The West Virginia Power: A Guess At The Roster
It's very early, of course, but here's a guess at who could take playing time at West Virginia this year. The pitching staff will get the bulk of the attention, and deservedly so, with Jameson Taillon, Zack Von Rosenberg, Colton Cain and several other prospects likely to be part of the staff. But the hitters aren't bad either, and catcher is really the only position where the Pirates don't have an obvious prospect to play.
WTM's site is a great resource, and his organizational depth chart provides a template for these kinds of posts, so thanks, WTM.
CATCHER
The catching situation in West Virginia is uncertain. My best guess is that the majority of at-bats will go to Elias Diaz, whose defense appears to be strong and who received a lot of at bats in the GCL last year. It would be great if 2009 draftee Joey Schoenfeld (who got a bonus of almost $200,000) won the job, but the Pirates have moved him so slowly so far that he could be at State College. Recent signing Kawika Emsley-Pai could get some time at West Virginia as well, along with Matthew Skirving.
FIRST BASE
2010 draftee Justin Howard, who will be 24 in June, should receive plenty of at bats here. It's also possible that Matt Curry could play first as well. Finding playing time for both between first and DH shouldn't be a huge problem, but let's hope the Pirates like Curry enough to send him to Bradenton.
MIDDLE INFIELD
Adalberto Santos is supposed to be able to play second, but he didn't actually do so until last year, so until I see anything that suggests otherwise, I'm guessing we'll see a lot of Gift Ngoepe at second and 2010 big-bonus signing Drew Maggi at shortstop. It would be cool if Jorge Bishop showed enough in Spring Training to make it to West Virginia, but I think it's at least as likely he'll be at State College. Kelson Brown will probably be a backup for the Power, perhaps along with Adenson Chourio, who is pretty clearly an organizational player at this point.
THIRD BASE
Hopefully this will be Eric Avila, who hit very well in the GCL last year. In the Pirates Prospects Prospect Guide, Tim points out that since Avila spent three years playing for the Pirates in the Dominican, he's eligible for minor league free agency after 2013, so it behooves the Pirates to figure out what they've got. If Avila isn't the starter, the Pirates could play Jesus Brito (who would be returning to the level) or 2010 late-round pick Chase Lyles. Elevys Gonzalez could also take playing time at third or in the middle infield, but hopefully he'll be in Bradenton after a surprisingly strong season for West Virginia last year.
OUTFIELD
2010 third-rounder Mel Rojas Jr. should be the Power's starting centerfielder. Hopefully, Exicardo Cayones will occupy one of the corner outfield spots, and the other will be taken by 2010 11th-rounder Dan Grovatt. Santos could also play outfield, and perhaps also some DH. Cayones will play this year at age 19, so if he can stick at West Virginia, that bodes well for his prospect status.
2008 draftee Wesley Freeman will probably still be around, but it's hard to see him as much of a prospect at this point. The speedy Justin Bencsko will likely be a spare outfielder.
STARTING PITCHING
Tim recently wrote that he didn't think Jameson Taillon would start the year in a full-season league, but I disagree. True, the Pirates' usual pattern has been to have high school draft picks pitch in the short-season leagues first - that's what they did with Quinton Miller, Zack Von Rosenberg, and so on. But Taillon is an exceptional case. He's more talented than any pitcher the Pirates' current administration has drafted before, and it's not that uncommon for teams to send first-round high school pitchers to full-season leagues the year after they're drafted. Shelby Miller of the Cardinals is one example - he had a great year for Class A Quad Cities, at the same level as West Virginia. So that's where I think Taillon will go.
Stetson Allie might be a different story. He isn't as polished as Taillon, and didn't face very tough competition growing up in Ohio. My guess is that he'll start the season at State College.
The Pirates had a number of prospects from the 2009 draft at State College last year, and there's really no reason to hold any of them back. The Power's staff will almost certainly include Von Rosenberg, Colton Cain, Zack Dodson, Trent Stevenson, Zac Fuesser, and Brooks Pounders. In addition, there's Tyler Waldron and Brandon Cumpton, who are college pitchers from the 2010 draft. Including Taillon, that's nine starting pitchers, and injured 2009 draftee Jeffrey Inman is also in there as a wild card, so it looks like the Pirates will adopt some sort of piggybacking system. 2010 draftee Kevin Decker, who's fringier than the rest but who can eat innings, is also a possibility.
RELIEF
There aren't a lot of high-upside relievers for West Virginia, so piggybacking should work out fine. The Pirates like Jason Townsend's velocity, and he'll probably be there. Casey Sadler received a $100,000 bonus last year and pitched well at State College, so he should be at West Virginia as well. After that, there will probably be some even more marginal players, like Ryan Beckman, Rinku Singh, Mitchell Fienemann, Jhonathan Ramos, Justin Ennis and Brandon Holden. I'm guessing that Mike Williams and Marc Baca, who pitched in West Virginia's bullpen last year, will probably be gone, although they also could go to Bradenton, given that the Bucs won't have quite as much pitching depth there.
I also think it's reasonably likely that if Victor Black is healthy, he'll be at Bradenton. He isn't getting any younger, the Pirates really like his arm, and West Virginia is pretty jammed with pitching talent.
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Nice work, Charlie.
I hope to see at least a couple games this year.
Nice job
I thought it was a well-researched piece.
Off subject: Did anyone else hear Al Leiter slam DL on MLB Network tonight and talk about the difference NH has made with the draft.
They need to piggyback Taillon and Allie so it’s easier to pick a night to go out there.
by Suffering Buc on Feb 1, 2011 10:58 PM EST up reply actions
And this is why I'm buying season tickets.
Da'Sean Butler - A Mountaineer Legend
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Feb 1, 2011 10:26 PM EST reply actions
Great post as always Charlie
I went to my first WV Power game last year. I totally dug it. I sat next to the Toast Man and took in the ambiance that is low A minor league baseball. If you’ve never gone, it’s worth the trip. Now that there is a strong chance Taillon will be there, it will be all the better.
Free Pedro
by Bruce A. Ketcham on Feb 2, 2011 4:30 AM EST reply actions
Starting pitching
Even with the 9 options you listed, and without including potential injuries or promotions, there’s a possibility to give every one of them 100 IP during the season (140 games, 6-7 IP per start = around 900 IP).
100 IP in A-ball is a reasonable amount, especially for HS pitchers. With the additional 30 IP per season, those who succeed should be in line for a full workload when they reach Pittsburgh.
but we don’t want our guys pitching only every 9th, 10th or 11th day. So you go 4/4 with them or 5/4 until promotions/injuries/performance dictate otherwise. Hopefully some of the top talent will be in Bradenton by years end and then the lower end of the totem pole can pitch as deep as pitch counts and inning workloads allow.
Taillon vs Harper and Taillon vs Machado
In their 1/31 edition of Ask BA, Jim Callis made a heads up about the fact that Harper, Taillon and Machado are all likely to start the season in the South-Atlantic League (respectively in Hagerstown, WV and Delmarva).
Taillon being the only pitcher of those 3, I look forward to the direct confrontation (even if 3 AB don’t mean anything).
I hope the WV Power have a great first half, and at least a decent second one,
as a bunch of guys get promoted.
From Coonelly’s chat, seems like Taillon and Allie will start in WV.
by Adam Reynolds on Feb 2, 2011 3:09 PM EST via mobile reply actions
couple of quotes from the chat
http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20110202&content_id=16555336&vkey=news_mlb&c_id=mlb
On Rudy Owens:
If Rudy is one of the top three starters coming out of Spring Training, Rudy will break camp with the Pittsburgh Pirates.
On Chris Resop:
While there is some temptation to allow Chris to compete for the fifth spot in the rotation, we are counting on Chris to pitch in leverage situations and thus do not want to weaken our back end of the bullpen by asking him to attempt to secure a starter’s spot
Disappointing take on Resop.
Kind of a cop out answer on Resop...
if they thought Resop had even the slightest chance of being an average 5th starter he is more valuable there than in the pen. What it says to me is that they don’t think his 2 pitch arsenal is good enough to be an effective starter. It also may be more of a necessity thing given that the market didn’t play out they way they had hoped which prevented them from adding a solid bullpen option through free agency.
two-pitch arsenal
Resop has four pitches and was very effective as a starter in AAA last year. Obviously, they don’t think much of him as a starter for whatever reason, but it’s not because he only has two pitches.
Fair enough...
I didn’t follow him at all when he was with the Braves and most of the games I watched he threw basically fastball and curve with the occasional change, at least that’s what I remember. My main point was that I thought Coonelly’s answer was a little disengenious.
Just went back and looked at Fangraphs...
last year 94.5% of his pitches were fastball and curve with the remaining change ups. Maybe he abandoned the slider because he was in the pen.
yes
He’s been basically a two-pitch pitcher his whole career because he’s been used mostly out of the ‘pen, but he does have the slider and change and like I said he was very successful as a starter in AAA last year. I’ve read past reports about his secondary pitches being poor, but given how late in his career he was converted to pitching it makes some sense if his secondaries were underdeveloped until recently.
That said, I don’t really blame the Pirates for using him as a reliever. They have plenty of unproven starters with good stuff and a wave of prospects coming up from AA. It makes some sense to use the 28-year-old in relief.
last season was the first time in his career that Resop was a starter
every other season he was a reliever. Resop was “dominant” in AAA and was released after ONE game in Atlanta last season. ONE.
maybe our FO knows a few things more about Resop than any of us do.
And after Atlanta tried to trade him ...
and every team in MLB passed on trading for him.
That doesn’t sound like most teams view him as a possible serious starter.
Braves
had very little space in their pen, and didnt want to take risks in the middle of a playoff run.
They did not release him, he was claimed off waivers. The reason he went on waivers was that he got injured after one game.
I’d advocated trading for Resop before, and I stand by it. (fringe pieces trade of course.)
Further, if the 5th starter for us is gonna be Karstens, I’d sure as hell give Resop a shot to compete with him. If he doesn’t work out, he can go back to the pen. His eye-popping numbers in AAA last year should have been enough to get him a shot. I am disappointed he isnt getting it.
released, claimed off waivers... tomato, toh-mah-toh
resop has started for one season of his nearly decade long career. nobody traded for him once he was WAIVED either.
yes, his AAA stats were impressive. this team has much more options for the rotation than before and few in the bullpen as of today. resop did very well in the pen for us; i see no problem in keeping him in this role.
resop did very well in the pen for us; i see no problem in keeping him in this role.
The problem is that a decent starter is more valuable than a 1 inning guy in the pen. If our fifth starter is going to be Karstens, I see no problem giving him a shot. If it doesn’t work out, back he goes to the pen.
Luckily
Our fifth starter won’t be Karstens.
With Olsen, Morton, Lincoln, and a wave of prospects behind them, I think leaving Resop in the bullpen is defensible. And as angus points out above, I’m sure the Pirates have more info and better scouts than this board.
That's a distinction without a difference during the season
They waived him after no one would trade anything for him. Also, you don’t get waived because you got injured after one game. You go on the disabled list.
This really isn't a surprise to me....
they insinuated they wanted to keep them on the same developmental track when they were drafted. Also, I don’t think Allie is any less polished then Q. Miller and he started in WV because NH felt he could get by State College on his fastball alone. Allie has a better fastball than Miller so I’d be a bit surprised if he weren’t in WV after extended spring training. Good to hear that, thanks for the heads up.
I guess you have to make a distinction between starting there and starting the season there. Miller didn’t actually make it to WV until around the beginning of July (after a few innings at State College). Tyler Matzek for the Rockies last year didn’t pitch anywhere but the SAL, but didn’t get sent there until late May.
Allie opening at WV?
Coonelly’s comment is ambiguous:
Pirates4life, no final decision has been made with respect to where Jameson will begin his professional career, but, given what we’ve seen to date, I would expect that Jameson will begin in Charleston, West Virginia, with the Power. The mayor of Charleston attended our caravan stop on Monday and encouraged a commitment that both Taillon and Allie begin their careers in Charleston, but I was only comfortable indicating that was the most likely scenario.
It’s not clear whether “most likely scenario” refers to both or just Taillon. Starting Allie off in full season ball strikes me as nuts. By all accounts he’s very raw. The Pirates aren’t into running risks with their young pitchers. Starting off his career by walking three batters an inning isn’t going to do him a lot of good. That’s too much of a chance to take.
Bear in mind, a year ago Coonelly said Jarek Cunningham would open at Bradenton. They can’t possibly make a realistic decision until they see Allie in camp, and then I’m sure Kyle Stark’s opinion will carry the most weight.
You're entitled to your own opinions. You're not entitled to your own facts.
Allie at WV
He might not start there, but it wouldn’t be nuts to do so. He needs to be at a level where hitters are going to challenge him a bit, and short-season hitters are not going to do that. He’s not really going to be able to improve his fastball command if hitters miss it even when he makes a mistake. I would consider starting Taillon at Bradenton for similar reasons, though that’s obviously out of the question.
My dad was there
and he said the “buzz” was that both the 1st and 2nd round picks of the Pirates would be starting at WV. Take that for what it’s worth.
Da'Sean Butler - A Mountaineer Legend
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Feb 3, 2011 1:26 AM EST up reply actions
i still think Allie will be in State College
i have no other reason except that they emphasize fastball command there, which allie needs some help with.
I had a thought about this last night.
That is a reason to start Allie in short season ball, and a good reason at that. However, what if you reverse engineer the thought process. Why DON’T you start guys in the majors or in AAA right out of high school? Because they would be overmatched and overwhelmed, they wouldn’t be able to develop and work on specific skills (i.e. Allie’s fastball command) and see their growth stunted.
That last part is the key. In this case, both Taillon and Allie (although an argument for Allie is weaker than Taillon) won’t be overmatched at WV due to the quality of their stuff. Therefore, theoretically Taillon and Allie can begin their pro careers higher than short season ball and not see any determent to their development. In that case, personally I could make an argument where it would be better to start them higher up, in a more aggressive manner, rather than have them toil at State College. Obviously it will be very important to manage both guys workload’s properly, but I think WV should be both their destinations.
To further support my argument I will give an example. ZVR, who actually got more than half of Allie’s bonus, was highly touted coming out of HS and going into the Pirates system. However, he only threw in the high 80’s to low 90’s and he is all about projectability. Therefore, it makes sense to have had him in short season ball last year to develop physically and learn how to pitch, specifically because he may have been overmatched, even in low A. Allie, on the other hand, already touches triple-digits. Physically, he won’t need to develop nearly like ZVR. He simply needs to learn how to pitch, and since he won’t (theoretically) be overmatched at WV, he can do that while pitching for the Power.
Da'Sean Butler - A Mountaineer Legend
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Feb 3, 2011 9:33 AM EST up reply actions
will WVA have room for allie in the rotation?
i know State College will have a place for him, and the pirates want allie to be a starting pitcher for now. WVA will have a possible rotation of Taillon, ZVR, Cain,
with Dodson, Waldron, Pounders and maybe even Stevenson and Inman in that mix. Sure Allie has the upside to be better than 90% of those guys, but for some reason i see him starting at SC.
Good point
I’m sure they could piggyback to get everyone innings though.
Da'Sean Butler - A Mountaineer Legend
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Feb 3, 2011 10:32 PM EST up reply actions
fastball command
I don’t think the emphasis on fastball command is exclusive to SC. I’m sure they emphasize that for all the pitchers they bring into the organization, whether they start at SC or higher levels. It’s all about placing them at the level where they can be challenged but still have success while throwing fastballs 90% of the time. For most HS kids, that’s SC. But as with Justin Wilson, they don’t seem adverse to starting guys with better stuff (even if they need a lot of work on fastball command, as Wilson did/does) at higher levels. This is also most likely the reason that most of the pitching prospects we traded for struggled at first in our system – they were put into levels where they’d been working with their full repertoire and forced to emphasize fastball command instead. It seems to have paid off in most cases, but it certainly didn’t look good for most of those guys at first.
For Allie, who knows what’s going to happen, but his stuff will play at WV even if he’s only throwing the fastball. He probably wouldn’t have too hard a time at Bradenton, even.
wilson went to college though, and has faced much better competition than Allie in both college AND high school
in fact, some scouts have said that Allie’s stats may not have been as good if he played against better high school teams. but the dude throws 100, so he is and should be raising eyebrows.
cant compare Wilson to Allie because of experience, even if its amatuer.
don't see why not
The Pirates have started plenty of college pitchers in SC – Irwin, Baker, Waldron, and Cumpton have all started there. They started Wilson at hi A because his stuff was good enough to play there, not because he was a college pitcher. And I don’t see why you can’t compare Allie to Wilson just based on stuff. Allie’s stuff is certainly good enough to play at WV.
Again, I’m not saying Allie will start at WV, but I don’t see any reason why he shouldn’t (other than maybe just because there are already so many other pitchers who need innings there). He’s just too good for short-season ball. Like I said, even in the FSL he’s going to overpower guys with his fastball/slider combo alone. I can’t imagine he’ll make any real improvements in the NYPL where he can just blow high 90s heat past everyone, even if he can’t spot it.
why not
start him in SC, then bump him up if after a month it’s obvious he’s too good for them?
by BlindSquirrel on Feb 3, 2011 7:34 PM EST up reply actions
starting him in SC
I won’t be upset if that’s the way they do it, but the reason not to do it is that it unnecessarily delays his development. If they see something in ST that concerns them enough to hold him out of WV, that’s fine, but they shouldn’t delay him for half a season just to make sure he can blow away NYPL competition. Unless the pre-draft scouting reports were grossly inaccurate, it should already be pretty obvious that he can/would.
Exactly
1. This is a much more extreme example but it would be like starting Pedro in SC. It would be pointless to see him put up a 1.100 OPS line down there
Da'Sean Butler - A Mountaineer Legend
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Feb 3, 2011 10:35 PM EST up reply actions
SC starts their season later in the year, so not only would you (possibly) be holding him back for a month by starting him low, but you have to add in the time he could be pitching for WV while waiting for the Spikes season to start. Like Epoc said above, why waste 1/2 a year of development? Obviously this is a question only the Pirates management can answer.
I figured the answer would be something like that. I’m not aware of how far apart the starting dates are.
by BlindSquirrel on Feb 4, 2011 3:01 AM EST up reply actions
SC starts in mid-June
about two and a half months after the full-season leagues.

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