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Around SBN: Lance Berkman Could Have Torn ACL

Rule 5 Open Thread

While you wait, you can enjoy Vlad's annotations of BA's Rule 5 list and his own list of top candidates. You can also have fun with this CBC.ca preview of the draft, which for some reason lists Pirates organizational reliever Michael Dubee as a top candidate to be drafted by the Blue Jays, and also posts a picture of Dubee that is actually a picture of Bryan Morris they ripped from the Post-Gazette. Oops!

I think there's only the remotest chance of Dubee being drafted today, for whatever it's worth. He doesn't have nearly enough upside to justify being picked.

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For pitcher, i still prefer Aneury Rodriguez to Elvin Ramirez, not so talented but younger, has true outcome and a SP is always better than a RP IMHO.
For position player, Josh Rodriguez is a good fit since we lost Hardy, otherwise Brad Emaus is my choice.

by taiwania on Dec 9, 2010 3:33 AM EST reply actions  

NH

I think NH is a bit tough on the talent.

I’d still try to go for two guys:

1. Aneury Rodriguez

2. Emaus or Josh Rodriguez. Dan has posted some interesting things about Rodriguez and, I wonder like Vlad, whether he could contribute right away.

Prediction: The Pirates trade the top pick but do pick a player.

by Bernie6 on Dec 9, 2010 4:43 AM EST reply actions  

+1

After sleeping on it…

I feel we should draft A Rodriguez first…the guys only 22 at AAA…and he’s pitched well…plus he dominating winter ball…numbers even better than Ramirez. I know NH worries if a guys not throwing mid 90’s…which is always nice but this guy is young, advances and appears to be a “PITCHER”…not a thrower.

D Sanchez is a good example of a guy who succeeded after coaches (in LA) taught him to pitch…If A Rodriguez’s FB is sown a couple MPH’s yet his numbers are getting better…I hardly feel it’s a concern right now…if he lost MPH and getting hit hard (alderson)..then it’s a concern.

I know it’s not the normal but if J Rodriguez makes it to rd 2…you have to take him…he may be better than Cedeno right now (If NH would only allow a mgr to have competition for jobs)…but he’s played all 3 inf positions,..he’s cheap…his upside is much much MUCH greater than the expected bum we’d sign for that position…Hall,amezega,the crosby’s Vazquez,Gomez ect…

If either proves to be a bum…it cost us 25K…chump change

by Dan Jenkins on Dec 9, 2010 7:58 AM EST up reply actions  

you had me until...

If NH would only allow a mgr to have competition for jobs.

by white angus on Dec 9, 2010 8:06 AM EST up reply actions  

I just thought it's be nice

for shi!s and giggles…to let someone earn their starting role

by Dan Jenkins on Dec 9, 2010 8:10 AM EST up reply actions  

You mean like how Lastings Milledge earned his, then sucked?
You mean like how Neil Walker earned his, then was pretty good?
You mean like how Garrett Jones earned his?

I’m not sure where you get this idea that there’s no competition for jobs.

www.stealingfirstbase.com

by Nate Rose on Dec 9, 2010 1:11 PM EST up reply actions  

How did Milledge earn his

his .270 w/ no HR’s at AAA…and Clement earn his?…thank god AKI got hurt or Walker would still be at AAA and a sept sit on the bench call up…

by Dan Jenkins on Dec 9, 2010 1:18 PM EST up reply actions  

Milledge earned his by out-hitting Ryan Church.

Walker was called up and getting some playing time before Aki got hurt.

Clement, I’ll give you.

www.stealingfirstbase.com

by Nate Rose on Dec 9, 2010 1:19 PM EST up reply actions  

I have to admit

NH’s FA signings last year were so so poor that there wasn’t a whole lot of anything there.

Clement was known to be the starting first baseman during the winter months BTW…there were NO job comps…but as I said, when you bring in guys like they did…Crosby I thought had a chance to be an upgrade but …

This year…I feel they have to grab a Lee for 1B…we need a bigger bat at 1B, preferably RH’ed to protect Alvarez in the line-up.

I;m also hoping J Rodriguez jumps on this opportunity and is given atleast a chance…Cedeno may out play him but he needs to be given the chance to beat him out.

SP? Sounds like Lincoln and Morton are already zapped out

by Dan Jenkins on Dec 9, 2010 2:30 PM EST up reply actions  

My prediction: Brad Emaus becomes a Pirate today.

by Suffering Buc on Dec 9, 2010 7:04 AM EST reply actions  

Vlad

I’ve seen Dubee mentioned as a possible pick by a couple of people. Mostly, as with the CBC article, by people who don’t actually know anything about him other than his bloodline and stat sheet.

by Vlad on Dec 9, 2010 7:11 AM EST via mobile reply actions  

I've seen a few articles too

And I can’t believe there is much interest in him.

And I can’t believe he’d make it through spring training before being returned.

by Bernie6 on Dec 9, 2010 8:21 AM EST up reply actions  

The Jays, I believe, have the largest number of scouts scouring the minor leagues. So I trust they will choose someone a scout has seen multiple times and really believes in. The Jays did get Ronald Uviedo in the Eveland trade, so they should know Dubee quite well. Doubt he’s the choice, but you never know.

by bolton on Dec 9, 2010 8:27 AM EST up reply actions  

From what I've read...

I guess the Buccos take a player to trade with the first pick and then draft a second for themselves.

I would guess that we see a pitcher first and then a position player second.

by pantherboy on Dec 9, 2010 8:05 AM EST reply actions  

Elvin Ramirez

I’ll tell you what, at 6’3" 208 lbs, and 22 yrs old throwing 94-98…hard to pass on, esp. for NH. His walk numbers are up, but he is only 22 years old – sounds like a “thrower” and not quite a “pitcher” yet.

Vlad: you took a look at the youtube vid (blocked by my employer) – how “fluid” is his delivery on the few pitches you can see?

I see that Ramirez was moved to the ’pen for 2010…and his K/9 numbers went back up. But starting, in A-ball, he was only striking out 5.9/9? Those are Tim Alderson (with a dead arm) numbers, not a 21 yr old throwing 94-98.

A. Rodriguez logged 113 innings vs. AAA competition at the same age, and seemed to fare better against them. He’s also carrying 23 less pounds on his frame than Ramirez. It’s just a DAMN shame neither of these guys were lefties…oh wait, then they wouldn’t be unprotected in the Rule 5!

by insane_sanity on Dec 9, 2010 8:05 AM EST reply actions  

insane

watching the video (only a side view which isn’t great)….he’s choppy, shortish stride…and it appeared whoever he was facing was getting decent wood/alum on the ball…not many swing and misses on the 3 different videos I saw.

the numbers and the video at first glance has me like a rod better.

by Dan Jenkins on Dec 9, 2010 8:15 AM EST up reply actions  

just noticed that brock bond was available from the giants

saw him play. terrific OBP in his career, good fielding 2B… no power however. if he had a little pop you would be hearing his name more often

by white angus on Dec 9, 2010 8:15 AM EST reply actions  

Yeah.

But as low-power and focused on walks as he is, he sets off my Jackie Rexrode alarm.

by Vlad on Dec 9, 2010 10:40 AM EST up reply actions  

Langosh says shortstop Josh Rodriguez is the likely selection.

by bolton on Dec 9, 2010 8:36 AM EST reply actions  

He would make total sense, given that Huntington knows him from Cleveland and the Pirates fanned on Hardy and Bartlett.

by bolton on Dec 9, 2010 8:39 AM EST up reply actions  

I’d personally take a pitcher, too. Maybe Pedro Beato or Wynn Pelzer, both from Baltimore.

by bolton on Dec 9, 2010 8:46 AM EST up reply actions  

This is my only problem with the pick.

He’s probably mostly peaked by now, due to his age.

I still think I’d rather have seen Emaus – younger, and far more acceptable K rates.

Hey, an out is an out - unless you're Mario, in which case it's probably two outs. -UtesFan89

Hard work always beats talent if talent doesn't work hard.

Hey, if you’re gonna call us birds you might as well call us chickens. -Leafer87

by wg1of5 on Dec 9, 2010 8:46 AM EST up reply actions  

injuries have derailed him

he is an injury risk…but he’s a very talented kid when on the field

by Dan Jenkins on Dec 9, 2010 8:49 AM EST up reply actions  

I don’t like Billy Rowell at all as a potential pick. Pirela is tough to predict without seeing, like all A-ball shortstops, but the BA guys compared him to Reegie Corona last night, and that’s not exactly an inspiring comparison.

by Vlad on Dec 9, 2010 10:42 AM EST up reply actions  

What do we know about his defense?

Because I agree, with his batting #s it’s perplexing that he hasnt had a shot in MLB.

by Pghfan987 on Dec 9, 2010 8:52 AM EST up reply actions  

From what I’ve read, he’s only adequate at short.

by bolton on Dec 9, 2010 8:53 AM EST up reply actions  

I suppose that’d be added defensive value over Emaus, who doesn’t play short at all from what I understand. Still, it’s a slightly puzzling pick to me.

Hey, an out is an out - unless you're Mario, in which case it's probably two outs. -UtesFan89

Hard work always beats talent if talent doesn't work hard.

Hey, if you’re gonna call us birds you might as well call us chickens. -Leafer87

by wg1of5 on Dec 9, 2010 8:55 AM EST up reply actions  

Adequate at short...

…is better than inadequate.

And given that we’re apparently sticking with Pedro, Walker, and Jones in their spots from last year, a small downgrade in shortstop defense would be coals to Newcastle at this point.

by Vlad on Dec 9, 2010 10:43 AM EST up reply actions  

I can live w/ that

upside is there…and it’s definitely a position of weakness.

I fully expect to hear from NH…J Rod will compete for our back up/ utility position.

White angus…I will need a swig of ouzo if by any chance that we hear NH say..“We are bringing him in to compete for the starting SS position, which is wide open.” Hearing that would make me giddy w/ joy…it’s be the first sign of a changing philosophy in PGH

29 other GM’s that have poor production at a position would announce something along those lines IMO

by Dan Jenkins on Dec 9, 2010 8:45 AM EST reply actions  

Agreed 100%.

by Adam Reynolds on Dec 9, 2010 9:09 AM EST via mobile up reply actions  

Dealing with a dead car battery.

Stupid cold. Will have to catch up later.

by Vlad on Dec 9, 2010 9:01 AM EST via mobile reply actions  

That’s like Santa having sleigh problems on Christmas.

by bolton on Dec 9, 2010 9:03 AM EST up reply actions  

I need a new car, is what I need.

Mo’ money, mo’ problems? Maybe, but I’d like to personally verify that one of these days.

by Vlad on Dec 9, 2010 10:36 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Rec'd.

Free your ass and your mind will follow.

by cocktailsfor2 on Dec 9, 2010 11:08 AM EST up reply actions  

Good

Solid selection. Hopefully this means we don’t sign Alfredo Amezega or some other lousy veteran utility guy.

by maguro on Dec 9, 2010 9:05 AM EST up reply actions  

Agree a lot

Esp if the guy’s bat is advanced beyond hit glove, then he’s useful off the bench. You’d like a better glove as well, of course, but NH’s record with FA UTs is pathetic – J-Rod’s going to be better than almost anyone we were likely to sign.

Still sad about Hardy.

by JRoth95 on Dec 9, 2010 10:23 AM EST up reply actions  

+2

Free your ass and your mind will follow.

by cocktailsfor2 on Dec 9, 2010 11:09 AM EST up reply actions  

seattle took

jose flores, 2 cleveland guys

by BurgherKing on Dec 9, 2010 9:04 AM EST reply actions  

Looks like J Rod

He will compete for a Relief pitching spot, which is teh first sign of a TOTALLY different philosophy here in phgh.

by Wizard of Woz on Dec 9, 2010 9:04 AM EST reply actions  

AZ – joe patterson, SFG, AAA

Bal – Adrian Rosario, RHP, Mil

KC: Adcock

by BurgherKing on Dec 9, 2010 9:05 AM EST reply actions  

Anyone know how long the first round goes?

I would like to know how long I can do work without missing a possible second rounder.

by Wizard of Woz on Dec 9, 2010 9:05 AM EST reply actions  

Eh.

Can’t see Adcock sticking with them.

Hey, an out is an out - unless you're Mario, in which case it's probably two outs. -UtesFan89

Hard work always beats talent if talent doesn't work hard.

Hey, if you’re gonna call us birds you might as well call us chickens. -Leafer87

by wg1of5 on Dec 9, 2010 9:05 AM EST reply actions  

yeah

he could stick in KC… also a big pitchers park, to help a little

by BurgherKing on Dec 9, 2010 9:18 AM EST up reply actions  

I think he'll be back w/ us

  I like him more than Pribanic (who I think is worthless)…but that said…I think it’s a bit of a stretch for him lasting the year.

 Adcock is a good pitcher…smart…but his stuff isn’t all that great…reminds me of D Mccutchen a little.

by Dan Jenkins on Dec 9, 2010 9:22 AM EST up reply actions  

Harsh?

  on Pribanic? He doesn’t have a prayer to ever make the bigs..or to compete in the bigs.

  Adcock is a better pitcher, no question about it IMO

by Dan Jenkins on Dec 9, 2010 10:11 AM EST up reply actions  

You might be right about Adcock>Pribanic, but I think Pribanic has a shot to pitch in the big leagues. Generates a lot of groundball outs.

by bolton on Dec 9, 2010 11:00 AM EST up reply actions  

Not particularly thrilled so far.

Hey, an out is an out - unless you're Mario, in which case it's probably two outs. -UtesFan89

Hard work always beats talent if talent doesn't work hard.

Hey, if you’re gonna call us birds you might as well call us chickens. -Leafer87

by wg1of5 on Dec 9, 2010 9:07 AM EST reply actions  

Adcock, crap

I saw here Dubee could go, and on Bonus baby, that someone could take NEgrych.

by hilltoppeer on Dec 9, 2010 9:08 AM EST reply actions  

yeah

same here, a little disappointed they didnt protect him… we had space… we’ll see how this plays out

by BurgherKing on Dec 9, 2010 9:11 AM EST up reply actions  

Min

Scott Diamond… weird

by BurgherKing on Dec 9, 2010 9:09 AM EST reply actions  

Sounds like it’s nearly back to us.

Hey, an out is an out - unless you're Mario, in which case it's probably two outs. -UtesFan89

Hard work always beats talent if talent doesn't work hard.

Hey, if you’re gonna call us birds you might as well call us chickens. -Leafer87

by wg1of5 on Dec 9, 2010 9:09 AM EST up reply actions  

Well it was fun while it lasted

1 26 year old SS with no ML experience. Should have snagged Pirela or Rowell. It’s not like we’ll compete.

by hilltoppeer on Dec 9, 2010 9:12 AM EST up reply actions  

One would think that

he would have at least had a cup of cofee in the bigs, especially with Cabera missing a lot of time last year.

by hilltoppeer on Dec 9, 2010 9:15 AM EST up reply actions  

Why he hasn’t played in the Majors.

by Pghfan987 on Dec 9, 2010 9:18 AM EST up reply actions  

Some players are blocked, some develop later. Not everybody makes their debut at 21 or 22. Utley and Howard were almost 25 when they made their MLB debut.

by Dorn on Dec 9, 2010 9:20 AM EST up reply actions  

great point, and luck plays a part too

if thome didnt get hurt, howard would have debuted with another team

by white angus on Dec 9, 2010 9:22 AM EST up reply actions  

I was wondering

why our new guy wasn’t getting playing time over this guy

by Pghfan987 on Dec 9, 2010 9:24 AM EST up reply actions  

I wish all drafts were this quick.

by bolton on Dec 9, 2010 9:10 AM EST reply actions  

He’s from the Padres. An OF with no power.

by bolton on Dec 9, 2010 9:25 AM EST up reply actions  

no upside pick

pass on ramirez for a back up ss ,wow !!

by melikie yung tang on Dec 9, 2010 9:21 AM EST reply actions  

If he can hit .280

he should start. Tired of watching Cedeno flounder at the plate, and make mental errors in the field.

by hilltoppeer on Dec 9, 2010 9:24 AM EST up reply actions  

Yea, but it makes me sad.

That’s why I would have drafted Pirela as well and dumped Cedeno, and let the two battle it out. Keep one as utility. That said JRod does seem to have good pop. He could hit 10-15 HR’s

by hilltoppeer on Dec 9, 2010 9:27 AM EST up reply actions  

Yes but,

there’s really no reason to keep him is there? It makes much more sense to take a shot on a couple youngsters when the bucs have no shot at competing this year. Might as well let some young talent try and break through.

by hilltoppeer on Dec 9, 2010 11:49 AM EST up reply actions  

Just because we're not going to win many games

doesn’t mean you have a black hole @ SS.

Free your ass and your mind will follow.

by cocktailsfor2 on Dec 9, 2010 12:30 PM EST up reply actions  

+99999999999999999999999999999999999

  If he outplays Cedeno in spring…he should be start…and visa versa.

by Dan Jenkins on Dec 9, 2010 9:28 AM EST up reply actions  

4 deep

  the bucs are 4 deep at minor ss who project to back-ups in the major leagues. We could have used a power arm for our bullpen.

by melikie yung tang on Dec 9, 2010 9:45 AM EST up reply actions  

at least i didnt make another fanpost

and go… FILLER FILLER FILLER FILLER FILLER etc……………

by white angus on Dec 9, 2010 9:26 AM EST up reply actions  

Wow

That’s cheap – practically an NRI. Good deal.

by JRoth95 on Dec 9, 2010 10:31 AM EST up reply actions  

The Bucs should look into a trade with KC so that KC can send Adcock down to the minors—it could be a win-win assuming that we don’t really care to get Adcock back.

Rodriguez is a better option than Diaz was, so we used the Rule 5 to improve the major league roster (assuming the plan was to have Ciriaco start in AAA).

by TNbucs on Dec 9, 2010 9:27 AM EST reply actions  

you may have something there

maholm and adcock for butler??? gasp!!!!!!!!!! lolol… figure i would be a yinzer for a second

by white angus on Dec 9, 2010 9:28 AM EST up reply actions  

Adcock has to go through waivers first

Everyone confuses this point, but KC and Pittsburgh couldn’t work out a trade for Adcock until he passed through waivers first.

by gorillagogo on Dec 9, 2010 9:35 AM EST up reply actions  

What I’m not sure about, though I suspect you’re right, is whether the waivers requirement is there for trades. I know a player has to pass through waivers before he is offered back to his original team for $25,000, but if the two teams work out a trade, does the player still need to pass through waivers? I was thinking when DL made the trade with the Mets to get Bautista back, there were no waivers involved. But I didn’t pay that close attention, and I don’t remember the details about the Meek trade. On the other hand, you would think there would be many more trades of Rule 5 picks if waivers were not involved.

by TNbucs on Dec 9, 2010 1:01 PM EST up reply actions  

The only way Adcock can be sent to the minors — by any team — is if he clears waivers. When the Mets traded Bautista to the Pirates, he had to remain on the Pirates active roster the remainder of the season because he never went through waivers.

by gorillagogo on Dec 9, 2010 1:11 PM EST up reply actions  

That makes sense. So Meek must have passed through waivers prior to the trade.

by TNbucs on Dec 9, 2010 1:20 PM EST up reply actions  

Yes, Meek went through waivers prior to the trade.

by gorillagogo on Dec 9, 2010 1:57 PM EST up reply actions  

It would be interesting if KC does try to pass Adcock through waivers to see if any other team would claim him. It’s surprising that he was selected above guys like A. Rodriguez and Ramirez.

by TNbucs on Dec 9, 2010 1:24 PM EST up reply actions  

Jim Callis of BA tweets about J. Rodriguez (i refuse to say jrod)

“Offensive-minded utility type. Bench fodder, not a potential regular. "

by bolton on Dec 9, 2010 9:31 AM EST reply actions  

if ciriaco is in AAA, where does that leave mercer/d'arnaud/friday?

i said that i wouldnt be surprised if d’arnaud started in altoona again, but now im thinking that ciriaco would be the utility guy in Indy.

by white angus on Dec 9, 2010 9:31 AM EST reply actions  

Cesar Valdez

is the player coming to the Pirates to complete the Zach Duke trade

by BigB2323 on Dec 9, 2010 9:47 AM EST reply actions  

Huh.

That’s actually not bad. I can see circumstances under which he’d be useful.

by Vlad on Dec 9, 2010 10:34 AM EST up reply actions  

In your opinion

Does the acquisition of a guy that puts the ball on the ground alot like this indicate the coming of a better defensive team? Or am I just completely over reacting at this point?

The glare of the spotlight is harsh, and the pressure that success breeds immense. We revere our heroes, but expect much. And criticism can come as easily as praise.

by glass0941 on Dec 9, 2010 12:24 PM EST up reply actions  

Hard to say.

Not many guys get more ground balls than Pribanic, and his pickup sure didn’t signify any new commitment to infield defense.

by Vlad on Dec 9, 2010 1:17 PM EST up reply actions  

Rodriguez has a better Zips projection than Cedeno and the other internal options, and his defense at short grades out as average. So sure, he may not be a championship-level starter. But better than what we have at the major league level? I think so.

by Adam Reynolds on Dec 9, 2010 9:53 AM EST via mobile reply actions  

If J-Rod is a UT guy

But a decent one who sticks for 5 years, that picks seems fine for me. could save us some decent coin in the long run.

by Pghfan987 on Dec 9, 2010 10:01 AM EST reply actions  

If this means no repeat of Rivas, Gomez, Crosby, et al., I’m happy.

by WTM on Dec 9, 2010 10:08 AM EST up reply actions  

J-Rod

could be the next Gomez, Rivas, Crosby himself

by BurgherKing on Dec 9, 2010 10:29 AM EST up reply actions  

Hey!

That’s our new backup SS you’re insulting, pal.

by JRoth95 on Dec 9, 2010 10:32 AM EST up reply actions  

Hey!

It may turn out that its our new starting SS I’m insulting!

by BurgherKing on Dec 9, 2010 10:33 AM EST up reply actions  

any info on Travis Scott??

the catcher that the Pirates grabbed in Round 2 of the AAA phase from Arkansas (the Angels affiliate)

by impliedi on Dec 9, 2010 10:16 AM EST reply actions  

wow

has been mashing A ball pitching for the last 4 years. Clearly, the Angels hate him!

by BurgherKing on Dec 9, 2010 10:30 AM EST up reply actions  

He actually hasn't.

Check the park. High Desert is a totally absurd offensive environment, right up there with Lancaster and Colorado Springs and such.

by Vlad on Dec 9, 2010 10:35 AM EST up reply actions  

well OK

but that still doesnt mean you leave him there for 4 years. You keep promoting him till he shows you he cant handle it. Unless they were that stocked…

by BurgherKing on Dec 9, 2010 10:36 AM EST up reply actions  

he was ranked behind clement... lol

but seriously, it is kinda funny that he stayed in Aball for almost 4 years. hes just minor league catching depth is all

by white angus on Dec 9, 2010 10:47 AM EST up reply actions  

he is

but it doesnt seem like he had a chance to do anything more… of course, for all you know, maybe he cant even catch balls, much less throw out runners and call a game!

by BurgherKing on Dec 9, 2010 10:55 AM EST up reply actions  

Nope.

It’s a weird part of the AAA phase, he is “picked” by Indy but can go onto any roster, doesn’t have to spend a day on the Indy roster.

by impliedi on Dec 9, 2010 11:00 AM EST up reply actions  

That ballpark had a 33-18 game a year or two ago.

by WTM on Dec 9, 2010 11:03 AM EST up reply actions  

Organization guy

He’ll be 26 in the spring and hasn’t played above AA.

He looks like an organizational catcher.

by Bernie6 on Dec 9, 2010 10:21 AM EST reply actions  

He’s put up some nice hitting numbers, but they were at High Desert, which is like being able to dunk a basketball in an 8-foot basket.

Org. catcher, probably headed for Bradenton.

by WTM on Dec 9, 2010 10:24 AM EST up reply actions  

in anticipation of 3 MiL catchers having their jaws broken in ’11.

by JRoth95 on Dec 9, 2010 10:33 AM EST up reply actions  

Was just looking up his stats and stuff....

I saw that he was in the Seattle organization until this summer, then signed on with the Rockford team in the Independent League to finish out the summer. The Angels just signed him as a minor league FA last month.

Strange, that he seemed to have pretty decent numbers in 2007 at high-A ball, but then was stuck there for the next three years (where he continued to put up decent numbers, but didn’t advance until last year.) Wonder if he was blocked in the Seattle minor system or if there’s some giant hole in his game that kept him there.

I was going to ask where the Pirates have a catching hole, but WTM, you answered it with Bradenton. I’m guessing he’ll take Tony Sanchez’ spot on that roster as I assume Sanchez might be Altoona-bound.

by impliedi on Dec 9, 2010 10:34 AM EST up reply actions  

predictable but still disappointing:

“He ’s a guy that will compete to make our club
as our utility guy”

by Adam Reynolds on Dec 9, 2010 10:34 AM EST via mobile reply actions  

i m curious

as to the logic behind (what was it, 6 or 7) teams passing on Brad Emaus. The pursuit of upside, I imagine, but I still don’t get it. I mean, this guy is ready right now, wouldnt have to be hidden terribly, and there’s some chance he could provide decent offense at 2b/3b. At worst, you’ve a min salary guy as your bench player for 6 years

by BurgherKing on Dec 9, 2010 10:38 AM EST up reply actions  

maybe Emaus is ready to do absolutely nothing?

none of us have ever seen the guy play, right? how could we possibly know what he will do in the majors? lyle overbay and casey kotchman totally destroyed minor league pitching and ended up below average major leaguers

by white angus on Dec 9, 2010 10:49 AM EST up reply actions  

I think that some people...

…are underestimating the impact of park effects on Emaus’s raw line last year. He’s got some skills and is IMO worth having on a roster, but he isn’t ready to start right now, and his bat isn’t going to be as robust as the raw line might suggest. He also isn’t tremendously athletic, and it hurts that he can’t play short.

by Vlad on Dec 9, 2010 10:57 AM EST up reply actions  

so waht

So whats the logic in passing up the 2nd round pick?

 just to keep a extra roster spot open? or is there another reason?

age of last winning season: 5

by Bobby Hill on Dec 9, 2010 10:44 AM EST reply actions  

MLBTR Just Posted This

The Pirates seem to be close to a deal for Kawakami, tweets Biertempfel. He says money is one issue, as is the possibility of the Pirates moving Paul Maholm.

Am I reading that correctly as in they want to send Maholm to the Braves for Kawakami? I’m hoping that they threw that in there to say that Maholm may be dealt but just not necessarily to the Braves.

by Hegs on Dec 9, 2010 10:46 AM EST reply actions  

what angus said

the Braves want to get rid of Kawakami, not add another starter who would be in the back of their rotation

by BurgherKing on Dec 9, 2010 10:54 AM EST up reply actions  

No

It sounds like the Pirates have a deal in place to get Kawakami but will only do the deal if they move Maholm elsewhere for prospects (or possibly a major league ready player) and to free up salary.

by Brakeman8 on Dec 9, 2010 10:57 AM EST up reply actions  

To me...

…it sounds like they are interested in adding Kawakami if another, separate deal for Maholm goes through.

by Vlad on Dec 9, 2010 10:57 AM EST up reply actions  

Vlad

What do you think they will be looking for in a Maholm deal?

by patthatt on Dec 9, 2010 11:01 AM EST up reply actions  

That would make sense.

I just wonder who is out there worth a Maholm deal.

by patthatt on Dec 9, 2010 11:06 AM EST up reply actions  

the only other ML SS said to be available via trade this off season that could be viewed as an upgrade to Cedeno have been Ryan,Scutero and J. Reyes but I don’t think Maholm for any of those makes sense. M

Maybe making a run at Drew from Arizona because they are making some weird decisions, not really heading in any direction

by Danatural08 on Dec 9, 2010 11:10 AM EST up reply actions  

cant argue with that

still dont think we have enough to offer for Drew

by white angus on Dec 9, 2010 11:12 AM EST up reply actions  

we have relief pitchers!

by Danatural08 on Dec 9, 2010 11:14 AM EST up reply actions  

I really like Ryan given that he still has three years of control and that it would be nice to have one exceptional defensive infielder. But I don’t see the Pirates wanting to give up much to the Cardinals.

by TNbucs on Dec 9, 2010 11:15 AM EST up reply actions  

i would take scutero from the sox if they’re trying to clear some salary for crawdad, but it wouldn’t be Maholm that’d be going there from our end

by Danatural08 on Dec 9, 2010 11:20 AM EST up reply actions  

If they take Doumit and don’t expect too much else, otherwise I wouldn’t want his contract

by Mr. E on Dec 9, 2010 3:55 PM EST up reply actions  

Good point. Well, I guess we will just wait and see on Maholm.

by Hegs on Dec 9, 2010 10:52 AM EST reply actions  

im a NH supporter, but if maholm is dealt...

that means the pirates really havent added any payroll so far this offseason. if doumit is gone too, cedeno will be one of our highest paid players.

by white angus on Dec 9, 2010 11:01 AM EST reply actions  

i agree….hardy is being traded for nothing and even bartlett didnt fetch that great of a return and we cant do better then that? not surprised

by GO_BUCS on Dec 9, 2010 11:02 AM EST up reply actions  

I see a Maholm/Cedeno package somewhere… If we get a new shortstop and keep Cedeno, then the Rule 5 pick makes little sense.

by Cheap Beer on Dec 9, 2010 11:48 AM EST up reply actions  

If trading Maholm and Doumit would bring in some guys that might actually help us win a couple years from now,

I’d have no problem with it.

I don’t care about the total payroll as much as I do about who is receiving the money.

Let’s wait and see.

by patthatt on Dec 9, 2010 11:03 AM EST reply actions  

i can be patient. i was just making an observation about the payroll

because we all know that if payroll is leaving Pitt, the smizikers will be livid.

by white angus on Dec 9, 2010 11:07 AM EST up reply actions  

Yeah

Even if the Pirates trade Maholm and Doumit and pick up most of their salaries, the Smiziots will all say it was a salary dump.

by WTM on Dec 9, 2010 11:54 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

+100

For coining the term Smiziots

by gorillagogo on Dec 9, 2010 11:56 AM EST up reply actions  

On a separate note....

how GOOD are the Pittsburgh Penguins? wooooooooooooo

by GO_BUCS on Dec 9, 2010 11:04 AM EST reply actions  

Is that one of our minor league affiliates that I forgot about?

by Adam Reynolds on Dec 9, 2010 12:12 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

I'm ecstatic about this pick!

…but that could be because I took my meds 20 minutes ago on an empty stomach…

Free your ass and your mind will follow.

by cocktailsfor2 on Dec 9, 2010 11:08 AM EST reply actions  

The upside of poverty

Those meds go a lot farther when you’re starving.

by JRoth95 on Dec 9, 2010 11:25 AM EST up reply actions  

im hoping we dont trade Maholm...

until we are done playing the brewers, so we can watch him make a fool out of prince fielder just one more time

by white angus on Dec 9, 2010 11:12 AM EST reply actions  

Plus we need a lefty in the rotation. Or maybe not, but it would seem odd to have all righties given PNC (I’m not counting on Olsen making the rotation).

by TNbucs on Dec 9, 2010 11:14 AM EST up reply actions  

BTW,

if you haven’t seen J. Rodriguez’s stats, ere they are.

Free your ass and your mind will follow.

by cocktailsfor2 on Dec 9, 2010 11:17 AM EST reply actions  

Does the selection of J Rodriguez officially eliminate a trade/signing of a SS?

Ryan seems to be the only one left that we were interested in anyways I suppose.

Also, before lamenting J-Rod as a guy too old for the level, a career minor leaguer, etc etc, keep in mind he only turns 26 this month. Meaning, (obviously), he was only 25 through all of last season.

by jlk9697 on Dec 9, 2010 11:22 AM EST reply actions  

Just briefly glancing at J-Rods minor league stats..

I’m seeing more promise than I orginially had..

Starts out as a good prospect, moves up to AA (notoriously the toughest jump up, correct?) and struggles for a full season, comes out the next year (2009) putting up a .426 OBP in 33 games before getting injured. 2010 he was even better between AA and AAA.

I don’t know if I would immediately start him over Cedeno, but personally there’s alot to like here.

by jlk9697 on Dec 9, 2010 11:29 AM EST reply actions  

But guys, for reals

Can we unilaterally agree to stop using “JRod,” like, now?

There’s way too many "_Rod"s already and it wasn’t that cool to begin with.

We can do better, nickname-wise.

by Garrett122 on Dec 9, 2010 11:36 AM EST reply actions   2 recs

Good Luck

But I don’t think people are going to stop using JRod or other equally inane nicknames anytime soon. I tried my best to help kill that ugly tradition back when the Pirates had Nady by continually referring to him as X-Nad, but that didn’t really go over.

by gorillagogo on Dec 9, 2010 11:46 AM EST up reply actions  

A-Rod is the only one I verbally say..

..just cuz it was the original (at least to me).

JRod, KRod, JMac is usually quicker to type… so no, sorry, I will not cease usage of _Rod while blogging haha.

by jlk9697 on Dec 9, 2010 11:48 AM EST up reply actions  

Yeah, it's pure shorthand

I don’t think I’ve ever said “NyjMo”, but it’s short- Wait! No it’s not. I’ve been hoodwinked!

That said, J-Rod is a lot shorter than Josh Rodriguez, and given the number of Joshes and Rodriguezes….

by JRoth95 on Dec 9, 2010 12:09 PM EST up reply actions  

X-Nad?

hahaha I don’t remember that at all. That’s pretty terrible.. X-Man isn’t bad, but X-Nad is just butchery.

by jlk9697 on Dec 9, 2010 11:49 AM EST up reply actions  

sign

had a sign at pnc park that was taken down GO-NADS

by melikie yung tang on Dec 9, 2010 12:30 PM EST up reply actions  

I would like this 1000 times if I could

I blame Linda Cohn. She took Alex Rodriguez’s pretty cool name and tried to apply it to every other Rodriguez everywhere (mostly Ivan).

Pirates, Vikings, Hokies. I'm used to heartbreak. At least I have the Penguins....

"When I put on my uniform, I feel I am the proudest man on earth."
-The Great One

by blackjackfishtaco on Dec 9, 2010 11:46 AM EST up reply actions  

DK retweets:
BenBadler
  Josh Rodriguez was not going to make the Indians top 30. Avg arm but hit, power, speed all blw-avg tools, solid AAA guy

Free your ass and your mind will follow.

by cocktailsfor2 on Dec 9, 2010 11:49 AM EST reply actions  

There are others, including Kevin Goldstein and John Manuel, who disagree.

by WTM on Dec 9, 2010 11:55 AM EST up reply actions  

Personally

I tend to trust Goldstein more than most, but that’s just me

The glare of the spotlight is harsh, and the pressure that success breeds immense. We revere our heroes, but expect much. And criticism can come as easily as praise.

by glass0941 on Dec 9, 2010 11:58 AM EST up reply actions  

Keith Law liked the pick too...

thinks he has a chance to be a regular.

by Slick1 on Dec 9, 2010 12:01 PM EST up reply actions  

Oh, I know -

I was just throwin’ that out there for discussion…

Free your ass and your mind will follow.

by cocktailsfor2 on Dec 9, 2010 12:34 PM EST up reply actions  

the dude

was good enough to start at Rice, get drafted 2nd round, and advance his way up to AAA last year. Give him a shot at the majors, never know what can happen (a la GFJ rookie year). At worst we have to go back to Cedeno everyday so its not like we dont have a fall back option. I would like to see this guy get a chance at starting

by C Shint on Dec 9, 2010 12:01 PM EST up reply actions  

Agreed.

Guys have a pedigree for a reason. Let him play and see what he can do. It’s essentially a free pick, so why not? I don’t get to “see” Cedeno play, so I have no idea how good/bad he truly is, but I trust everyone on this blog. We need to find a successful holdover.

Pirates, Vikings, Hokies. I'm used to heartbreak. At least I have the Penguins....

"When I put on my uniform, I feel I am the proudest man on earth."
-The Great One

by blackjackfishtaco on Dec 9, 2010 12:09 PM EST up reply actions  

response by NH on draft so far......

It looks like NH wants our new SS to be Rodriquez.. Scroll to the 10:37am comment from N.H. found on ESPN. Here’s the link…http://espn.go.com/mlb/hotstove10/notebook/_/id/5838237/winter-meetings-live

by Krazybuc on Dec 9, 2010 12:18 PM EST reply actions  

I'm not sure how sincere you are with this comment

but that’s not actually a Neil Huntington quote, it’s just a commenter using “Neil Huntington” as his screen name.

I haven’t read a single scouting report that indicates Rodriguez is a MLB caliber shortstop defensively at this point.

by getwonkafied on Dec 9, 2010 12:38 PM EST up reply actions  

You mean all GMs don’t post their plans in comments at ESPN?

by WTM on Dec 9, 2010 2:02 PM EST up reply actions  

Here is what Neal REALLY said to Langosch:

“He’s a guy that will compete to make our club as our utility guy,” Huntington said. “He has solid defense at shortstop. He can swing the bat a little bit. He can bounce around and play second, short and third. You can probably run him into the outfield. He’s a guy that’s a good addition to the organization.”

by Hegs on Dec 9, 2010 12:40 PM EST reply actions  

I almost had him word for word

Too predictable…LOL…

Bucco’s could save some more money by just not having spring training…my guess is each position is already accounted for, each rotation spot accounted for…and my guess is they already have the line up set…NH telling Hurdle who what and where…Hurdle still has to release it though.

It’s cheaper just having guys throwing and hitting out of a indoor cage at 7 springs…

by Dan Jenkins on Dec 9, 2010 1:13 PM EST up reply actions  

There is a nice article by John Manuel with quotes from Neal on the BA frontpage (it’s a free article). Basically it sounds like they felt Rodriguez was better than any of the FA options.

by TNbucs on Dec 9, 2010 12:51 PM EST reply actions  

When we were looking at...

….possibly bringing Alfredo Amezega back….I have to agree with that. I have no problem with Rodriguez being our utility guy. If he shows he can play SS better than Cedeno, I have no problem with Ronny becoming our utility guy and hope that is exactly what happens. If Ronny can man 2B/ss and someone like Marte makes the team to cover 1B/3B then I’m OK with that.

by Brakeman8 on Dec 9, 2010 12:58 PM EST up reply actions  

Why all the love

for Brandon Ryan — can’t hit a bull in the butt at 5 paces !!!!

by CentralPaBucFan on Dec 9, 2010 1:04 PM EST reply actions  

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