Joe Martinez DFA'd To Make Room For Kevin Correia
I thought Martinez might be useful as depth, but I won't lose sleep if the Pirates lose him.
UPDATE by Charlie: Not a surprise. I think there's a pretty decent chance Martinez gets through waivers. I think he's a somewhat better pitcher than he showed since arriving in a trade from the Giants - most of that ugly Indianapolis stat line is the result of him allowing a lot more homers than he probably will in the long run. He'll never be a rotation staple or anything, but he gets enough groundballs to be modestly useful as a Jeff Karstens type in the next few years.
over 1 year ago
gonfalon
27 comments
0 recs |
Email
PrintComments
Not surprising
I figured it was Martinez or Leroux.
I suspect he’ll pass through and get a spring training invite.
I guess not.
I thought some AL team would like to have him around to DH. Maybe they did and they just weren’t offering enough to NH for a trade to happen.
by IAPiratesFan on Dec 22, 2010 3:50 PM EST up reply actions
It does kind of make you wonder...
…why they went ahead with the Lopez trade, if they were just going to block Bowker with Overbay and then waive Martinez.
by Vlad on Dec 22, 2010 7:27 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Best they could get
Keeping Lopez had no upside and they probably couldn’t do any better. Guys like Martinez and Bowker, with uneven track records and both in their late 20s, are going to get only a limited chance to impress. Bowker was mediocre in extended time in Sept. and Martinez was terrible in AAA. And they’re both still around (I bet Martinez clears waivers). Low-probability options still have value and NH gave up nothing of long-term value.
Keeping Lopez had no upside…
I’m not convinced that’s true. Lopez is a solid lefty reliever, and he wasn’t likely to get too much more than a million bucks in arb for 2011. We’re very shaky as far as LHRP is concerned right now. Ledezma isn’t exactly rock-solid, and behind him, we’ve got Moskos, Watson, or a NRI like Thomas as options for the second lefty in the pen. Lopez would have been better than any of those guys.
Also, Lopez put up a 2.34 ERA last year. He wouldn’t have to do all that much in 2011 to earn classification as a Type B and bring back a sandwich pick (if we didn’t get any offers we liked at the 2011 deadline, of course). It just seems like a waste to move him if we weren’t going to take at least one long look at either of the guys we got back in return. Bowker didn’t even get 100 PAs with us, and Martinez was pretty much an afterthought down the stretch.
Yeah, I agree with you. In the end it might have been just for the insurance of having the Bowker option in case he couldn’t get something he thought was better. There’s no doubt I would rather have Lopez now than two guys unlikely to make the team.
by MarkInDallas on Dec 23, 2010 12:46 AM EST up reply actions
Lopez was a cheap and effective reliever
I agree w/ Vlad…it is another move that appears haphazardly thought out…to trade him for nothing w/ out allowing a “FRESH START IN SPRING” or chance to compete for a position…sometimes it takes a month or two to get acclimated after a trade.
NH was lucky enough to get Resop via waivers…that 11 other teams in NL put a waiver in on him indicates he opened scouts eyes in AAA…call if a gift horse…and a quick evaluation of our roster (by anyone who knows baseball) screams out “WE NEED BETTER STARTERS”…what’s NH’s first thoughts (GM and MGR of course), we traded Dotel so we can fit him there at middle relief and move others back..so we can get back to that .330% again…that’s non logical in every sense of thought…
RESOP’s starting numbers were dominant…better than EVERY PROSPECT in our system….that nearly 40% of his pitches in AAA were offspeed (almost B Myers like) is a nice sign of his “startability”…that his career as a reliever was not only bad but also injury ridden would suggest either he starts or he’s a nothing in a probability…lastly IMO that Atl loved his arm yet wouldn’t keep him as a reliever is another tell IMO.
NH has to realize…a starter is more important that a middle reliever…and his job and truly the managers job is to put each player in a position to reach his best production/ and teams best production…NH hasn’t done this from day 1…guys playing positions they have no business playing/ fringe guys handed starting jobs w/ out competition…
I’m not saying Resop was going to step in and pitch 2.10 ERA for us…but at the very least, HE HAD TO BE GIVEN THE CHANCE TO SEE IF HIS DOMINANT NUMBERS CARRIED TO MLB…the guys got a nice arm and apparently decent off speed stuff when starting…common sense tells you…"Hey, this guy just might be that stud late bloomer…and his numbers suggested there’s a REAL chance of that being true…only a non-thinker/planner wouldn’t even entertain the idea…w/ respect to our rotation.
I have no idea what agreeing with Vlad and Chris Resop have to do with each other.
And I have no idea who you are talking about when you say “to trade him for nothing w/ out allowing a "FRESH START IN SPRING" or chance to compete for a position”.
Who are you talking about there? Who was that done to?
by MarkInDallas on Dec 24, 2010 12:04 AM EST up reply actions
Also, by July 31, it wasn’t clear that Jones would be a huge liability yet. Jones did decline in July, but only really fell off the planet in August/September. If Jones still looked decent with the bat, they might have went with Bowker in the outfield. But now, they are not comfortable with both Bowker and Jones.
by Adam Reynolds on Dec 25, 2010 3:37 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Yeah...
But at the time of the trade they probably didn’t know they’d be signing Overbay.
by IAPiratesFan on Dec 22, 2010 10:52 PM EST up reply actions
Which means something ...
1. The Pirates think Bowker really sucks.
2. The Pirates think Overbay can actually play.
Bernie.....
You forgot the real reason….
3. The Pirates are not going to put a young first baseman out there for a full year any more while Alvarez and Walker are still trying to get comfortable in the field (and you probably could even throw Cedeno in there.)
I’m not sure why some can’t understand that the Overbay signing was about defense. First and foremost. When half of the core of your team is playing in the infield (and you’ve got an inconsistent shortstop out there as well), an experienced, good-glove first baseman becomes a necessity. The answer for that is not Pearce, not Jones and not Bowker. Overbay is a good choice for this team. After Walker & Alvarez have a few major league years under their belt, then you could see the Pirates putting an inexperienced glove over there, if need be (or Alvarez, if it comes to that). Though, I would love to see Pedro stay at 3rd for his career (if Bobby Bonilla played there, ANYBODY can.) I’ve often wondered, if Pedro might find himself in right field someday, as opposed to first base.
Overbay
I agree that Overbay pays decent defense.
But I do not think he’s worth that contract on a team as bad as this one.
Also, you can find slick fielding 1b anywhere. They could have brought Kotchman to camp if defense was the top priority.
Except
Casey Kotchman is a lefty who can hit neither lefties nor righties and never has been able to.
by MarkInDallas on Dec 24, 2010 12:09 AM EST up reply actions
Mark
From 2007 through 2009, his AL statistics aren’t really different from Overbay’s statistics.
And Kotchman always looked solid with the glove to me.
I wouldn’t have signed Kotchman. But if you gave me the choice between Kotchman on a NRI and Overbay at $5 million, I would have taken Kotchman.
He is young enough that there is a small chance he bounces back.
Overbay is a declining player.
Bounce back?
It’s possible Overbay might be a declining player, but Kotchman has nothing very interesting to bounce back to.
Since I’m mostly interested in platoon options, here are their wRC+ splits against RHPs…
Overbay:
2006: 144
2007: 78
2008: 131
2009: 140
2010: 111
Kotchman:
2007: 126
2008: 89
2009: 103
2010: 82
So, Overbay had one year 4 years ago that sucked, while Kotchman has had 2 of the last 3 years that he has sucked. And Kotchman’s best year, which was 4 years ago, is not even nearly as good as Overbay was 3 of the last 5 years.
With the exception of Overbay’s 2007 year, his production against RHPs is very close to what Adam LaRoche has done against RHPs.
LaRoche:
2006: 140
2007: 110
2008: 129
2009: 136
2010: 112
Now, is that something that’s going to propel us to a division title? No, but it’s better than nothing, and not really too expensive, considering LaRoche was getting $7M his last year with the Pirates.
by MarkInDallas on Dec 24, 2010 1:52 PM EST up reply actions
Mark
The comparison I made was 2007 through 2009.
Overbay averages 116 in that time.
Kotchman averages 106 in that time.
Do I think Overbay is better. Marginally, yes.
Do I think he’s declining? Yes, I do.
Do I think Kotchman has a small chance of becoming the player he was three years ago? Yes, a slight chance.
its a one year deal, its not like its a multi year
plus kotchman has not and probably will not show anything that made him a #1 prospect years ago. his glove is awesome, granted. everyone knows that alvarez is the 1B of the near future, so dont complain that we get a guy on a one year deal who is not blocking anyone of substance… and yes, i think pearce and bowker are not in overbay’s league
So was the Burnitz deal a one-year deal
The point I’ve made—and many others—is that it’s not the best use of $5 million.
The team is going to be awful. I’d have preferred that $5 million be spent on a good relief pitcher, who could have been flipped at the deadline.
It could have been used for international signings.
I don’t get a really bad team signing a mediocre player, especially when I don’t think anyone else was really considering him.
Improved 1B defense isn't likely to help Pedro or Walker all that much.
Both were primarily deficient in range last year, and a new first baseman isn’t going to make Walker any better at going to his right, or Pedro any quicker to react. Pedro did also have some throwing problems, but his bad throws were generally of the “hit the peanut vendor in the back of the head” variety, rather than throws that an actual human being could field. As such, if the rationale was what you suggest, it was poorly thought-out. Particularly insofar as the old and declining Overbay is at best only a slight defensive improvement on Pearce.
by Vlad on Dec 23, 2010 9:06 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
I’m hoping that Overbay and Pearce end up in a platoon situation, which might actually produce pretty decently.
by MarkInDallas on Dec 24, 2010 12:10 AM EST up reply actions
Random Ed Creech comment
Pirates scouting director Ed Creech said the organization has decided Lincoln will begin his career at Low Single-A Hickory or High Single-A Lynchburg. That’s an indication of how highly the Pirates value the 21-year-old, whose fastball has reached 98 mph.
The organization’s routine when drafting college pitchers is to send them to short-season Williamsport. That’s where John Van Benschoten began his career in 2001 and Paul Maholm in 2003. Bryan Bullington, drafted first overall in 2002, didn’t sign until after the season and debuted with Hickory the next year.
Those pitchers, though, were viewed as middle-of-the-rotation starters. Lincoln, it appears, is a cut above.
“We see him as a high-ceiling starter,” Creech said. “We know what we’re getting here. We’re very happy.”
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
Related FanPosts on Bucs Dugout
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recent FanPosts
Baseball Nation Recent Stories
In Association With
Big League Stew - MLB - Yahoo! Sports
- Baltimore’s tradition of fans shouting ‘O!’ during national anthem sparks interleague feud
- Chris Perez follows rant against Cleveland fans with even better rant against Cleveland fans
- Pitcher Clayton Richard gets key pinch single in 13th after coming in 0 for 16
- Livan Hernandez welcomes ball boy to the bigs with shower of sunflower seeds (VIDEO)
- Man beaten by four others in Dodger Stadium parking lot
