, and add third baseman Josh Harrison to the return.

by richaude on Jul 30, 2009 5:54 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Interesting...

a Class A third baseman…that’s all of 5’8" tall.

by Thunder on Jul 30, 2009 5:58 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah! How dare they trade a situational left hander too! Grabow is the FUTURE!!

Woe is me when does it end?!?!?!

by Mick Kraut on Jul 30, 2009 4:23 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Hey man, he’s the “setup man”. You can’t get to the WS without a closer and setup man. Impossible.

charity standing orders

by BadMaafala on Jul 30, 2009 4:25 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

But…but…

Who will pitch the 8th now?

by MrPedriqueIfYoureNasty on Jul 30, 2009 4:30 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Donnie Veal for the win!

(Everyone go hide in a corner now as Veal walks another batter)

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 4:51 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Chavez doesn’t walk enough guys although I’m willing to consider the other two.

by MrPedriqueIfYoureNasty on Jul 30, 2009 5:02 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

In all seriousness . . .

It obviously depends on the return, but it seems to me the Bucs would be well-served to let Grabow go to FA and offer arbitration. There’s a good chance he’d accept, but if he did, it’s not like he’d command a significant contract. $3-4M, maybe?

by biggyv on Jul 30, 2009 4:25 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I’d rather take the prospects than be on the hook 3-4M for Grabow. Thats a nice signing bonus for a high draft pick or a really good international FA.

by bbxxj on Jul 30, 2009 4:27 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

True

I really could go either way on this. My thinking is that, with the money the Bucs have freed up from the McLouth, Mario, and Freddy trades, they could roll the dice on Grabow not accepting arbitration, because even if he does, it’s not like his salary would cripple them for next year.

by biggyv on Jul 30, 2009 4:30 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Lately

It seems like teams can wait a certain amount of time before signing a player and not forfeit the picks, no? I think either we’d retain Grabow or someone would wait to sign him, nullifying the deal. Still, I’m cautious of ANY trade with the CUBS.

by Yotum on Jul 30, 2009 4:51 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

this has to be sarcasm

being done with a team before even knowing what the return is?
what if the return is a 22 yo Roberto Clemente?

by vherub on Jul 30, 2009 4:35 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

why didn’t they get the 21 year old clemente!!!! nutting is too cheap!!!!

by johnnycuff on Jul 30, 2009 4:36 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Just to fill you in, every few hours another fanpost shows up saying the same crap. Most people are just mocking those at this point.

charity standing orders

by BadMaafala on Jul 30, 2009 4:37 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Just to fill you in, every few hours another fanpost shows up saying the same crap. Most people are just mocking those at this point.

When Captain America throws his mighty shield,
All those who chose to oppose his shield must yield.

by chodan11 on Jul 30, 2009 6:10 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Just to fill you in, every few hours another fanpost shows up saying the same crap. Most people are just mocking those at this point.

When Captain America throws his mighty shield,
All those who chose to oppose his shield must yield.

by chodan11 on Jul 30, 2009 6:10 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Me too.

If I had season tickets, I wouldn’t renew them. Grabow is like a modern day Tekulve.

by IAPiratesFan on Jul 30, 2009 5:06 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Actually

Why would anyone buy season tickets for 2010? I can slam my fingers in the door 81 times for free.

The Pirates should offer a package: Opening Day, Closing Day, and the debuts of Pedro, Lincoln, and… Alderson? Someone.

by JRoth95 on Jul 30, 2009 5:11 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Another good promotion

If you buy tix for the 82nd loss in advance, you get a refund! That should up ticket sales for around Labor Day.

by JRoth95 on Jul 30, 2009 5:12 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ain't gonna take...

til Labor Day to get to 82.

by Thunder on Jul 30, 2009 6:20 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

So true.

Although Hart looks better than VV, so that puts of the Day of Doom another 2-3 days….

by JRoth95 on Jul 30, 2009 6:23 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Go back in time and sue the 86 Pirates too.

Trading away all their best players like Bill Madlock and Kent Tekulve and George Hendrick and Jason Thompson and Marvell Wynne. Trading those guys were just salary dumps, they’ll never win again without them.

by IAPiratesFan on Jul 30, 2009 5:28 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Speaking of Joggin' George Hendrick

He’s the Ray’s 1B coach now and he was on ESPN the other day chewing out BJ Upton for not running out a ball hit off the wall and getting thrown out at 2nd.

Very ironic for anyone who watched him play.

by maguro on Jul 30, 2009 5:31 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Considering Gorzelanny is involved. . .

the trade better return some interesting prospects because there is NO reason to trade him. He doesn’t have a bad contract, isn’t arbitration eligible, has been pitching very well at AAA, has not clashed with management and was very good just 2 years ago.

by Scranton on Jul 30, 2009 4:30 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Yea....

I’m a bit surprised about Gorzo.

by dtoddwin on Jul 30, 2009 4:31 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

and Gorzo will be

biting us in the ass for years if it works out as he’ll be in the same division. Hopefully the same division thing and the timing means that the return is substantially more significant than other teams offered.

Good day.

by Uncle Nate on Jul 30, 2009 4:37 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Why's that?

I can’t say I’m familiar with the Cubs’ prospects; why don’t you like Castro?

by biggyv on Jul 30, 2009 4:40 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I know he's 19 in high A

but he a weak bat compared to Flaherty who is formerly Pedro’s teammate at Vandy. 14HR in low A as a 2B….shades of Chase Utley here. Jackson in AA is another Ohlendorf with a better fastball while McDaniel is a Neal H diamond in the rought.

Maybe Castro will develop into an AS SS or he could be the next Ronny Cedeno.

by BadAndy on Jul 30, 2009 4:45 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

23 in low A though

by scully0505 on Jul 30, 2009 4:48 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

doesn't matter in this case

Selected by Chicago Cubs in 1st Round (41st overall) of 2008 amateur entry draft (June-Reg

With his caliber he should be playing for Lynchburg right now.

by BadAndy on Jul 30, 2009 4:51 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ok, yeah I wasn’t aware of his pedigree

by scully0505 on Jul 30, 2009 4:53 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

You just compared a low A 2B

to Chase Utley?

Well, I guess Utley played in low A at sometime.

by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Jul 30, 2009 5:28 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

There goes my Graboner.

by AdamHyzdu on Jul 30, 2009 4:37 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

What if...

Since Littlefield is with the Cubs the reports of Gorzo being in the deal are erroneous and it is actually Yoslan?

Sorry, just trying to be funny.

Good day.

by Uncle Nate on Jul 30, 2009 4:41 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Yoslan and Grabow for ARam?

charity standing orders

by BadMaafala on Jul 30, 2009 4:42 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

how about we throw in bobby hill and jose hernandez, just for kicks?

by johnnycuff on Jul 30, 2009 4:43 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

If Gorzelanny is involved, I hope they’re getting something actual in return.

by wickethewok on Jul 30, 2009 4:46 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Trading

It’s like day trading; once you get into it you can’t stop. But on a serious note, what’s the logic of depleting all your LH pitchers. This has to be somethng huge in return.

by pizibao on Jul 30, 2009 4:46 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I am not confident that it is something huge…willing to be surprised though.

by Mick Kraut on Jul 30, 2009 4:49 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

+1

Pretty much in the same boat. I keep thinking Grabow.. and Gorzo… can’t be a big return… or could it? Maybe?

by ILLZ on Jul 30, 2009 4:52 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

No one really though Freddy would bring a big return, but…..

by Brakeman8 on Jul 30, 2009 4:54 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

We still have Veal and Dumatrait, which I’ll admit doesn’t leave you feeling too confident, but it’s not the end of the world, not to mention Moskos in AA, who could still make it as a reliever. We also have 2 very decent prospects (Owens/Locke) who are either at Lynchburg or should be.

Still, I agree that it’s not smart unless we get something pretty decent in return.

charity standing orders

by BadMaafala on Jul 30, 2009 4:54 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Remember

This year means squat and there is always a Will Ohman or Alan Embree or someone like that available on the cheap in the offseason to be a LOOGY.

by Brakeman8 on Jul 30, 2009 4:56 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

It's been 35 minutes

Since everyone was saying this deal was done or was nearly done and now nothing. I get the feeling the deal is done, but will not be announced until the Cubs game is over.

by Brakeman8 on Jul 30, 2009 4:52 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

fwiw

the cubs haven’t pulled anyone in their major league game. not sure what’s going on in their minors.

by johnnycuff on Jul 30, 2009 4:54 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

None of the MiLB teams are playing at the moment.

by Brakeman8 on Jul 30, 2009 4:54 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

They didn’t nee to pull ARam, since he wasn’t starting.

charity standing orders

by BadMaafala on Jul 30, 2009 4:55 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

well they did pull derek lee but that’s mostly because they’ve scored a dozen runs today.

by johnnycuff on Jul 30, 2009 4:58 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yea....

probably right.

by dtoddwin on Jul 30, 2009 4:54 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I hate the idea of trading within the division. Especially someone like Gorzo-whatever who will probably figure it out sooner or later. Former Pirates tend to kill the Pirates

by TravisDW on Jul 30, 2009 4:54 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

A lot of people

tend to kill the Pirates, like Mike Hampton

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 4:55 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah

I thought of that right after I posted. But my point still stands

by TravisDW on Jul 30, 2009 4:56 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Speaking of Hampton

he was killed by the Cubs yesterday (like Russ Ortiz today).
Don’t the Astros have to decide to buy or sell and do something?
Lots of older players, and then a couple of pitchers who are getting hammered by everyone not known as the Pirates.

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 4:57 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Also, a bit old...

but did anyone else see Hampton vs. the…Dodgers I think? Where he was just throwing the ball into his glove, missed, and a run scored from like 3rd b/c the ball went into the crowd? Hilarious.

by Yotum on Jul 30, 2009 5:01 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

same with the cubs

Carlos Guillen, the Latino Punto

by The_Fan on Jul 30, 2009 5:01 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

If you have confidence in your GM...

…you should love trading inside the division, since it’s a double impact. You get a good player, and you put the screws to a direct competitor.

It’s only when you have a Littlefield that it becomes a problem.

by Vlad on Jul 30, 2009 5:41 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Not how trades should work

Trades should be win-win as often as possible. If they’re not – if NH gets a rep for “putting the screws” to the trading partner (note the word choice), then he doesn’t get much trade action anymore.

Remember how DL couldn’t make trades because everyone was sick of him overvaluing his guys?

by JRoth95 on Jul 30, 2009 5:43 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Screwing the other team isn't a primary goal.

But if it happened to a divisional opponent, I sure wouldn’t cry about it.

by Vlad on Jul 30, 2009 5:46 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Obviously not

I’m just saying, it’s a fluke, not something you can really plan or achieve regularly.

by JRoth95 on Jul 30, 2009 5:48 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

And naturally the P-G blog won't load

Too many folks trying to access it from their CompuServe accounts, I guess.

by biggyv on Jul 30, 2009 4:55 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Nothing new since DK’s last update about it being almost done

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 4:57 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Cubs are currently playing right now

Top of the 8th so we may not hear anything for another half-hour

ugh

by BadAndy on Jul 30, 2009 4:59 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Like I said....

…I think it’s done and it’s on hold until after the game is over to make the announcement. It is possible a player oin the MLB roster is involved, but just not playing in today’s game.

by Brakeman8 on Jul 30, 2009 4:59 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

cubs players on the bench right now:

pitchers:

r. dempster
k. gregg
a. guzman
r. harden
a. heilman
c. marmol
j. samardzija
j. stevens
r. wells
c. zambrano

hitters:

j. baker
a. ramirez

by johnnycuff on Jul 30, 2009 5:06 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

just eyeballing it, but these are the practical ones:

guzman – average RH reliever
stevens – 26 y.o. RH reliever
wells – young starter. probably not likely.

baker – crappy 2B. possible stopgap.

i’d look for neil’s shotgun approach to A-ball players here.

by johnnycuff on Jul 30, 2009 5:09 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well, softball timeand much like the Pirates, if I don’t go my team will have no second baseman and #2 hitter! ;-)

by Brakeman8 on Jul 30, 2009 5:00 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

They can just move your third baseman over.

charity standing orders

by BadMaafala on Jul 30, 2009 5:01 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm sure your team has a good-bat/no-glove guy to replace you, Brakeman

If they don’t, they could give another team $1 to get one.

by JRoth95 on Jul 30, 2009 5:01 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Brakeman

make sure to stay after the game. They’re going to trade you to the other team.

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 5:03 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

As long as there’s beer, I’ll stay! lol

by Brakeman8 on Jul 30, 2009 5:05 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Only if he hits well.

DO BAD ON PURPOSE, BRAKEMAN!!!

charity standing orders

by BadMaafala on Jul 30, 2009 5:06 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

"Do bad on purpose"

Isn’t that why we ended up with Alderson instead of Bumgarner? :)

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 5:07 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

What happened?

I go away for a little while and you guys lost us Vitters? lol

At least I was glad to find out I was not part of the trade. lol

For those interested, 2-for-5, scored twice and just missed 2 HRs…including what would have been a grand slam to tie our game…but instead was the last out. :-(

by Brakeman8 on Jul 30, 2009 8:27 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Jeez the pirates are really selling

are we that desperate to rebuild? I was hoping we could do a Rays turnaround with the roster we have, oh well

Carlos Guillen, the Latino Punto

by The_Fan on Jul 30, 2009 5:00 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Yes

charity standing orders

by BadMaafala on Jul 30, 2009 5:01 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Not with the lack of talent they had

going into the season. The Rays’ young talent is still leaps and bounds ahead of the Bucs’ talent, but we’re making progress.

by biggyv on Jul 30, 2009 5:02 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

yes

they at least ould have contended for wild card or the division lead until late august or september, as I said, oh well

Carlos Guillen, the Latino Punto

by The_Fan on Jul 30, 2009 5:04 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

if only

we could have picked up a matt morris type player

by SamTheButcher on Jul 30, 2009 5:05 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

haha

Im guessing you don’t like me right now

Carlos Guillen, the Latino Punto

by The_Fan on Jul 30, 2009 5:07 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

i like you

you seem like a nice fellow.

i just don’t think you’re correct in your assessment of the teams talent level.

by SamTheButcher on Jul 30, 2009 5:08 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

good

ya I’m a little too optimistic

Carlos Guillen, the Latino Punto

by The_Fan on Jul 30, 2009 5:12 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

To do a Rays turnaround...

…we need to start with about six years’ worth of good drafts.

by Vlad on Jul 30, 2009 5:42 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

We're

1/3 of the way there, if this draft works out…

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 5:42 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

we’ve already got 2 straight solid drafts, we just need 4 more…

by Akshay R on Jul 30, 2009 5:43 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Beat Me Now

But I wouldn’t be surprised if Micah Houfpouer (sp) is involved

by God Loves on Jul 30, 2009 5:03 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

probably not. they put him in as a PH for derek lee about 20 minutes ago, or after the deal was announced.

by johnnycuff on Jul 30, 2009 5:04 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

i know how highly touted vitters is

but this deal makes me a little apprehensive… i m not sure we win, in that!

by BurgherKing on Jul 30, 2009 5:07 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

they would have pulled him from the game if he was in the deal. he’s still out there.

by johnnycuff on Jul 30, 2009 5:10 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Maybe they've agreed

that if Fox hits a HR before the game ends (after the deal was agreed upon, without him being pulled), the Cubs have to toss him in for free?

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 5:11 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Remember how NH was liking Jeff Baker (Rockies, now Cubs) earlier in the year?

Also a 2nd baseman

by God Loves on Jul 30, 2009 5:08 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

No idea

but Tony Thomas maybe? A 2nd-baseman in AA?

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 5:08 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Provided, of course

that we can’t get Castro/Flaherty/Lee from them.
And Thomas is closer to the majors than those 3…

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 5:09 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

as long as it's not aaron miles

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 5:09 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

i bet he’s in the deal.

by johnnycuff on Jul 30, 2009 5:17 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sun-Times report

Says they’re announcing it after the Cubs game is complete. Top 9 now, so it should be soon.

by biggyv on Jul 30, 2009 5:14 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

1 down

2 to go

Be patient

by BadAndy on Jul 30, 2009 5:13 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

maybe they are waiting for the cubs game to end

by PensRock1 on Jul 30, 2009 5:14 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

if we got fox, i would be pissed, hes already 27

by PensRock1 on Jul 30, 2009 5:15 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I know...

they are down 12-3. They should just give up!!!!!

by joegonzo on Jul 30, 2009 5:17 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Reds

backed off of potential Scott Rolen deal.

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 5:16 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

THEY TRADED THE ONLY JEWISH PIRATE?!?!?

FOR BUBKIS! IM DONE WITH THIS TEAM!

RIP NATE. RIP TONY PLUSH.

"I'D BE A CHEF"

-TONY PLUSH

by GTrain on Jul 30, 2009 5:17 PM EDT reply actions   1 recs

Maybe they'll announce at the press conference...

…that Cutch is converting.

Worked for Carew, right?

by Vlad on Jul 30, 2009 5:43 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

GAME

stay tuned y’all

by BadAndy on Jul 30, 2009 5:18 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Yay...

for Kaz Matsui sucking!

by joegonzo on Jul 30, 2009 5:18 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

game over

Let’s hurry up now, Cubs.

by biggyv on Jul 30, 2009 5:18 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Game over

OK, Chicago. Give us Aramis back now, pretty please.

by Dignan on Jul 30, 2009 5:18 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

my money is on jeff baker + prospects.

by johnnycuff on Jul 30, 2009 5:19 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

the cubs pulled theriot out of the game

by PensRock1 on Jul 30, 2009 5:19 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Looks like it was just a double switch.

by Dignan on Jul 30, 2009 5:21 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Jay Jackson...

pulled from start tonight. ?

by joegonzo on Jul 30, 2009 5:19 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Not a bad start, if that’s what it is.

charity standing orders

by BadMaafala on Jul 30, 2009 5:23 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Not too bad

but I would expect a couple more are thrown in

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 5:23 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

not bad. 22 in AA. lots of Ks, lots of BBs. pitched for furman, which i only note because their football team beat pitt a few years ago.

by johnnycuff on Jul 30, 2009 5:24 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

No

Pitt came from 17 down in the 4th Qtr to beat Furman in 2004.

by maguro on Jul 30, 2009 5:26 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Either way

that’s kinda sad. Isn’t it?

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 5:26 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Hey

That was our BCS team!

by maguro on Jul 30, 2009 5:27 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Even sadder, that was the season Pitt went to a BCS game

by TravisDW on Jul 30, 2009 5:27 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ugh.

And that’s the team the Utes got?
No offense to Pitt, but should’ve been Auburn/Utah that year.

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 5:28 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

No argument, and I’m a Pitt fan. The bad worst thing about that season was it set up unreasonable expectations for Dave Wanndstet that still linger to this day.

by TravisDW on Jul 30, 2009 5:30 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Quit talkin crap on my school

We may not be good at sports, but its damn beautiful here.

by thecheeseisblue on Jul 30, 2009 5:29 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Curious

Where is Furman?

No talking crap on them, but lets be honest… Pitt should’ve blown them out of the water in football

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 5:32 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Oh I know

I was kidding. But it’s in South Carolina. Three thousand students, and a thousand acre campus designed by the architect who designed the capitol building. We go lakes and swans and a formal rose and japanese garden. Take that Pitt.

by thecheeseisblue on Jul 30, 2009 5:33 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah

Beautiful and a damn good school. I’m gonna be paying for it for the next thirty years.

by thecheeseisblue on Jul 30, 2009 5:35 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I got Mardi Gras

so you can keep your lakes and swans

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 5:35 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Damn.

All I’ve got is… uh, smog. Lots of smog. Anyone wanna trade?

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 5:35 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'll look for you

uptown on the ave. next year. I ride Smokey Mary in Orpheus.

"Never mistake motion for action." - Ernest Hemingway

by SubLime on Jul 30, 2009 5:37 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sweet

Now if can remember that…

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 5:39 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Just look for

the drunk guy in a mask . . . oh, nevermind.

"Never mistake motion for action." - Ernest Hemingway

by SubLime on Jul 30, 2009 5:40 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ha

+1

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 5:41 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

In fairness, Michigan actually lost to a I-AA team that wasn’t all that much better than Furman traditionally

by TravisDW on Jul 30, 2009 5:33 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Hey furman is where i go!

by thecheeseisblue on Jul 30, 2009 5:27 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

oh ok. i knew it was something like that.

by johnnycuff on Jul 30, 2009 5:27 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Also, he’s 21, not 22.

charity standing orders

by BadMaafala on Jul 30, 2009 5:27 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

my bad. i’m not good at mathing.

by johnnycuff on Jul 30, 2009 5:28 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Supposedly Jay Jackson was pulled because he’s being promoted to AAA, according to the unreliable Depaoli

by thecheeseisblue on Jul 30, 2009 5:25 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

It says on...

the Tennessee Smokies site he was promoted.

by joegonzo on Jul 30, 2009 5:31 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Guess no Jay Jackson then

by thecheeseisblue on Jul 30, 2009 5:31 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I came over to see if you guys know any more than we do about the trade

I wouldn’t put much stock in who got pulled. with it being a 12-3 game several people got pulled.

---AC 00 00 00 - Believe

by mjk83 on Jul 30, 2009 5:20 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Wow.

So all of them are Pirates now. That’s awesome!

by IAPiratesFan on Jul 30, 2009 5:21 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Comedy

meh

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 5:22 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Around the Horn

Bashing the Pirates at the moment

Steelers - Immaculate Reception. Penguins - Immaculate Rejection. Pirates......Immaculate Resurrection???

by JR89 on Jul 30, 2009 5:23 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Yinzers

will likely use that as a source that the Pirates FO sucks

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 5:26 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Turn on...

ESPN. Around the Horn, killing the Pirates. Plasche is an idiot.

by dtoddwin on Jul 30, 2009 5:23 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I’d rather not.

by scully0505 on Jul 30, 2009 5:24 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

all of the guys on ath are idiots.

at one point they were probably really good journalists, but that was a long time ago.

---AC 00 00 00 - Believe

by mjk83 on Jul 30, 2009 5:24 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Los Angeles reporter

Probably didn’t know who Bay was till he got traded to the Sox

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 5:24 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Meh

I tend to avoid that stuff. It’s good for your constitution.

by biggyv on Jul 30, 2009 5:24 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

KB saying the Pirates should be demoted to the AAA level

Steelers - Immaculate Reception. Penguins - Immaculate Rejection. Pirates......Immaculate Resurrection???

by JR89 on Jul 30, 2009 5:25 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Gee, haven’t heard that one before…

charity standing orders

by BadMaafala on Jul 30, 2009 5:25 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

How about

sending the Mets to AAA. Spend the second most in baseball and can’t get above .500. But hardly anyone bashes them until their GM goes off the deep end

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 5:29 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

He's not been off the deep end?

I mean it’s Omar Minaya, He’s so crazy that it’d be nice for him to get to the point where he’s just off the deep end.

by IAPiratesFan on Jul 30, 2009 5:31 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well

far enough off that they finally had to report something negative about a big market team.

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 5:32 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

If anyone should be demoted it’s Washington. For all the people bashing the Pirates and Neal Huntington, have any of these analysts noticed that we’re still 10 games ahead of the Nationals, despite trading away all but 1 person from our opening day lineup last year?

by Akshay R on Jul 30, 2009 5:46 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yes

Sue the Pirates for trading away the core of a 67 win team. Brilliant

Sad thing is some dumbass fan’s going to be like “Yeah…Yeah!!!! Lets sue!!”

by TravisDW on Jul 30, 2009 5:25 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Go back in time and sue the 86 Pirates too.

In the last two years, that team has been a joke, Trading away all their best players like Bill Madlock and Kent Tekulve and John Candelaria and George Hendrick and Jason Thompson and Marvell Wynne. Trading those guys were just salary dumps, they’ll never win again without them.

by IAPiratesFan on Jul 30, 2009 5:30 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think the question is, who at espn all of a sudden has a bug up their ass about the Pirates? It’s been non-stop killing them for the past week on every single radio and TV show. Are they just now noticing how bad things have been here? Probably

by TravisDW on Jul 30, 2009 5:27 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

even Sportscenter

Mentioning that we’re trying to trade Johnny Depp and the Parrot

Steelers - Immaculate Reception. Penguins - Immaculate Rejection. Pirates......Immaculate Resurrection???

by JR89 on Jul 30, 2009 5:28 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

i would bet

johnny depp outearns our entire major league payroll in a year.

by johnnycuff on Jul 30, 2009 5:29 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Depp

Does he have any velocity on his fastball?

by ILLZ on Jul 30, 2009 5:30 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

NO

But he’s tall, and very projectable. Only 19 a High A!

RIP NATE. RIP TONY PLUSH.

"I'D BE A CHEF"

-TONY PLUSH

by GTrain on Jul 30, 2009 5:31 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

lol

charity standing orders

by BadMaafala on Jul 30, 2009 5:33 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

How many win above replacement do you think he brings?

charity standing orders

by BadMaafala on Jul 30, 2009 5:31 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

If you ask ESPN they ask what wins above replacement means.

by ILLZ on Jul 30, 2009 5:34 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

We should try what the angels did

And become the Boston Pirates of Pittsburgh. Then they can blow us all day and give us a free pass on things like trading for Gagne and Kim

RIP NATE. RIP TONY PLUSH.

"I'D BE A CHEF"

-TONY PLUSH

by GTrain on Jul 30, 2009 5:30 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Oh good

They’re going to talk about it on PTI too. I wonder if they’ll get the name of the players they traded away right? They (not PTI, but ESPN) had a bit of trouble when Andy LaRoo was traded

by TravisDW on Jul 30, 2009 5:32 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I hate that show

Can’t stand Mariotti, Paige, and every other hack on that show

by BadAndy on Jul 30, 2009 5:26 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Pretty funny

keithlaw: Pirates Trade Neal Huntington to Yankees for Four Single-A GMs #fakenews

RIP NATE. RIP TONY PLUSH.

"I'D BE A CHEF"

-TONY PLUSH

by GTrain on Jul 30, 2009 5:33 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I think they should have held out for more of a blue chip GM.

charity standing orders

by BadMaafala on Jul 30, 2009 5:34 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

fwiw

all wgn has said is that they are close to making a deal with the pirates.

---AC 00 00 00 - Believe

by mjk83 on Jul 30, 2009 5:34 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

If it's Jay Jackson?

Can we call him “Shoeless Jay”?

Does he have a moonwalking son named Michael?

Is she really going out with him? Is she going to take him home tonight?

by WstCstBucco on Jul 30, 2009 5:34 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

There’s somethin’ goin’ wrong ’round here.

by ILLZ on Jul 30, 2009 5:36 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Aaah. Nice. I was trying to avoid that line.

by WstCstBucco on Jul 30, 2009 5:38 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

When drawing up your return in a trade...

…don’t stop ’til you get enough.

by Vlad on Jul 30, 2009 5:44 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

doesn’t matter if you’re black or white.

by johnnycuff on Jul 30, 2009 5:45 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah its the GM's Fault

He’s the one making us lose all those games

Steelers - Immaculate Reception. Penguins - Immaculate Rejection. Pirates......Immaculate Resurrection???

by JR89 on Jul 30, 2009 5:38 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm sorry

Did Neal somehow go back in time and trade the ’92 lineup in ’90 somehow?

by TravisDW on Jul 30, 2009 5:40 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I swear.

ESPN is a joke

Steelers - Immaculate Reception. Penguins - Immaculate Rejection. Pirates......Immaculate Resurrection???

by JR89 on Jul 30, 2009 5:43 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

WOW!

Wilbon ripping Neal H a new A-hole…..easy on him homes

by BadAndy on Jul 30, 2009 5:38 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Wilbon is one of the worst analysts I’ve ever seen.

by thecheeseisblue on Jul 30, 2009 5:39 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

The don't even do...

basic research on the topic.

by dtoddwin on Jul 30, 2009 5:40 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

But at least other guys don’t yell about it like they can’t possibly be wrong.

by thecheeseisblue on Jul 30, 2009 5:41 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

How

does that even address the quote?

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 5:42 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I've been scratching my head too

Maybe because Branch Rickey was famous while with the Cards for creating the minor league system where players are bought young by the organization and moved up from Class D to C to B to A to AA to AAA to the majors, and Wilbon is saying that Huntington doesn’t know how to set up a minor league system?

I’m thinking this is giving Wilbon too much credit though. I think he just threw out the only old GM he could name.

by WstCstBucco on Jul 30, 2009 5:46 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Besides Theo Epstein and Cashman

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 5:47 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well, that was quick.

Mentioned the Astros needing to do something… they just released Russ Ortiz after his start today.

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 5:38 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

good

now maybe if they would release hampton we’d be able to beat them.

by johnnycuff on Jul 30, 2009 5:39 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

OMG....

The PTI guys just killed owners and management for 17 losing seasons. Lumping them all together. F>>>>ing Morons.

by dtoddwin on Jul 30, 2009 5:39 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Has anyone else

noticed that all these reporters that rip the Pirates come from big markets?

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 5:40 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

This is just like when Paul Allen passed on Jordan when he was 20 and unconnected to the Blazers!

RIP NATE. RIP TONY PLUSH.

"I'D BE A CHEF"

-TONY PLUSH

by GTrain on Jul 30, 2009 5:42 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah

How dare he do that?

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 5:42 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Hey Pal,

You’re not Branch Rickey.

Yeah, Neal Huntington is alive. But in all seriousness, these GMs have to get started somewhere and even when they had the 08 team together, they weren’t winning. So what would those idiots suggest he do? Just sorta live with what he had and try not to change things? That’s worked so well in the past….

by IAPiratesFan on Jul 30, 2009 5:43 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

PTI

You have to take it as entertainment and not accurate sports analysis. It’s good for what it is. I love Cowherd for the same reason.

by ILLZ on Jul 30, 2009 5:40 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

You love the “Big Market good, small market bad. Rich people good, poor people bad. Taxes bad” Show? That’s pretty much the topic every…. single…. day. It’s the only ESPN show I’ve ever actually quit listening to, and I listen to Mike frickin’ Tirico for god sake.

by TravisDW on Jul 30, 2009 5:43 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

DK: Deal done

by scully0505 on Jul 30, 2009 5:44 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

it's announced per DK

not the terms though. mlbtraderumors says maybe jay jackson.

by johnnycuff on Jul 30, 2009 5:44 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

sorry, here’s the link:

http://twitter.com/mlbtraderumors

RT @kingclip Hearing that the #Cubs may be sending RHP Jay Jackson to the #Pirates in this deal

by johnnycuff on Jul 30, 2009 5:46 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

heard by mlbtr via kevin goldstein
Hearing that the #Cubs may be sending RHP Jay Jackson to the #Pirates in this deal.

http://twitter.com/kingclip/status/2938571900

by johnnycuff on Jul 30, 2009 5:48 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Good news.

I like Jackson.

IIRC, Sickels loves the shit out of him, too.

by Vlad on Jul 30, 2009 5:48 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Hopefully Vitters

punched someone important in the mouth yesterday and they want to get rid of them

by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Jul 30, 2009 5:44 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Now Harold Reynolds

on MLB network, wondering why no one is getting major leaguers back in trades…um Harold, you trade for prospects and prospects are in the minors

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 5:47 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

its called a rebuiding plan

it worked for the Marlins! 2 WS titles

tools these national media are

by BadAndy on Jul 30, 2009 5:48 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ken Rosenthal

now telling it how it is on MLB network. I now have more respect for him

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 5:48 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

is he not completely bashing us for these trades, and does he actually realize what we’re trying to do by making them? I don’t have MLB network, so i can’t actually watch it.

by Akshay R on Jul 30, 2009 5:53 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

he didn't bash at all

he actually stated the exact plan that (at least as far as we speculate) is going on and said it’s controversial and risky but it could work.

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 5:55 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

wow, finally a reporter who is at least willing to accept that there’s a reason that huntington’s doing what he’s doing, other than that he’s an idiot.

by Akshay R on Jul 30, 2009 5:56 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

ya

and they have a couple smart people that actually understand what the Pirates are doing on there which is why I watch them for MLB coverage (until I go back to college in August). Just have to ignore Harold Reynolds

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 5:58 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Colin Cowherd

sang a song about the Bucs at the opening of his show today. It was a parody of Styx.

“Come Trade Away With Me.”

I almost threw up in my car.

by WstCstBucco on Jul 30, 2009 5:48 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

What did he rhyme Andy LaRoo with?

by TravisDW on Jul 30, 2009 5:49 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sometimes I'm really glad

I don’t watch ESPN religiously. Or at all, for that matter

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 5:48 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

or not
RT @espnchicago BREAKING NEWS: Cubs send Hart, Ascanio to Pittsburgh for Grabow, Gorzelanny http://www.ESPNChicago.com

via mlbtr

by johnnycuff on Jul 30, 2009 5:49 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

That's not a bad deal for you guys

Ascanio and Hart have both looked great at the major league level this year.

"That pitch wasn’t down and in, that pitch was down and up." Tim McCarver

by wrigleyrocker12 on Jul 30, 2009 5:51 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

trade

The Pittsburgh Pirates today announced that they have acquired right-handed pitchers Kevin Hart and Jose Ascanio and infielder Josh Harrison from the Chicago Cubs organization in exchange for left-handed pitchers John Grabow and Tom Gorzelanny. The announcement was made by Pirates Senior Vice President, General Manager Neal Huntington.

by Slizeezyc on Jul 30, 2009 5:49 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Harrison is a 10-20 prospect for Cubs

And the other two have looked solid in limited time.

by Slizeezyc on Jul 30, 2009 5:52 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I was really hoping for Jay Jackson

Who are these guys?

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 5:50 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

cubs players

im not familiar with Harrison, but ascanio did alright when they brought him up earlier this year. Kevin hart has pitched about as well as can be expected in his past few starts.

---AC 00 00 00 - Believe

by mjk83 on Jul 30, 2009 5:52 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Harrison could turn into a good player

Can play a few positions, and has the potential to have 280+ average and 20+ home runs. Hart has a little trouble with walks, and Ascanio has looked good in the majors.

"That pitch wasn’t down and in, that pitch was down and up." Tim McCarver

by wrigleyrocker12 on Jul 30, 2009 5:54 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

How many 5'8" players...

have the potential to hit 20 HRs?? Color me highly doubtful on that scouting report.

by Thunder on Jul 30, 2009 6:01 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Mike Fontenot

Was on pace for it last year.

"That pitch wasn’t down and in, that pitch was down and up." Tim McCarver

by wrigleyrocker12 on Jul 30, 2009 7:02 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Not to mention

It was a typo that was supposed to read 10+ anyway.

"That pitch wasn’t down and in, that pitch was down and up." Tim McCarver

by wrigleyrocker12 on Jul 30, 2009 7:06 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Lol, Moskos has 7 BB’s in 2 IP.

charity standing orders

by BadMaafala on Jul 30, 2009 5:49 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Dang!

Is that today?

He’d be a perfect fit for Veal. Can we trade Veal away?

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 5:50 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah, I was bored while all this waiting was going on.

charity standing orders

by BadMaafala on Jul 30, 2009 5:51 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Only 1 ER, though. So 2H, 7 BB’s, 1ER. That’s talent, there.

charity standing orders

by BadMaafala on Jul 30, 2009 5:52 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Almost as good

as Grabow does. Glad we have him to load the bases then get out…oh, nevermind

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 5:53 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

The picked off one guy and Tabata threw another guy out at home.

charity standing orders

by BadMaafala on Jul 30, 2009 5:58 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Bummed we're not gettin Flaherty or Jackson

But Kevin Hart is million times better than Vasquez

by BadAndy on Jul 30, 2009 5:51 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Hart

what position does he play?

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 5:52 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Hart and Ascanio are starting pitchers. Harrison is a second baseman, but DK is saying he’s not in the deal.

by shayborg on Jul 30, 2009 5:55 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

via MLBTR

Cubs press release included Harrison

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 5:55 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

My mistake. Harrison is actually playing third base nowadays.

by shayborg on Jul 30, 2009 5:56 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

it looks like he’s played as much 2B and OF as 3B this year. never played 3B until this year.

by johnnycuff on Jul 30, 2009 5:57 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

gorzo

Isn’t gonna hold back when asked about the deal. I think he’s from chicago,b ut grew up a sox fan.

I know nothing of these players we just got in return.

Good day.

by Uncle Nate on Jul 30, 2009 5:52 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Vazquez wasnt in any long-term plans

and I dont see why we should be trading for short term fill-ins

that said, i havent a clue what we are getting in those 3.

by BurgherKing on Jul 30, 2009 5:52 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

So we got a couple MLB ready guys?

Will that keep the “I’m done with this team” fanshots/posts down after this trade?

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 5:55 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Damn, I really liked Ascanio, he was really good when he was in the Bigs this year.

Kevin Hart doesn’t have that much of a ceiling, but he’s an adequate 5 starter who knows how to bat. Damn, really can’t believe they let Ascanio go.

by NittanyCub on Jul 30, 2009 5:56 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Hart

Assets
Has a good frame for a hurler and a pretty solid arsenal of pitches. Can start or relieve and understands the art of pitching.

Flaws
Doesn’t own overpowering stuff as a starter, so his strikeout total are a little sub-par when in that role. Must cut down on his walk total.

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 5:58 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Gorzo

going to Class AAA Iowa according to DK

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 6:00 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Ascanio

Assets
Has a live arm and the repertoire to be an effective reliever. Proved capable of serving as a closer in the minors.

Flaws
Needs to settle down more so as to avoid serving up a lot of walks at the big-league level. Is a little too hittable.

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 6:00 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Hold on, is the trade Harrison, Hart and Ascanio for Grabow and Gorzo, or just Hart and Ascanio for Grabow and Gorzo?
Because I’ve heard both reports now, and I don’t know which one is true.

by Akshay R on Jul 30, 2009 6:00 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Harrison is confirmed. DK didn’t have him in there initially but added him later.

by shayborg on Jul 30, 2009 6:01 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

thanks, just searched it, and found that the cubs confirmed that harrison’s in there too via press release.

by Akshay R on Jul 30, 2009 6:01 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

By the way

Hart pitched today
IP H R ER BB SO HR PC-ST ERA
6.0 6 3 3 2 4 2 102-65 2.60

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 6:00 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

that’s tough to read
2 BB, 4 K’s, 3 ER, 6 Hits, 6 IP, 2 HR

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 6:03 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Not convinced this is a win

I don’t mind the return, from what I can see, but I’m not sure that it’s worth more than the 2 we had in hand.

by JRoth95 on Jul 30, 2009 6:01 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Yeah, I’m not thrilled about parting with Gorzo.

charity standing orders

by BadMaafala on Jul 30, 2009 6:02 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

If Hart

turns out to be better than Gorzo, then I call it a win. If not then it will be tough to tell until down the road

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 6:02 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think that ends up being the key to the deal

(if nothing else, seems like NH like Hart more than Gorzo)

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 6:03 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Of course

But I’m dubious – he doesn’t look obviously likely to be better than Gorzo. Plus, as a righty, inherently less valuable.

Look, if we get 6 years of Hart as a reliable 4-5 guy, then it’s worth it (barring Gorzo showing 3 years as a 2-3 guy, which is certainly possible, and clearly worth more). But that’s a lot to assume right now.

The other guys are warm bodies – neither one looks likely to be an above-average MLer, although of course that could change.

by JRoth95 on Jul 30, 2009 6:06 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Don't know much about these guys

have to do some reading. That said…

in NH I trust.

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 6:02 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I’d love to blindly trust NH, but I just don’t see any logic to this one. Grabow is arbitration eligible, but the Pirates have his rights. There’s just not much return here. And as disappointing as Gorzo has been due to work ethic/conditioning, he’s an MLB ready starter who’s rights are controlled for years. He could be a cheap filler in case of injury (or trade) and he still has some upside. There was no reason to dump him, unless he’s damaged goods with some undisclosed health issue under the radar, like so many players dealt to the Pirates at the deadline.

by chicos_pants on Jul 30, 2009 6:15 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Hart

is also a MLB-ready starter who’s rights are controlled for years.
Harrison is a MI, which we need.
Ascanio is a RH reliever who has the ability to close.

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 6:17 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Which equals

Ascanio > Grabow
Hart = Gorzo? (maybe better, maybe worse, don’t know yet)
Harrison, much needed therefore=plus addition

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 6:19 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

That's the upside prediction, I think.

Not convinced about Ascanio, from what little I’ve read.

Barring Hart exceeding expectations, it may hinge on Ascanio.

by JRoth95 on Jul 30, 2009 6:25 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

The Pirates actually don’t have Grabow’s rights next year. They can offer him arbitration, but he can decline and become a free agent.

by shayborg on Jul 30, 2009 6:19 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

If I were Grabow I’d have declined and gone the FA route which i’m thinking the pirates know that. A lefty and decent lefty at that.

Pirates could always try to resign him in FA, but idk if we can compete dollar wise.

by lfhlaw on Jul 30, 2009 6:22 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Only if he declines and someone signs him

which I had my doubts he would do so and that anyone would forfeit a pick for him plus the money to sign him.

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 6:25 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

In which case we have his rights

It’s not like Grabow was going to be unemployed next season.

by JRoth95 on Jul 30, 2009 6:26 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't want another year of Grabow

He is bound to have a bad season at any point

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 6:28 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Which is why

you get rid of him on a good season instead of keeping on a year by year basis

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 6:33 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Grabow

Was going to sink sooner rather than later. I think it’s good to get what you can now because no one was going to lose a first-round pick to sign him.

by Slizeezyc on Jul 30, 2009 6:36 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

He could be.

Grabow isn’t any better than other mid-level relievers who’ve gotten jammed up after declining arb, like Manzanillo or Cruz.

by Vlad on Jul 30, 2009 6:37 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Any idea if any of these guys are coming straight onto the Pirates roster, or are they all heading somewhere in the minors?

by Akshay R on Jul 30, 2009 6:03 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I would guess Hart and Ascanio go into the rotation and the bullpen, respectively, and VV heads back to AAA.

by shayborg on Jul 30, 2009 6:18 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ascanio

currently heading to AAA

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 6:18 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

10 percent

With Grabow and his salary gone, the Bucs 2009 team salary going forward will be 10 percent of the Yankees and close to half of the Marlins. The Marlins! Holy smokes, that is an unbelievable statistic.

Here’s hoping that the castoffs we’re getting will amount to more than the loveable losers they are replacing.

by Papa J on Jul 30, 2009 6:04 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Half the Marlins! wow

by scully0505 on Jul 30, 2009 6:05 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Just curious...

and unrelated to this trade…
is a .410 OBP good or bad?

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 6:05 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Good

really good In my opinion

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 6:05 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Anything over .400 is usually considered elite level.

by Schide on Jul 30, 2009 6:06 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Okay

just curious, because the Rockies want Nick Johnson and his .410 OBP bat as a bench bat (via MLBTR) and while that sounded ridiculous, I wanted to make sure…

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 6:07 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

With

how much they are going to have to give up to get him (and I think he’s a free agent at the end of the year), I think it would be dumb to relegate him to the bench

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 6:09 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Judgin from the minor league stats

Harrison is silimar to D’Arnuad with better contact

by BadAndy on Jul 30, 2009 6:05 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

always

good to multiple options to protect from injury, flaming out, etc

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 6:06 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Dejan

Hart will join the Pirates immediately. Ascanio will go to Class AAA Indianapolis, Harrison to Class A Lynchburg.

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 6:05 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

You know, as much as I’m all in favor of this rebuilding plan, that really doesn’t look good at all. But oh well, money doesn’t buy wins

by TravisDW on Jul 30, 2009 6:12 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yep

Just ask the Mets

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 6:12 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Funny

both starters from the Houston and Cubs game are no longer with the team they started for

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 6:08 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I missed...

what happened to Ortiz?? Released??

by Thunder on Jul 30, 2009 6:11 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yep

unconditionally released after the game

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 6:11 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

An easy prediction...

some time before the end of the season…Gorzo shuts out the Pirates on 4 hits.

by Thunder on Jul 30, 2009 6:09 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Ouch

But probably true.

by Brakeman8 on Jul 30, 2009 8:38 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Mister Haahhht

“Mister Hart, here is a dime. Take it, call your mother, and tell her there is serious doubt about you ever becoming a lawyer.”

by WstCstBucco on Jul 30, 2009 6:10 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Nice. Fantastic movie.

by CptnAwesome on Jul 30, 2009 6:17 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Harrison

most of his time has come at 2nd base (until this season). Can we assume the Pirates move him back there?

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 6:11 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Tough to think he can beat out Pedro at 3B.

by WstCstBucco on Jul 30, 2009 6:11 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Isn't

Pedro moving to 1st eventually though?

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 6:12 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I’m anxiously awaiting to see what the PBC does with Pedro at the Arizona Instructional League this winter.

I was sure Pedro was a future 1B up till I’ve watched “Kung Fu Panda” Pablo Sandoval play 3B for the Giants the last couple weeks.

Surely Pedro can’t get as big as Sandoval?

by WstCstBucco on Jul 30, 2009 6:15 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Pedro doesn't appear to have...

…Sandoval’s coordination or lateral mobility.

by Vlad on Jul 30, 2009 6:17 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

You may be right, Vlad. Pablo is like a ballet dancer out there. He’s really fun to watch.

by WstCstBucco on Jul 30, 2009 6:18 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Pahahahahaha

I saw Pedro a couple of weeks ago. Not happening.

God Created the World Out Of Nothing, Paterno Built A National Superpower On Cow Fields...

by fugimaster24 on Jul 30, 2009 6:21 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Always more valuable

to be able to play multiple positions.

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 6:13 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think so

Unless Delwyn’s the 2b of The Future.

by JRoth95 on Jul 30, 2009 6:18 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yinzers

are kinda angry on the PBC blog
Complaining about another doubles hitting 3rd baseman (even though he can play 2nd as well) and that Gorzo is better than Hart, and that Ascanio is garbage because he’s a middle reliever (essentially what Grabow was)

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 6:16 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Well

they’ll complain about anything.

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 6:18 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Are you sure they're wrong?

Honestly, this smells like a trade for trading’s sake.

It would take the return guys maxing out potential and the going guys crapping (Nady/Marte style) out for this to pay off.

by JRoth95 on Jul 30, 2009 6:20 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Grabow and Gorzo have both had very high walk rates in the majors the last couple years. It’s not hard to imagine them both flaming out.

by shayborg on Jul 30, 2009 6:20 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Fair enough

It’s also easy to imagine Hart pitching about like Ohlendorf, Ascanio pitching like Jackson (or worse), and the fielder never even reaching the bigs.

These are not anything like can’t-miss guys.

by JRoth95 on Jul 30, 2009 6:22 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

They weren't

going to get can’t miss guys though. Unless Gorzo becomes a number 2 and Hart remains a number 5, this trade is at least equal on both sides

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 6:24 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Right

They were going to get “Can’t Miss” guys from Grabow and a AAA pitcher.

by TravisDW on Jul 30, 2009 6:28 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

AAA Pitcher?

Be serious. He’s been a 14 game winner, with better peripherals that year. There are issues, but if NH hadn’t been screwing around on his arbitration, he would have been starting in Pittsburgh since June.

by JRoth95 on Jul 30, 2009 6:30 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Whatever the reasons

He’s been in AAA most of the past two years and when he’s been up here his ERA’s been over 6. If you thought you were getting anything of note for him you’re nuts. Now the argument could be made “why trade him in the first place?” but I think it’s obvious Neal doesn’t really think much of him

by TravisDW on Jul 30, 2009 6:47 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

If Hart pitches like Ohlendorf...

…then that’s a win for us right there. Gorzo isn’t particularly likely to reach that level ever again, and Grabow is a middling reliever with bone chips in his elbow.

by Vlad on Jul 30, 2009 6:38 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

How do you figure

Grabow is a free agent at the end of the year and is basically a LOOGY. Ascanio has the ability to be better than him. Hart is doing good in the majors right now while Gorzo has started in the majors this year at all. They could end up equalling out and it would still be a win. Plus, the Pirates got a much needed MI

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 6:22 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Gorzo hasn’t started because NH hasn’t wanted him to start. It has nothing to do with talent or aptitude. Gorzo’s ceiling is higher, IMO.

Grabow went 6 perfect batters yesterday. That is not LOOGY material.

The Pirates have MIs at A. What they lack is MIs at AA, AAA, or MLB.

I’m not saying it’s a terrible trade. I’m saying it feels like a mediocre trade, with a best-case* upside of “not much.”

  • best realistic case, obviously. Gorzo gets run down by a bus tomorrow, and it becomes a big win

by JRoth95 on Jul 30, 2009 6:29 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Grabow

is viewed as a LOOGY by everyone else. One good outing doesn’t change a pitchers status.
Better ceilings is debatable and will never be solved even 20 years later because of injuries and situations being factored in.

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 6:32 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Even after getting Sherrill?

Besides, they have Capps+ in Broxton, no?

by Yotum on Jul 30, 2009 6:23 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah

no idea what they’re thinking, but if they’ll pay up, I’ll take it.

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 6:23 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Dodgers want Capps???

Wonder what the world looks like through Ned Colletti’s eye glasses?

by WstCstBucco on Jul 30, 2009 6:26 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

maybe we could buy low on Ivan DeJesus Jr? didn’t he break his leg earlier this year?

by los angeles bucco of anaheim on Jul 30, 2009 6:29 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yes.

Broken leg, out for the year.

by Vlad on Jul 30, 2009 6:40 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

progress

have you heard anything about how he’s recovering? I live in los angeles, but the funny thing about successful teams is that people don’t pay attention to the minors.

by los angeles bucco of anaheim on Jul 30, 2009 6:46 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Wait a minute

I can see the logic of trading Grabow, but Gorzo, a LH starter? For this? I haven’t had doubts about the money issue, but this is a bit reminiscient of a certain team cleaning house before selling itself. I’ve been a HUGE NH fan, pls help explain.

by pizibao on Jul 30, 2009 6:19 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I'm guessing

NH is higher on Hart than Gorzo. Truthfully no idea though.
Or they know something about Gorzo that we don’t…

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 6:21 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Gorzo already has three years of service time, while Hart barely has one. Hart is about the same age and has been better in the minors recently. They’re probably not that far apart in value.

As far as Grabow goes, he’s not a great pitcher, so I’m happy that we got two useful players back for him.

by shayborg on Jul 30, 2009 6:25 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yep

seems like NH prefers Hart to Gorzo.

That leaves Grabow for Ascanio + Harrison

by UtesFan89 on Jul 30, 2009 6:26 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

The explanation:

Gorzo isn’t ever likely to pitch again the way that he pitched in 2007. He hasn’t shown the same type of stuff over the last two years, and he’s got persistent issues with both command and platoon splits. Also, he came to camp out of shape, and he’s dumb as a bag of hair, which limits his coachability.

A lot of people here are assuming that he’s a sure-fire rebound, and he’s not. He’s a back-of-the-rotation guy or lefty reliever, from here on out, most likely.

by Vlad on Jul 30, 2009 6:42 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Looking at the PBC synopsis

of the three players the Bucs got, i feel like this could be a good deal. The Cubs fan don’t like it over at the SB Nation blog of theirs so that’s gotta be something

Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock

by Green_Wave on Jul 30, 2009 6:30 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

The smarter of the Cub fans I know...

…seem disappointed to be losing Ascanio, so that’s a good sign.

None of these three were really on my radar, so I can’t comment too much on what I think of it just yet.

by Vlad on Jul 30, 2009 6:49 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Youse guys

came up with some funny sheaut in this thread. Only wish I’d been home from work to appreciate it & contribute.

That being said, I’m not sure I like this trade as much as the others.

Evaluation time is in order here.

Cheers,

cocktailsfor2

Free your ass and your mind will follow.

by cocktailsfor2 on Jul 30, 2009 11:39 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

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