The Past Decade's Most Disliked Pirates Squad
by Suffering Buc on Feb 20, 2010 11:18 PM EST
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The inspiration for this comes from SBN's Padres blog, Gaslamp Ball, which posted a very similar item.
We have been mired in futility for seventeen years now, so those of us who have stuck around to this point all have to have at least one or two Pirates who come to mind that we have just despised to have on our favorite team. My team will be primarily composed of player's from the last decade (I'm fairly young), but feel free to mix in players from any time period you like.
Please, post your ideas. Here are mine:
C- Humberto Cota - Humby wasn't a bad guy, but he might have been the most maddeningly inept starting catcher in baseball while he was a Pirate. He wasn't bad defensively, but he somehow managed to stick with the Pirates for parts of seven seasons while posting a .233 career batting average and a whopping 12 dingers.
1B- Kevin Young - Young showed the odd flash of power, but was in general fat, slow, and boring to watch. He had no charisma at all, and his fate on this list was sealed with the discovery that he was a juicer. (HM- Adam LaRoche, Randall Simon, Brad Eldred)
2B- "The Great" Abraham Nunez - Aby Baby Nunez played six seasons with over 90 games played for the Pirates from 1997 to 2004, never once reaching a batting average of .250 or an OBP of .265 in any of those years. He hit a career high five homers in 2003, and was never anything more than Brian Bixler both at the dish and in the field. I will personally remember him as one of the past decade's greatest catalysts for ineptitude. (HM- Jose Castillo_
SS- Jack Wilson - Now, hold on a second-- I personally love Jack Wilson, as do quite a few Pirates fans. However, for every fan who respected his contact, outstanding defense, and clubhouse leadership, there is a yinzer (or two) who just can't pipe down about his lack of power and expect him to be Honus Wagner. This isn't a personal pick of mine, but just what I think is indicitive of too man Pirates fans. Wilson is also really the only player who manned short for the Pirates in the decade, though Pat Meares was the starter in 2001.
3B- Aramis Ramirez - Ramirez has matured greatly as both a player and person since Dave Littlefield inexplicably flipped him for absolutely nothing to the Cubs in 2003. That said, while he was here, he was the most frustratingly inconsistent Pirates I think I've ever watched. His body language on the field and refusal to run out ground balls got to a downright condemnable point near the end of his stay in Pittsburgh, and he never really could play defense. (HM- Chris Stynes, Jose Hernandez)
OF- Jeromy Burnitz - Another Littlefield gem was signing Burnitz to a multi-million dollar joke of a contract prior to the 2006 season. Burnitz was an abhorrent "right fielder" who rarely hustled or did anything but rest on his laurels. Burnitz hit an outstanding .230 in 111 games. Like Ramirez, he often refused to even run out grounders.
OF- Derek Bell - Also a prized free agent signing, the Pirates eventually wound up paying Bell 4.5 million dollars to simply stay as far away from PNC Park as possible. Bell was a .173 hitter for the Pirates in one year of service in 2001, and then proclaimed "Operation Shutdown," jumping ship from the team as quickly as he could.
OF- Tike Redman - Redman initially excited a lot of us with dazzing speed, good bunting ability, and a generally exciting playing style. Sadly, he could never manage to put everything together. He was a model of inconsistency, and he displayed a certain youthful arrogance (at least to my eyes) that epitomized and eventually spelled the end of his stay in Pittsburgh. He averaged five home runs in two years as an everyday center fielder. (HM- Chris Duffy)
P- Jose Mesa, Matt Capps, Brian Boehringer, Ryan Vogelsong, Tony Armas Jr., Victor Santos, John Van Benschoten, Salomon Torres, Ian Snell, and Matt Morris.
So, that's my team. Let's see yours!
(Not spell-checked, so go easy)
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of the managing editor (Charlie) or SB Nation. FanPosts are written by Bucs Dugout readers.
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A little shocked
I’m surprised that Adam LaRoche and Jose Hernandez didn’t make the top spots. I guess I always had a soft spot for KY. And I never hated ARam, he was still maturing in our system.
The worst Pirate ever in my eyes was...
Chris Stynes has to take it…he hit .214 in 2004 with an OBP of .266 !!! I’ve never seen anyone so overmatched at the plate in my life than Chris Stynes. What business he had in a major league uniform I will never know…I can remember going to countless games that summer, and being completely let down by Stynes so many times…
My list.
C: Humberto Cota
1B: Randall Simon
2B: Abraham Nunez
SS: Ronny Cedeno
3B: Jose Hernandez
OF: Derek Bell
OF: Jeromy Burnitz
OF: Chris Duffy
Bench:
Ronny Paulino
Pat Meares
Brad Eldred
Luis Rivas
Brandon Moss
Jose Castillo
SP:
Matt Morris
Kip Wells
Mark Redman
Ryan Vogelsong
Jimmy Anderson
BP:
Omar Olivares
John Van Benschoten
Bryan Bullington
Shawn Chacon
Jonah Bayliss
Franquelis Osoria
How many games would that team lose? 110? 120?
well with operation: shutdown maybe closer to 130
Players who should be in the Hall of Fame: Pat TIllman, Dwight White, Donnie Shell, L.C. Greenwood, Ray Guy, Steve Tasker, Greg Llyod, Andy Russel, Cris Carter, Kevin Greene and Jerry Kramer
"the earth moves when Sean Payton walks...Because his balls are just that huge." Anarchon after Super Bowl XLIV
Canal Street Chronicles resident Steelers Fan
by WVPiratesfan on Feb 21, 2010 11:11 AM EST up reply actions
Here is Mine:
C: Jason Kendall
1B: Mark Johnson
2B: Jose Castillo
SS: Brian Bixler
3B: Jose Hernandez
OF: Chad Hermanson
OF: Derek Bell
OF: Brandon Moss
P:Ryan Vogelsong
P: John Van Benschoten
P: Matt Morris
P:Jimmy Anderson
P: Mark Redman
P: Ron Villone
P: Mike Williams
I really don’t see what Mark Redman did so wrong as to make your list.
by Suffering Buc on Feb 21, 2010 1:37 PM EST up reply actions
How did...
“Joggin’ Ronnie” Paulino not get the top spot at catcher? I never thought of Humberto Cota as more than a back-up; Paulino was supposed to be a starter, but his attitude was more like that of a bleacher bum watching the game.
Looks like I didn’t miss a lot in my years away from P’Burgh….
The guys I most disliked:
C: Ronny Paulino
1B: Randall Simon
2B: Pat Meares
SS: Mike Benjamin
3B: Chris Stynes
LF: Wil Cordero
CF: Midre Cummings
RF: Raul Mondesi
Bench: Mickey Hatcher, Ed Sprague, Abe Nunez, Jose Hernandez, Jose Castillo, Benito Santiago, Rey Quinones
SP: Walt Terrell, Jeff Suppan, Jimmy Anderson, Josh Fogg, Don Wengert
RP: Jose Mesa, Brian Boehringer, Sean Burnett, Jason Boyd, Pat Mahomes
There are also some guys who I really used to hate when they were on the team, but for whom I have recently developed more retrospective affection (Derek Bell, Tike Redman, Shawn Chacon, etc.).
Curious
as to why Suppan is on your list?
Free your ass and your mind will follow.
by cocktailsfor2 on Feb 21, 2010 7:37 PM EST up reply actions
MONDESI, MONDESI, MONDESI
He’s the only guy I ever heckled in spring training, the spring after he “retired” from the Pirates for family reasons.
DBell was a close second. Both deplorable.
As for Suppan – not sure of his exact stance, but it turns out that stem cell research can continue without harvesting embryos. This was GWB’s stance that he was hammered for. Not the right forum for this discussion, but I believe that science has justified their moral stance.
IMHO...
Science can never justify a moral stance. But let’s not go there.
by MarkInDallas on Feb 22, 2010 1:23 PM EST up reply actions
He just seems so sad.
Losing all his money, falling into drugs, getting arrested, giving coaching to Mike Burgess and almost immediately having Burgess (who had been considered a possible #1 overall pick) totally tank and fall out of the first round entirely. It kind of feels gratuitous to hate Bell – everywhere he goes, it rains on him.
Plus, now that we’re out of the Littlefield era, I can finally laugh about it a little without getting that sour feeling in my stomach.
Here's my lineup:
C: Humberto Cota
1B: Randall Simon
2B: Abraham Nunez
3B: Chris Stynes
SS: Brian Bixler
OF: Derek Bell
OF: Tike Redman
OF: Jeromy Burnitz
SP: Kip Wells
SP: Matt Morris
SP: Ryan Vogelsong
SP: John Van Benschoten
SP: Josh Fogg
Honorable mentions include Jose Mesa, Joe Randa (circa 2006), Jose Hernandez, Benito Santiago, Adam LaRoche, and Matt Lawton.
I like this, this should be theraputic
C – Joggin Ronny (backup-Benito Santiago)
1B – Kevin Young (Randall Simon) What a platoon!
2B – Jose K (Fat Jose)
SS – Mike Benjamin and his sideburns *
3B – Chris Stynes (Ty Wigginton)
OF – Jeromy Burnitz
OF – Tike Redman (Adam Hyzdu)
OF – Raul Mondesi (Derek Bell)
SP – Jimmy Anderson (best athlete on the team!)
SP – Tony Armas
SP – Bryan Bullington
SP – Matt Morris
SP – Jeff D’Amico
RP – Ryan Vogelsong (you know, for long relief)
RP – Mike Williams
RP – Franquelis Osoria
RP – Ron Villone
RP – Brian Boehringer
CP – Jose Mesa
- Pat Meares probably would otherwise be the shortstop but for some odd reason of his 9 homers as a Pirate that he hit at home my brother was at the game for 7 of those. Given that he was 12 at the time and taking in probably 5-10 games per year it was really an amazing coincidence…so I have a soft spot for Meares.
by Say Hey Johnny Ray on Feb 22, 2010 12:06 PM EST reply actions
No love for Brant Brown?
Traded Jon Lieber for him, then he hit .232 / .283 / .449 with 112 SO in 371 PA and fielded terribly (but hit 16 HR!) before being traded again in the offseason for this dude. Does the committee weigh reverse-longevity?
elvishasleft.com
bestweekever.tv
I considered him but just take a look at that outfield…thats easily the strength of this disaster team and I left off Hermansen, JJ Davis and Adrian and Emil Brown.
by Say Hey Johnny Ray on Feb 22, 2010 4:35 PM EST up reply actions
I have never seen a worse player...
in my life than Chris Stynes. By far the worst player in recent memory. Paulino the “fat toad” part deux makes the list for…well you all know. And I have to be honest the most frustrating player I watched was Snell. All the talent but such a tiny little brain. He was interviewed , don’t remember but there is a link on the PBC Blog, and said that he blamed his immaturity and not knowing how to deal with the pressure of being a #1 for his failures in Pittsburgh. So I’m thinking finally he is growing up and then I read the next sentence that says something like: yeah but it takes two partied to mess up a situation, but I’m not blaming anybody. Ahhh…there’s the Ian I know and hate so much. Good riddance you immature, spoiled little shit!
Completely agree.
He is by far the most disappointing to me. Glad to see him go. Just wish he could have had a better season before getting traded so he could have brought more back.
"So you think 25 percent of the country is retarded?! Yea. Atleast 25 percent. Well lets so a sample. There are 4 of us an you're retarded. Thats 25 percent." Southpark; Mystery of the Urinal Deuce
by gorillakilla34 on Feb 23, 2010 11:50 AM EST up reply actions
Craig Monroe. He got fired partly because of his lack of hustle (which is annoying enough when you’re Craig Freaking Monroe), but MOSTLY because he inspired that one poster (until he was banned) to constantly argue for more Monroe ABs.
A dandy post from Charlie
Is HERE, along with classy comments from the late, not-lamented, banned-and-rejoined-BD-under-another-name-but-sussed-out-and-banned-again “thelumberco.”
My favorite part:
A famous psychological study showed that children who were willing to sacrifice one marshmallow to get two marshmallows later were much more successful than those who weren’t. Rebuilding baseball teams are the same way. The best ones plan ahead, even if that means not eating all your marshmallows right away.
Also, Monroe isn’t really like a marshmallow. He’s more like that carton of cottage cheese in the back of your fridge that’s three months past its sell-by date. Personally, I’d gladly deny myself some rancid cottage cheese now if it meant I could eat two marshmallows later.
Free your ass and your mind will follow.
by cocktailsfor2 on Feb 23, 2010 3:31 PM EST up reply actions
Also, off-topic, but...
Vlad, in going thru some BD backposts, you and thegunner recommended a book, and I’ve always remembered it.
__________________________________________________________
They already had the money to sign Scheppers.
They were offering him a little above slot even after Miller inked on the day of the signing deadline.
The issue was that they just didn’t think at that point that he was worth the money he was asking – their "dollar sign on the muscle" wasn’t as high as his.
by Vlad on May 11, 2009 4:46 PM CDT
__________________________________________________________________
BEST Book EVER Written About Scouting -- By Far - By Kevin Kerrane
by thegunner on May 11, 2009 10:51 PM CDT
__________________________________________________________________
Absolutely.
I think it’s out of print now, which is a damn shame. You can still get used copies for a couple of bucks, though.
I’d recommend it to any Pirate fan – there’s a lot of Pittsburgh content, particularly a good section on Howie Haak.
by Vlad on May 12, 2009 8:44 AM CDT
__________________________________________________________________
Yes, it is OOP, but, today I ordered it from alibris.com (I HIGHLY recommend this site for buying books – very reliable, very prompt, and GREAT for OOP stuff!) for $17.95 (Amazon had it for $80 +…HA!)
I look forward to getting it and giving it a good cover-to-cover.
Free your ass and your mind will follow.
by cocktailsfor2 on Feb 23, 2010 3:58 PM EST up reply actions
Hey, sweet!
Hope you like it as much as I did.
I second the alibris recommendation. I’ve also had good luck with used books on half.com.
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