Morris, Owens and Lambo to start in AAA Indianapolis this year?
by Slick1 on Feb 10, 2011 7:10 PM EST
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PrintWell the lovely Kristy Robinson of "Hands off my Pirates Booty" writes that Rob Biertemphel (of the Pittsburgh Tribune-Review) reports that 8 "top" prospects will start in Indy this season.
Among the players who are "projected to begin their 2011 campaigns" at Indy are eight top prospects: Bryan Morris, Rudy Owens, Andrew Lambo, Alex Presley, Daniel Moskos, Pedro Ciriaco, Matt Hague and Josh Harrison.
I wasn't sure that Morris would start in AAA so this is a bit of a pleasant surprise to me. I fully expected him to start in Altoona but the front office must think he is ready for the challenge. I also wasn't sure if Lambo would make the jump but it appears he has and that too is a good thing as he has already spent two years in AA. It's time that he, and Morris, prove they can be major leaguers and justify their "top" prospect status. I do find it curious that the following names weren't mentioned: D'Arnaud, Wilson, Mercer and Locke. I think Locke could use some more AA time but the others were college draftees from the 08' draft class. While they haven't set the world on fire with the bat they are starting to get a little old for the level.
I would take this all with a grain of salt because Biertempfel did use the word "projected" so I would imagine that the AAA and AA rosters are not close to being set in stone. If nothing else it is good to know that Rudy Owens and Bryon Morris could see time in Pittsburgh this season if they get off to strong starts.
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of the managing editor (Charlie) or SB Nation. FanPosts are written by Bucs Dugout readers.
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would be surprised
If Gorkys does’nt start the year in Indy…I personally still view him as one of our better/useful/impact prospects.
On what grounds?
He hasn’t hit anywhere. He’s looking like little more than minor league depth with the upside of a defensive substitution right now. He’s only going to be 23 next year, so that can change, but nothing in his career has been encouraging thus far.
www.stealingfirstbase.com
He did start hitting a bit last season...
before he got hurt but I tend to agree that he looks more like a 5th OF if he doesn’t continue to improve offensively. He is supposed to be an elite defender though so there is still hope for him. And it doesn’t hurt that Gorky has now received the FusilliJerry88 bump. Look what that did for Neil Walker!!!
what grounds do you see that he DOESNT get called up to INDY?
theres room in the Indy outfield for Gorkys. its time to see him face better competition. an outfield of gorkys, lambo, presley, fields, and wimberly/harrison looks more than doable
The grounds that he still hasn't proven he can hit AA pitching even slightly well.
If he gets moved up, it’ll be purely because he’s spent two years in AA, not because he’s done anything of note there.
www.stealingfirstbase.com
"top" prospects might be a stretch for about half those guys
But having prospects of any level at AAA is a pleasant departure from the brad corleys and ty taubenheims of springs past.
by johnnycuff on Feb 10, 2011 8:25 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Seriously ...
I was just getting ready to post the same thing. We are now calling Alex Presley, Daniel Moskos, Pedro Ciriaco, Matt Hague and Josh Harrison top prospects. Really?
Using that low level of greatness, Kim Khardashian is an award-winning actress.
Agreed...
that’s why I put it in quotes in my post. Biertempfel described them as top prospects because all of them were listed in BA’s top 30. I suppose that would qualify but could be a bit misleading since most of us, I think, would consider the top 10 as “top” prospects but whatever.
I know
It just made me laugh that Rob Biertemphel wouldn’t challenge a comment like that.
Again, being in the Pirates BA top 30 is nice.
But that’s a pretty low bar. I suspect 80 percent of a top 30 list wash out.
I’d say that the Pirates have four top prospects. Then another six who are good prospects.
Then you have a bunch of interesting guys, but it’s too early to call really predict anything for them.
It occurs to me . . .
that maybe they really meant “eight [of our] top prospects,” not necessarily eight “top prospects” in the traditional minor league sense.
Should've never provided the link
BucsDugout is now my #2 Pirates blog to check….
"[T]o hold the body of women in our arms is ... the one ecstasy granted to the race of men."
It's Charlie's fault...
I never knew that blog existed until he wrote about his bloggers interview the Pirates post.
You asked for it...
"[T]o hold the body of women in our arms is ... the one ecstasy granted to the race of men."
by Trogluddite on Feb 11, 2011 8:48 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
They must want him to prove he can keep the walks down...
only reason I can think of because he pitched pretty well last year as far as I’m concerned.
Presley and Ciriaco wouldn’t be on the major league bench. If Hague is the starting first baseman in Indy, Steve Pearce probably starts in the majors.
other than doumit, do you think the bucs need another LH bat on the bench? presley maybe?
diaz is pretty much the 4th outfielder since jones will probably get more of the early starts, so whom is the 5th outfielder? wimberly can play the OF, is a switch hitter, and versatile; but he may start in AAA.
always good to have a LH bat on the bench, just in case… ya know?
by white angus on Feb 10, 2011 10:38 PM EST up reply actions
diaz is pretty much the 4th outfielder since jones will probably get more of the early starts
It’s possible, but not a given, imo
by BurgherKing on Feb 10, 2011 10:53 PM EST up reply actions
If the LH bat can’t hit, no. Ryan Church was a space-waster the entire season even though he was LH. Much was made about Delwyn Young’s switch hitting, but the problem was he couldn’t hit in general (not to mention the fielding)
Neither of them were assets, for example. So while maybe a LH bat is ideal, I’d go with the best overall player or bat for the 25th roster spot.
by Adam Reynolds on Feb 10, 2011 11:16 PM EST up reply actions
clearly DY was screwed
He hits best when he is in RF, and we took him away from that! 880ish OPS as opposed to his 670s everywhere else!
by BurgherKing on Feb 10, 2011 11:25 PM EST up reply actions
they have some flexibility with the 5th OF spot...
Because Tabata can play CF, and Doumit, Pearce, Jones/Diaz, and even Josh Rodriguez can all play corner OF. They don’t necessarily need a speedy guy like Presley or even a guy who is primarily an OF to take up that spot (meaning Atkins/Fields/Marte have a better shot at sticking).
by titanlord91 on Feb 11, 2011 12:35 AM EST up reply actions
Or 3 legit prospects and 5 mildly interesting guys.
Everything that guy just said is bullshit . . .thank you
Rambo
every time i read Diaz i think of old Rambo. he played RF didn’t he?
So what's the deal with Lambo?
I mean, I know who he is and everything. But what’s his likely path? Does anyone think that he can start with us for any length of time? Does he make sense in RF? Is he plausibly better than Gorkys (if his 2010 hitting was no illusion) or Marte (who, granted, is quite a bit farther away)?
I’m wondering because, if he really starts in Indy, then his sell-by date becomes next June at the latest. And if Gorkys succeeds, he should be here by then, leaving no place for Lambo (except the bench). I suppose that, if we move Diaz or Jones this year, that gives Lambo an opportunity to step up and show something for a few months.
Obviously, he could break out and force himself into a starting role, or he or Gorkys could be traded (depth is always good, obvs.), but I’m just trying to get a sense of how he fits into the Pirates’ plans assuming he and others follow their “most likely” courses. Because my read on him is that he’s mostly a spare part, if only because we have a lot of OFs.
Lambo
if he gets closer to his potential with the bat, he can be a 1B, if we dont have space in RF.
If Gorkys hits in the 750 OPS+ I could see him becoming prime trade bait…
by BurgherKing on Feb 11, 2011 12:41 PM EST up reply actions
oh sorry :P
just OPS!
he was getting close to thatin ATL, wonder what it is about PIT that he doesnt like!
Oh, right, 1B. Duh.
If he has the bat to start in RF, then he has it for 1B. And we certainly don’t have anyone else in the org to play 1B. Oh, wait….
Gorkys
He is just one guy I never liked. I don’t like toolsy guys whose statistics don’t back up their prospective ranking.
I see a tremendous defensive player who is unlikely to ever hit enough for a full-time gig.
Yikes...
You are going to hate most players NH drafts going forward because he is more about the tools and letting power develop: Rojas, Chambers, etc.
Just so I'm clear ...
I think you should draft a bunch of those guys from HS and let them develop.
My issue with Gorkys has always been that he was at AA at the time. He’s supposed to be more advanced.
At some point, the statistics need to match up with the potential or prospective rating.
To some extent, the ratings followed the stats. When he was hitting .300 and young for the level, he was a top prospect. Now he’s hitting in the .260s and not young for double-a, his prospect value haa taken a hit.
by Adam Reynolds on Feb 11, 2011 4:13 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Adam
I saw him in Birmingham before the trade.
I was completely unimpressed.
Great athlete.
Not so great baseball player. He really had such a defensive swing. He also had poor pitch recognition.
Let’s hope I’m wrong. But I just don’t see much of an MLB career.
I've been a Gorkys skeptic myself
But his bat last season made me reconsider, and I’ve heard enough reports of his glove to think that he might be able to make up for a merely serviceable bat with GG-caliber defense. I kind of love the idea of a Cutch-Gorkys-Tabata OF for a few years, esp. if Tabata’s apparent offseason strength gains translate to some significant pop.
What about a .266/.333/.334 line with 2 homers and 17 steals in AA made you reconsider? Gorkys was worse in his second AA go-round than he was in his first.
I’m much more impressed with Andrew Lambo in his second AA go-round, a year younger than Gorkys, hitting .272/.334/.397 with 6 HR and 1 steal. And I’m not terribly impressed with Lambo either.
www.stealingfirstbase.com
lambo has serious upside. if he would have not done his cheech/chong thing he probably would still be with LA
its time to see both up in AAA. if they struggle, they can always repeat the level.
Lambo
I’ve seen Lambo mentioned at first. Could he fit there once the season starts a some of the depth has to be released?
lets see...
if lambo does come on strong this season, Jones could possibly be dealt and lambo would team with Diaz for a platoon. this way lambo only faces RH MLB pitching to start his career.
i dont see Gorkys really denting our roster unless he changes his approach at the plate. he could be a valuable defensive outfielder, and would have even more value if only he batted lefthanded.
i believe you would see Garrett being traded unless Lambo is included in a bigger deal
Jones doesn’t really have trade value, so if he plays well he’ll stay on the team. If he picks up where he left off last season, he’ll probably be cut.
by Adam Reynolds on Feb 11, 2011 4:09 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Agreed
Even if he starts strong, he did that in ‘10 too, so teams will remain skeptical. If he does have a solid first half, he could be a nice piece in a trade of a pitcher, provide a little pop off the bench for a team that needs it, but on his own he’s close to worthless – unless he wOBAs .360 for the full season.
i didnt say anything about jones having trade value, im saying he would be traded if lambo blossoms
jones is not in the long term plans unless he explodes out of the gate, even then, he still probably would be dealt. even baseball america thought clement had more of a future as pirate than garrett, and that was before LAST season.
Agreed
There are about 150 guys who play 1b as well as GJ and who hit that well.
Don't underestimate his RF play
By the numbers, and also by the eyeball, he’s a nearly-average defensive RF. If he wOBAs .310 that doesn’t matter at all, but unlike the infinite number of bad-glove, OK bat 1Bs, GFJ actually contributes something in the field beyond his bat.
That’s one of the reasons that Pearce’s injury sucked so hard last year – it led to far, far too many 1B starts for Jones. He’d have to wOBA .375 or better to make up for that glove at 1B. In RF, a .350 wOBA makes him a useful, if not special, player. You still want him in a platoon, or at least sitting vs. tough lefties, but he’s not a liability in the OF.
Lambo and Gorkys
I’d put Lambo back at AA. He has been young for his level. But, until he hits there, it’s hard to see him being a starting corner outfielder in the majors. Being young for your level is only a good thing for so long.
I feel like I knew Gorkys wouldn’t develop. He doesn’t have enough pop in his bat to be pitched around. Since he doesn’t get pitched around, he doesn’t draw the walks he needs to be effective. I think he’ll crack the majors as a Adrian Brown-type of player. That’s about it though.
Put them at AA. I hope they tear it up, move to AAA, and then do the same. I wouldn’t pencil them in as future starters though until they do.
i think Lambo needs to be at AAA. he played well after we aquired him, had a nice playoffs despite being injured, and finished with a very nice AFL
gorkys needs to advance too… its time.
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