Pirates Sign 12th-round Pick Jeff Inman
by Charlie Wilmoth on Aug 14, 2009 6:21 PM EDT
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The Pirates have signed 12th-round pick Jeff Inman, a pitcher from Stanford. Inman had a terrible season in 2009, but he was a highly regarded prospect before that, so the Pirates paid a well above slot bonus ($425,000) to lure him away from a senior season at Stanford. There's a lot of downside risk here, but there's also upside as well. The Pirates have now signed all of their first 14 picks, and I'm not sure there's any reasonable argument to be made that the controversial selection of Tony Sanchez with the fourth overall pick was due to a general unwillingness to spend money.
In fact, they've spent a ton, much more than I thought they would, getting a surprising number of tough-to-sign prospects under team control. Now that they have, I give the 2009 draft my endorsement. I wasn't on board with the Sanchez pick when it happened, but his hitting so far has swayed me a little, and I like the idea of spending a little bit on a hitter rather than a lot on a pitcher, since amateur pitchers are always such a risky proposition. The next few picks after that (Victor Black, Brooks Pounders, Evan Chambers) didn't do much for me either. But the players the Bucs got in the late rounds--Zack Von Rosenberg, Colton Cain, Trent Stevenson, Joey Schoenfeld, Inman--more than make up for any questions I might have about the first few picks. If the Bucs were to sign a couple more players by the deadline, too, all the better.
* * *
I have some friends here from out of town right now and haven't had as much time as usual to watch the games, but it's hard not to notice a 17-2 score, particularly after some of the other blowout games the Pirates have been on the wrong end of recently. I'll try to refrain from commenting much on the last week or so until I can get to a computer and watch some of the archived games, but in general I'll say this--whenever there's a period of bad baseball like this, there are always a ton of people ready to be angry.
The fact, though, is that the Pirates are still a sort of garden-variety bad team, and every garden-variety bad team has stretches like this. Things should improve, at least to a degree, if only because no team is this bad for an entire season. The trades the Bucs made a couple weeks ago weakened the talent of the team in the short term, but not nearly enough to turn them into the Cleveland Spiders. They should bounce back and return to garden-variety bad baseball, which isn't necessarily fun, but at least will have the benefit of showing which of their dozen or so marginal major leaguers deserve a clear shot at a job next year. I don't mean to apologize for bad baseball, but I do see it as a necessary evil right now while the Bucs continue to sort things out--the groundwork for the Pirates' struggles this season and next was laid years ago. It is fair to get angry, but it's not particularly fair to draw draconian conclusions from the trades. The Pirates weren't good before them, either, and there wasn't much they could have done this year to change that, and they're not as bad now as a couple weeks of bad baseball make them look.
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Oh, Charlie
The people who would get most upset about this have no idea what a Cleveland Spider is/was!
They'd know...
After they looked them up on Wikipedia.
by IAPiratesFan on Aug 14, 2009 10:53 PM EDT up reply actions
Fun with small data sets and crappy pitchers: Chris Bootcheck came into the game with an ERA of 21.60 and managed to make it go UP.
Hahahaha.
I’d like to see another pitcher achieve that.
by IAPiratesFan on Aug 14, 2009 10:51 PM EDT up reply actions
Masumi Kuwata could
He managed to be worth -3.2 million dollars in only 21 innings.
by thecheeseisblue on Aug 15, 2009 1:20 AM EDT up reply actions
At this point…the Pirates need to have all 25 men participating on a near daily basis. No one…other than Cutch…is showing on a DAY TO DAY basis that they deserve to be in the lineup. While I agree that Jones should be playing MOST games…a day or two off should be SOP. Even today…down 15 runs…doesn’t miss an inning.
Cruz is playing like once a week. If you have a terrible team…shouldn’t he play a little more as well?? It’s not like he’s getting much of a shot either. Let’s find out what we have over the last 50 or so games. That way we know exactly what needs done during the off season. By October 4th…the Pirates should know EXACTLY what they are doing with Jones, Pearce, Moss, Young, Salazar, Cruz…and most of the pitching staff. Some of those decisions are fairly obvious. We should not enter Spring Training 2010 still wondering about whether some of these guys are capable of holding a job in the majors.
Russell/Jones
I think Jones hits the soft spot that a guy who was a backup in his playing days and got his start managing in the minors would have for AAAA, organizational soldier types.
We already know what some of these guys are bringing to the table.
Which is why we don’t need to give extra looks to guys like Cruz or Salazar. They aren’t going to be a big part of the future, no matter what they do over the last month-and-a-half.
Cleveland Spiders
Maybe the reason they aren’t the Cleveland Spiders is because the Pirates won more games than Cleveland did before sending everyone out of town. The post deadline Pirates most definitely resemble arachnids. Garden variety bad team? To quote management, " This is the group we wnat to move forward with". Arrrrrrrrgh!
Yawn
I’ve heard better. Carry on.
Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock
The Cleveland Spiders...
…once hired a starting pitcher out of the crowd gathered to watch the day’s game outside the stadium.
Just wanted to throw that out there, in case you’re serious about trying to compare us to them.
well, i dont know… i m kind of curious over what we paid Inman. I looked over his stats, and he’s always had a high WHIP, always had a high ERA, and the K:BB ratio is nothing great. Why is he so highly rated? I know the stats are from college, unlike some of the others who have dominated high school hitters, but it still seems a rather large bonus to pay for Inman. I cant see him going higher if he were to go back for a senior year.
Looking over Heller and Cooper’s stats, they are far better. I know Cooper is not likely to sign, as posted by Vlad in an update, but I wonder if they might not have had a better shot with some of the others… i admit i dont know much of what is left out there- it just seemed like a high sum to me for someone who seems to be much more chance-y
Great stuff but inconsistent
From pgcrosschecker.com:
“He has a loose arm and easy arm strength. Last night his first pitch, according to the broadcast, was 93 mph. He topped out at 94 and didn’t throw a fastball below 89, and the pitch shows more sinking life in the 89-90 range than it does in the 92-94 range. He also throws an upper-70s curveball and a changeup that also sits in the upper-70s. When each pitch is at their best, it’s hard to think of another pitcher in the country that has as good of a three-pitch repertoire as Inman.
The problem is consistency. He will throw one pitch that is an absolute thing of beauty, and then on the very next pitch he’ll throw a straight fastball straight down the pipe, hang a curveball or hurl a changeup that doesn’t change."
Rest of the article lhere.
Maybe it's a case
where the Bucs’ pitching instructors can work on that inconsistency. Could be an inability to repeat his delivery or something.
given that stevenson got 350K
i m surprised. Most opinions I read had Stevenson higher than Inman. It could be that the Bucs seem unlikely to be able to sign any others, and took what they could get, even if they had to go higher since they had the available money. If he can work it out, great! I’ll just say I have some reservations over the amount spent here, but I m happy to see another addition- hopefully it didnt cost us a different potential signee
by BurgherKing on Aug 15, 2009 12:58 AM EDT up reply actions
An inability to repeat the delivery...
…is usually a stone bitch to fix, compared to any specific mechanical flaw (like an overstride or a head whack or whatever).
Pleassssssseeeeee
It must be the air we breathe or something in the water. This team is playing on a publicly funded field, making a tidy profit, with a wishful thinking plan for the future. My God, if this is such an admirable direction for the future, why oh why, isn’t any other team doing it? It’s because you cannot win with AA ballplayers in the major leagues. And please don’t tell me about Tampa Bay; they had people running the team with good baseball sense. We do not.
I wrote last week that this team will not win 10 games for the rest of the year and that we are five years away from a winner, but only if something happens in the next five years that we don’t see yet. They look just like every other Pirates team in August for the last 10 years – bad with NO help in sight. I read all this talk of our losses last year at this time were worse than this year’s. What a load of junk! There is no soul in this team as there isn’t in the front office. The Bay trade is a bust and we have no reason to believe any of the other deals made this year will be any better.
Angry? Darn right I’m angry. The death of baseball in Pittsburgh and we have a group of ninnies telling us that a good group of 18-year-old draftees is the hope for this organization.
But what else are they going to do?
Other than try to gather a ton of young talent and hope enough of it pans out to field a good major league team eventually?
I’m honestly curious about what people who say things like this think the Pirates can actually do to get better other than what they’re attempting right now.
I’m guessing it would b something along the lines of having the Nuttings sell to team to someone like Mark Cuban, who would then fire all management across all levels, install their own guys who are the best GMs, coaches, and managers etc. Then somehow acquire enough revenue to consistently plunk down $150 million a year in free agents and signings.
Except
the Mavericks haven’t won a damn thing. So much for Cuban being so brilliant.
Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock
I’ve always wondered why so many fans think it’s so easy simply to plunk down many millions of dollars and buy a championship team. If that was a viable path to success, why aren’t there lots of rich guys like Mark Cuban out there buying up mid- and small-market MLB teams, bankrolling big FA signings, and waltzing to the World Series every year? Why is it that everybody else in the Pirates’ position is trying to build a winner through their farm systems? Are they all idiots, or cheapskates?
This was actually one of the more coherent posts
bashing the current regime thats been written on this site. To that I say well done.
And for your example I present the Florida Marlins circa 97-98. They also had another rebuild and the Indians had one in the 90s and are doing it again this year.
And you must be blind for saying there is no help in sight (see what I did there…fun with puns). I would explain but I get the feeling you wouldn’t argue directly and would only circumvent the points I make.
I also don’t get how you can say the FO doesn’t have good baseball sense after two years on the job. The Rays completely retooled their front office and got a new controlling owner after the 05 season and in their first two seasons they lost 101 games then 96 games. And this was with more talent in their system and at the big league level than the Pirates had two years ago. Maybe their fans should’ve turned on them after two seasons also.
I mean they traded starters at pitcher, first base, shortstop, a couple top prospects that were thought major league ready, and a handful of other starters and major league players. Now you are likely saying..well they didn’t trade all their major league roster away did they? Look at their 2005 starting lineup and you will see their is only one starter that was on the 08 World Series team…Carl Crawford (and he was/is better than any player that the Pirates FO has traded away). The only starting pitcher they kept was Scott Kazmir. They rebuilt from current prospects and trading for more prospects.
They had more talent in their minor league system at the time of their rebuild and it still took them three years to get to be competitive. Next time, do your research.
I’m sure you’ll have a big response that dodges any point I’ve made though and will more than likely circle around to the words salary dump, cheap, and WE HAD THE BEST OUTFIELD EVER!!!.
Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock
Maybe if you got it the first time
I wouldn’t have to repeat it
Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock
We get it.
Your points are good points as always. It’s the frustration of being this bad after 17 years that have people chasing their tails. I understand why and what the Pirates are trying to do and support them. I didn’t envision them challenging for the # 1 draft pick though. After a generation of losing and no doubt a few years more, the toal house cleaning is scary. Which leads to some rants. What the current management is doing is something that needed to be done long ago. If it had been we may be discussing waiver trades instead of Bay, Nady and McClouth. The bad old days don’t seem so bad when things get worse. Rebuilding after 17 years of losing is a tough nut for a lot of fans to crack, maybe some understanding and fewer insults would help. . Tulane?
I understand completely
I haven’t had a winning team to enjoy that i can remember and I don’t like to lose even more. I just rather have a year or two of absolutely terrible and painful teams followed by (hopefully) competitive teams than more years of mediocre to poor teams. Which is the point I try to make to people who don’t like this rebuild. It may be easier for me, though, because all i have cheered is a losing team.
I apologize for the insults to you and other people who deserve to not be insulted. I will try to do better about them in the future.
And yes, I currently attend Tulane and will be a sophomore this year.
Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock
Major League Concern
I truly believe Mr. Littlebrain screwed us and we have to rebuild the whole system. I am very happy that the pirates are spending money in the carribean and on the draft. I do think N.H.‘s overall strategy is solid and will lead to winning seasons. All that being said I am very concerned about our current major league roster. We got Mr. Milledge for next to nothing and he has a good deal of upside, but his defense is attrocious. He just does not get good reads on balls in left field. It is not a lack of hustle, but rather a lack of judgement. I hope he puts a lot of time in during the winter to improve his outfield play (LF) or his upside will be a complete waste. Mr. LaRoche has been steady with the glove, but he has shown no signs of power. I have watched many games and have seen very few AB’s where he has driven the ball past outfielders in the gap or over outfielders heads. He is a fairly big guy with a swing that is too long for true strenght and extra-base productivity. Mr. Moss has been a complete wash and is doing nothing to prove he belongs on the major league ball club. He is way too easy going and concerned about making friends with umpires and opposing players. He is from Georgia and he needs to get a bulldog mentality and stop being Mr. nice-guy. His average, home run numbers and rbi’s are totally pathetic for a guy with so much “supposed” talent. I am beginning to believe he is nothing better than a double a player. Look at Seth Smith from the Rockies along with there other young corner outfielders and compare stats with pirate corner outfielders. Moss has had his oppurtunity and unless there is a major turn around he should not be a part of next years club. Pearce is getting his oppurtuinity but his power is not enough to overcome his lack of discipline at the plate and his inability to make contact. I do not even have time to get into the serious concerns about the pitching staff at the major league level. I just hope that pirate fans (myself included) can endure another two or three seasons of abysmal performances. I know there is a light at the end of the tunnel, but I think it is further away than many realize!
When better players come along
those guys will lose their jobs. That simple. The difference (one of many) between this Pirates team and the ones from 2-3 years ago is, there are people in the system NOW who CAN and/or WILL eventually push Milledge and LaRoche and Moss for their jobs; 2-3 years ago there was nobody pushing anybody.
With regards to Milledge in left..
…It’s pretty clear he’s not completely comfortable there, but hey look at it this way:
The Pirates are not going to be competitive until AT LEAST 2011, at the very soonest. By that point Milledge will have either learned to play left field and developed into an everyday contributor, moved to right field (a generally easier position to play, especially at PNC), or he’ll be bumped out of the system for Tabata and Gorkys.
My best guess: Milledge improves defensively at Left field to the point of respectability, the Pirates trade him for a different positional need (Sort of a Delmon Young to the Twins deal) and bring Gorkys up to play left.
Gorkys
Is having a shaky year, and I’d say his stock is falling rather than rising right now, so don’t assume he gets a job — even though he is a strong defender.
Gorkies
Should never be viewed as a legitimate Major League corner outfielder. If he is your corner outfielder….kiss competitive good-bye
There is no reason his
ceiling isn’t carl crawford or around there
Maybe not quite the stolen bases, but good average, 10 HR’s and 30+ steals plus stellar defense is just fine for a corner outfield.
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Aug 16, 2009 12:24 AM EDT up reply actions
His plate discipline
Is a problem, and he also tends to swing like a slugger rather than the type of hitter he really is from my understanding.
Plus
He’s not stealing this year, and when he does he hasn’t been that successful.
I said ceiling
like high high up there. That was in response to “Gorkys should never be viewed as a legitimate Major League corner outfielder. If he is your corner outfielder…. kiss competitive good-bye.”
Last time I checked, the Rays made the world series last year, and there is no reason we can’t do it with our form of Crawford lite.
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Aug 16, 2009 12:06 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't disagree with that statement
I just don’t think at this juncture they are in the same ballpark.
for some reason
I don’t like Gorkys. Maybe it’s that article where he said something along the lines of competing with Cutch for centerfield or something. Seems to have an attitude about him. Then again, maybe that’s a good thing. It’ll be interesting to see what type of player he becomes.
Show me a guy whos afraid to look bad, and I'll show you a guy you can beat every time. -Lou Brock
Eh
I’m not sure that’s something to dislike. To be successful at any competitive sport above probably in-house leagues, you have to have that swagger, that confidence in yourself and it pretty much has to border on cockiness for you to be successful. You definitely want him to be a guy who believes he can succeed. That being said, if he doesn’t learn how to swing the stick to fit his body type (or learn how to grow into a slugger’s body without taking steriods, which is preferred but less likely) I will be a little hesitant to put him in the lineup. Ceiling, yes that excites me about him, but he needs to start being more productive at the dish
The glare of the spotlight is harsh, and the pressure that success breeds immense. We revere our heroes, but expect much. And criticism can come as easily as praise.
Milledge
I’m watching BP and they’re really working on milledge with balls in the outfield, and pearce has shown some nice power too bad he can’t show us it in a game, but it will come eventually.
A trust your scouts signing
His numbers just aren’t that great. But obviously Neal sees something he likes or really trusts his scouts.
It sounds like he has good stuff. But the college numbers are ordinary.
I wonder if the Pirates really wanted Cooper but his number just didn’t come down to what they thought was reasonable.
He hurt his shoulder last season.
Coming into the year he was considered a mid-first round talent by some.
“Absolutely nothing to look forward to?” That opinion is absolutely shortsighted. A potent roster is developing before our eyes in both the Major and Minor Leagues.
Those dissatisfied with current moves must have been more than satisfied with prior moves that REALLY gave us nothing to look forward to. I look down the roster and notice that the names of Matt Morris, Derek Bell, Pat Meares, Sean Casey, Jeremy Burnitz, Joe Randa, Raul Mondesi, and a host of “no-names” are missing – and I rejoice! I am very happy to sit back and watch players like McCutchin, Milledge, Jones, Young, and even Pierce and Moss develop rather than the cast of misfits we have seen over time. As for guys like Bay – why it is doubtful that even the big-money Red Sox will be able to sign him. I miss his bat, but certainly not his contract.
Relax some and enjoy the 2009 Bucs. Remember when the Pens were promoting the youngsters instead of hoisting the Cup?
In regards to your last sentence
Probably not, because Pittsburgh abandoned the Pens when they were promoting the youngsters. They only came back when they were looking like a playoff team.
I’m still convinced that half the town thinks that Sidney Crosby and Evgeni Malkin were big-name free agent signings and that if “the Nuttings” weren’t so cheap the Pirates could have their very own. That, or they think some kind of voodoo made a bad team a good team. Or that Mario used his awesome influence to will it to happen.
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