Tigers at Pirates
by poorboywilly on Mar 17, 2010 1:15 PM EDT
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PrintWell, MLB finally gave me the game instead of some terrible, terrible popular music station. Lineups:
Tigers- Clete Thomas CF
- Don Kelly 3B
- Carlos Guillén LF
- Miguel Cabrera 1B
- Ryan Raburn RF
- Brandon Inge DH
- Alex Avila C
- Scott Sizemore 2B
- Ramón Santiago SS
Pitching: Nate Robinson, Eddie Bonnie, Fu-Te Ni, Zach Miner
Pirates- Andrew McCutchen CF
- Akinori Iwamura 2B
- Garrett Jones DH
- Ryan Doumit C
- Bobby Crosby 1B
- Ryan Church RF
- Andy LaRoche 3B
- Brandon Moss LF
- Ramón Váquez
Pitching: Kevin Hart, D.J. Carrasco, Vinnie Chulk, Brendan Donnelly, Evan Meek
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of the managing editor (Charlie) or SB Nation. FanPosts are written by Bucs Dugout readers.
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Hart picking up
right where he left off. Walked Thomas, gets Don Kelly, goes full and then walks Guillén, and now full on Cabrera.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
Big start
for Kevin Hart. Even if he struggles (again), I’d be willing to bet he’ll be the 5th starter.
Hart
picks off Thomas, apparently they made a pretty terrible rundown—instead of just running Thomas back to second base (where Guillén was now standing) they kept throwing it back and forth.
Walks Cabrera. That’s 10 walks in 3.2 innings. But who’s counting?
Jason
The Hanging Curve
four pitch walk
to Rayburn
Jason
The Hanging Curve
gets Inge
on strikes, but just barely apparently
Jason
The Hanging Curve
he cannot throw strikes
there is nothing encouraging about that. At this point, it’s not “rust”.
McCutchen infield hit to the second baseman.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
by poorboywilly on Mar 17, 2010 1:25 PM EDT up reply actions
Iwamura
pops out to shallow left.
McCutchen steals second easily on first pitch to Jones.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
thats good
way to instill confidence in the coaches
Players who should be in the Hall of Fame: Pat TIllman, Dwight White, Donnie Shell, L.C. Greenwood, Ray Guy, Steve Tasker, Greg Llyod, Andy Russel, Cris Carter, Kevin Greene and Jerry Kramer
"Its a Great Day to be a Mountaineer where ever you may be" Tony Caridi
Canal Street Chronicles resident Steelers Fan
by WVPiratesfan on Mar 17, 2010 1:31 PM EDT up reply actions
Jones
singles to right, McCutchen thrown out easily at home.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
Doumit
flies out to center. End of the first, no runs in. Here comes Hart. On the bright side he’s only got the bottom of the order to deal with.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
I have a question is there such a thing as a good pop music station
Players who should be in the Hall of Fame: Pat TIllman, Dwight White, Donnie Shell, L.C. Greenwood, Ray Guy, Steve Tasker, Greg Llyod, Andy Russel, Cris Carter, Kevin Greene and Jerry Kramer
"Its a Great Day to be a Mountaineer where ever you may be" Tony Caridi
Canal Street Chronicles resident Steelers Fan
hmmmm
probably not in my mind.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
by poorboywilly on Mar 17, 2010 1:35 PM EDT up reply actions
I didn't think so
can’t stand the crap that is put out and called “popular” music
Players who should be in the Hall of Fame: Pat TIllman, Dwight White, Donnie Shell, L.C. Greenwood, Ray Guy, Steve Tasker, Greg Llyod, Andy Russel, Cris Carter, Kevin Greene and Jerry Kramer
"Its a Great Day to be a Mountaineer where ever you may be" Tony Caridi
Canal Street Chronicles resident Steelers Fan
by WVPiratesfan on Mar 17, 2010 1:41 PM EDT up reply actions
Very hard to do
The model for stations playing pop music is Top 40, which means, literally, a playlist of 40 in regular rotation with another 40 in lighter rotation. The concept is to enable a teenager to flip it on and, most of the time, hear an already-popular song. Not a recipe for enjoyable listening.
I’m sure that, somewhere, there’s a station that plays pop music mixed with R&B or dance music in a way that (assuming you like the music) wouldn’t make you tear your hair out. But they’d be the exception.
Crosby
nabs Avila on a groundout. Goes 3-1 on Sizemore, but he flies out to right.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
Goes 3-0 on Santiago
then beans him.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
apparently
they “like what they see as far as what he is doing out on the mound, maybe not the stats”
Clete Thomas singles, first and third. Here comes Don Kelly.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
four pitch walk to Kelly
almost got beaned twice
Jason
The Hanging Curve
four pitch walk
Guillén. Pulling him for Karstens.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
Are they still seriously thinking about starting this guy in the rotation?
I mean, I know it doesn’t really matter that much, but this is pretty embarrassing.
the longer this goes on
the less likely it is…
i think kevin hart’s doing his very best to stay out of Pittsburgh… maybe he met with Snell in the offseason…
Karstens
retires Cabrera on a grounder to short.
Heading to the bottom of the second, Crosby Church LaRoche due up. WAKE UP PIRATES’ BATS.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
I feel bad for Hart
He works his whole life to finally get that shot. He’s pretty much handed the 5th spot going into camp and then this happens.
A WALK
by Crosby
How in the world do you walk 6 batters, bean a guy, and give up a hit yet only have one run against you?
Jason
The Hanging Curve
luck
and ho one can hit that day
Players who should be in the Hall of Fame: Pat TIllman, Dwight White, Donnie Shell, L.C. Greenwood, Ray Guy, Steve Tasker, Greg Llyod, Andy Russel, Cris Carter, Kevin Greene and Jerry Kramer
"Its a Great Day to be a Mountaineer where ever you may be" Tony Caridi
Canal Street Chronicles resident Steelers Fan
by WVPiratesfan on Mar 17, 2010 1:51 PM EDT up reply actions
in fairness
the hitters have no clue where the next pitch is going to be- half their thoughts are on self preservation
and there is nothing wrong with self-preservation
it makes you play better in most cases
Players who should be in the Hall of Fame: Pat TIllman, Dwight White, Donnie Shell, L.C. Greenwood, Ray Guy, Steve Tasker, Greg Llyod, Andy Russel, Cris Carter, Kevin Greene and Jerry Kramer
"Its a Great Day to be a Mountaineer where ever you may be" Tony Caridi
Canal Street Chronicles resident Steelers Fan
by WVPiratesfan on Mar 17, 2010 1:58 PM EDT up reply actions
Church gaps one
to left center for a double, Crosby scores, 1-1 game
Jason
The Hanging Curve
LaRoche
sends Rayburn into the wall on a flyout, Church advances to third, one out, infield in, Moss up.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
two outs
a Mossome K
Jason
The Hanging Curve
lol
a balk brings in Church, 2-1 Pirates,
Jason
The Hanging Curve
I thought the by the time a pitcher reached the majors you had the balk rule figured out
but I quess I was wrong
Players who should be in the Hall of Fame: Pat TIllman, Dwight White, Donnie Shell, L.C. Greenwood, Ray Guy, Steve Tasker, Greg Llyod, Andy Russel, Cris Carter, Kevin Greene and Jerry Kramer
"Its a Great Day to be a Mountaineer where ever you may be" Tony Caridi
Canal Street Chronicles resident Steelers Fan
by WVPiratesfan on Mar 17, 2010 1:56 PM EDT up reply actions
Hart = Moss
Moss gave the Bucs a whole season of meh last year, yet every indication seems to be that he’ll still be with the team when they head north. At what point does reality outwiegh potential?
It's a good day to be a Pirate
0-18 thats not good
he could end up in AAA at this pace
Players who should be in the Hall of Fame: Pat TIllman, Dwight White, Donnie Shell, L.C. Greenwood, Ray Guy, Steve Tasker, Greg Llyod, Andy Russel, Cris Carter, Kevin Greene and Jerry Kramer
"Its a Great Day to be a Mountaineer where ever you may be" Tony Caridi
Canal Street Chronicles resident Steelers Fan
by WVPiratesfan on Mar 17, 2010 1:58 PM EDT up reply actions
Karstens back out
Rayburn grounds out. Inge flies out to CF.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
wow
that was fast after the torturous first two pirate halves…Avila flies out to take us to bottom third. Cutch, Iwamura and Jones due up.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
Washington
was on MLB network’s 30 clubs/30 days last night. They kept talking about how “exciting” Nyjer Morgan and Christian Guzmán are at the top of the lineup. Yeah, pretty exciting getting a guy with a .307 career OBP (Guzmán) a lot of at bats.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
to bad Christian Guman can't field either
Players who should be in the Hall of Fame: Pat TIllman, Dwight White, Donnie Shell, L.C. Greenwood, Ray Guy, Steve Tasker, Greg Llyod, Andy Russel, Cris Carter, Kevin Greene and Jerry Kramer
"Its a Great Day to be a Mountaineer where ever you may be" Tony Caridi
Canal Street Chronicles resident Steelers Fan
by WVPiratesfan on Mar 17, 2010 2:04 PM EDT up reply actions
donno
i always thought the posturing with vazquez and moss was to try to trade them…
kevin hart, on the other hand, it makes no sense. Still, if he keeps this up, pretty much no one in their right minds would keep him in the bigs.
They have to pitch Hart this spring.
If nothing else, they need to use the innings to try and figure out what’s wrong with him.
If he’s still in the running for a rotation spot after this, though, they’re crazy.
If Hart and Moss make the roster...
with their current production levels…management will have a tough time claiming that winning is important. In fact…unless they make significant recoveries…I’d have a tough time justifying a roster slot.
The Hart/Cutch2 situation is one where they don’t have to worry about losing the player…so why does management seem to have so much need to put Hart in the rotation?? For now…put McCutchen there…and have Hart work on his problems. Just switch their roles (and let Hart pitch the minor league games instead of McCutchen).
Maybe they think Hart needs to face high-level competition...
…in order to correct his issue, whatever it is.
McCutchen "out by a mile"
at second base.
Iwamura tries to check his swing but the appeals says it’s a K
Jason
The Hanging Curve
caught stealing
no pitchout. They are conjecturing that he thought it was a full count and so wasn’t trying to get a huge jump, he was kind of “looking confusedly at the coaches when he went back to the bench”.
Garrett Jones tries to advance on ball in dirt, thrown out.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
by poorboywilly on Mar 17, 2010 2:07 PM EDT up reply actions
is Mr Carrasco going to hit as well
Players who should be in the Hall of Fame: Pat TIllman, Dwight White, Donnie Shell, L.C. Greenwood, Ray Guy, Steve Tasker, Greg Llyod, Andy Russel, Cris Carter, Kevin Greene and Jerry Kramer
"Its a Great Day to be a Mountaineer where ever you may be" Tony Caridi
Canal Street Chronicles resident Steelers Fan
by WVPiratesfan on Mar 17, 2010 2:13 PM EDT up reply actions
Guillé
singles in Thomas. Moss had a chance to throw him out, but they are marveling at how terrible the throw was. Might have bounced three times before it got to Doumit.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
That's unfortunate.
Moss usually has a pretty good arm. Everything’s going wrong for him this spring, I guess.
heading to bottom of the third
Tigers 3-2. Doumit, Crosby, Church due up.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
It's on 970 AM in Pittsburgh I believe
mlb gameday audio has it online
Jason
The Hanging Curve
by poorboywilly on Mar 17, 2010 2:23 PM EDT up reply actions
two down
Doumit and Crosby gone
Jason
The Hanging Curve
Church
grounds to second, end of the fourth 3-2 Tigers.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
Brendan Donnelly
pitching. Rayburn singles to left.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
Inge hit to center
First and second.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
walk to Avila
bases juiced, no outs. Donnelly not looking good so far.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
Sizemore
singles past LaRoche, 4-2 Tigers.
Santiago hits it to Iwamura, catch the runner at second but no DP. 5-2 Tigers, one down, runners on first and third.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
some extra-curricular activity
as Donnelly steps off the mound, possibly says something to Santiago, Leyland starts screaming from the dugout.
Thomas pops out. Two outs.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
Kelly fouls out
to Iwamura. Heading to bottom of the fifth, 5-2 Tigers.
That Rush Limbaugh commercial is really quite terrible. I don’t know if that caller knows what “crapulence” means, but I have a hard time seeing Obama as crapulent.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
So even on 970 they run the 104.7 ads? Ugh. Glad I didn’t drag out the radio.
I really really hope they jump to 93.7 next year.
if that's where the feed is coming from
then yes. I’m on mlb gameday audio, and I’m not positive what station is playing (though the schedule I downloaded says it should be on 970).
And just now I’m getting the Pennsylvania lottery commercial. I was actually thinking about mentioning how glad I was that this one hadn’t played yet. I guess just thinking about it jinxed that.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
by poorboywilly on Mar 17, 2010 3:25 PM EDT up reply actions
LaRoche drops in a base hit
Mossome lineout to center.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
Vázquez
called out on strikes.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
Didn't hear what happened
but end of the 5th, 5-2 Tigers. Don’t talk too loud, you’ll wake up the bats again.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
Cabrera
fists one over Crosby to drive in Guillén, 6-2 Tigers. He’s pulled for a PR.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
Chulk
Ks Rayburn and Inge.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
called strike three
on Santiago. Don’t like the walks, but he sure did what he needed to to get out of the inning.
6-2 Tigers, heading into bottom of the sixth, Iwamura, Jones, Kratz due up.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
end of the sixth
Still 6-2
Jason
The Hanging Curve
Meek pitching
Ks Thomas. Kelly flies out to Tábata in left. Ks Ramirez.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
nice
Ngoepe is in at 2B. Church, Alvarez, Tábata due up.
Church flies out to center.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
Alvarez
doubles over center fielder
Jason
The Hanging Curve
Tábata
takes a four pitch walk.
Bernier in at SS is on deck, then Raynor who replaced Cutch.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
that is
Bernier is batting now, Raynor on deck.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
by poorboywilly on Mar 17, 2010 3:34 PM EDT up reply actions
second baseman
dives to get Bernier. Two down, runners on second and third.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
They called him "Raymor" again twice
he gets a base hit to the shorstop, drives in Alvarez. Ngoege up to hit.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
oops, misspelled
Meant to say “Ngoepe”. He fouls out to Kelly, at any rate. A little life in the bats again, but only one run in—6-3 Tigers.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
Jackson pitching
Van Every in right. Ngoepe throws to new (as of last inning) firstbaseman Pearce for the first out.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
heading to bottom of the eight
Jones (or probably a PH), Kratz and Pearce due up. Still 6-3 Tigers.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
heading into the ninth
6-3 Tigers still. Jackson in for another go, but I’m off. Happy St. Patricks Day everyone.
Jason
The Hanging Curve
Ngeope Question
DK says he batted .238 last year and is likely to go back to rookie ball. Given his (by all accounts solid, even advanced) defense, what does he have to hit to move up? On the one hand, he’ll be old for that level, and so you want to see him rake, not just be adequate. OTOH, although he grew up around baseball, I think you have to treat him as a NyjMo case* – much less baseball experience than his age-peers.
- I hope that people in general, and the Bucs in particular, learn from Morgan that the age curves have to do with experience as well as physical development. Citing one player is the ultimate small sample size, but it’s exactly what you’d expect – guys who start organized ball late will still be improving at a later age
Late start =/= continued improvement.
Morgan was an exception, not an illustration of a microtrend. Betting on other late-to-baseball players to have a similar career path would be foolhardy.
I'd like to see...
Morgan put a few decent seasons together in a row before I’d offer an opinion as to a career path. His sample size this spring is rather small…so I won’t harp on the 3-21 with no walks much. We’ll see if his hamstring issue this spring is significant or not…as he has had them in the past.
In other news . . .
Cleveland DFA’d Brian Bixler after claiming Anderson Hernandez off waivers from the Mets.
Not surprising.
Thanks for Brito, I guess. It’s nice to get something with at least potential value for a scrub like Bix.
by Suffering Buc on Mar 17, 2010 5:47 PM EDT up reply actions
I'd be curious...
for any that have actually been at Pirates spring training games…or watched some of them on TV…to put out an opinion. No MLB Network available here.
How does Garrett Jones look with respect to pitch selection? He’s viewed as the Pirates big stick…and he’s got no walks in about 30 PA. I realize sample size is limited. He’s also on about the same strikeout rate as Pedro and LaRoche…one every 3 AB or so.
Guys like Pearce…Walker…Milledge and Clement…with supposedly poorer pitch selection/recognition all have about 4 walks with fewer plate appearances. I realize some of that may have to do with the quality of pitchers faced…as except for Milledge…the other 3 are usually playing later in the game and facing what may be lesser quality pitchers.
I've seen 4 games
But I would say wouldn’t it be better just to view how he handled pitches last year rather than during a time when the stats mean next to nothing and players with jobs may be working on things?
I would...
but at Indy in 2009…Jones had 11 unintentional walks in 299 plate appearances. With the Pirates he had 32 unintentional walks in 358 plate appearances. Which one is reality?? We all pretty much agree that his 2009 time with the Pirates is out of line with most anything he did at the minor league level. Even in the minors…Jones walk rate was 1 out of every 15 PA.
Walker’s 1 out of 17 PA in the minors…1 in 10 in the majors…in limited duty.
Pearce…about 1 in 12 PA in both the majors and minors.
LaRoche has been somewhat more consistent…with about 1 walk for every 10 plate appearances at both the minor and major league levels. He’s more likely to have consistent pitch selection than Jones.
Shouldn’t everyone be working on things to make them better?? I think pitch selection qualifies.
Then I think you
Just look at the minor league totals over his career for the walk rate. I don’t think you’ll find out anything from meaningless spring training stats — in a small sample size as well. And I think your Walker example proves that since his sample size is beyond small.
Point being, I don’t think anything valuable would come from me talking about the four games I saw in spring training versus all the ones I saw last year in real games either.
Jones's sample as a good player is still small enough...
…that I think it’s appropriate to wonder how much (and what parts) of his skill set will carry over into 2010.
Spring training games are poor evidence, but better than nothing.
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