Cardinals 6, Pirates 4
by Charlie Wilmoth on Jul 22, 2011 10:15 PM EDT
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PrintThe Cardinals had 15 hits, including eight extra-base hits and three homers, in this one, so they took the Pirates to the woodshed a bit. Albert Pujols had a single, two doubles and a homer, and Yadier Molina had a single, a double and a homer.
The Pirates mustered their fair share of singles, but Chris Carpenter still managed to get through eight innings. Mike McKenry attempted to mount a rally in the ninth inning with a single off Fernando Salas, but it was undone by a horrible at-bat by Matt Diaz and a liner for an out by Alex Presley.
There was also the Pirates debut of Jason Grilli, who pitched a scoreless top of the ninth inning, allowing one of those Pujols doubles but striking out Matt Holliday with a decent-looking slider.
The Pirates now slide into a tie for second with the Cardinals; the Brewers play late tonight in San Francisco.
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Pedro: 2-4, double and a walk
#FreePedroNow
so he can face the best pitching in the game
and go back into the funk he was in to start the season…good call.
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 22, 2011 10:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Jesus Fucking Christ
Have some faith in the kid, will ya? I believe in Pedro, and I’m like… one of the biggest pessimist on this board
by Zach Buccos on Jul 22, 2011 11:04 PM EDT up reply actions
do you want to win now
or do you want to win consistently in every season starting next year?
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 22, 2011 11:05 PM EDT up reply actions
+1
Yeah, Pedro is going to be counted on to hit any and all pitching in the near future, but it would be dumb to have him face THE BEST pitching in baseball right now. He’s clearly not ready and, as painful as it is to watch these guys in the lineup right now, it wouldn’t do this offense any good for Pedro to come up and struggle against the pitching we’re about to face.
Yes, it’s frustrating, but it’s the right move.
Do you honestly believe we are going to have better chances than this in the upcoming years to win our division?
The Bucs have been extremely consistent at one thing the last 18 years…. losing. Our time is NOW. Im tired of all this losing, all this BS with the FO. Tonights first inning frustrated me. Why the hell are we thinking about paying maholm 8 mil a year?
hope you didnt break you knee with that reaction.
our time is not now. our time is next year unless all the chips fall in a favor over the next two months
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 22, 2011 11:15 PM EDT up reply actions
i dont know about that
i’d say with the increase in attendance, the waves the guys are making, aquiring a decent 1b in the off season maybe finding a SS if ronny leaves (I im not sure about his contract status). next year we should be right back in the thick of it right to the end, a few breaks and we be in the post season.
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 22, 2011 11:32 PM EDT up reply actions
Honestly
I’m not even in post season mode. I do wanna see us break the streak though. I think that not doing that this year after we’ve gotten the city so committed to the team again would he a monumental letdown for Pittsburgh. It would almost be like it become more difficult for them to trust the team again, even when they are at a point when they’re actually better this year then last.
by Zach Buccos on Jul 22, 2011 11:35 PM EDT up reply actions
Sorry
Meant
“when they’re actually better next year then this year”
by Zach Buccos on Jul 22, 2011 11:35 PM EDT up reply actions
i think by simply keeping our core players, fans will respond positively to the end of this season regardless of the record. they are familiar with the names and faces now. they understand that this team can compete, so all will not be lost if we dont reach the magically number 82W
Thats what she said! - Michael Gary Scott
You’re probably one of those fans that it sucked to be around the past 18 years. I’m sure it still sucks.
Thank you Ned Colletti.
by ryebr3ad on Jul 23, 2011 12:18 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
zach's
just angry…like he is after every loss
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 12:24 AM EDT up reply actions
I've shown know display of aggression tonight in this thread
Actually, I even stated I was rather pleased with the fight our team showed tonight. Besides buddy, how can I be mad? Remember when you were talking all that game about how there was no way OSU avoids major penalties? See any interesting news today?
by Zach Buccos on Jul 23, 2011 12:27 AM EDT up reply actions
nope
i dont pay attention to that crap and if they dodge sanctions, it just goes to show how the golden cows of the ncaa are untouchable
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 12:30 AM EDT up reply actions
FWIW, he clicked reply on Crusade’s post, not yours.
by Charlie Wilmoth on Jul 23, 2011 12:47 AM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, Charlie got my drunk texting back!!! :)
I pride upon my grammar and spelling whilst imbibing the sauce.
Thank you Ned Colletti.
by ryebr3ad on Jul 23, 2011 12:54 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Can you think of anyone better
that might be signed for reasonable money and be able to shoulder a ton of innings, all the while pitching a “good-enough” game that can win pretty big with a strong defense and average offense.
"Never mistake motion for action." - Ernest Hemingway
fixed
averageone of the worst offense’s.
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 12:34 AM EDT up reply actions
Of course,
my point was to take issue with this dude’s take on extending Maholm into the future.
"Never mistake motion for action." - Ernest Hemingway
+100
We have to get a legit power threat in the middle of the lineup, or else our line is gonna be 2 runs on 11 singles for the rest of the year.
as long as the final score reads
2-1 buccos i could give a damn about a power bat
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 22, 2011 10:57 PM EDT up reply actions
Unless you, you know, string those singles together some and score 4 or 5 or 6.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 22, 2011 11:03 PM EDT up reply actions
And that happens... how often?
We need a presence in the middle of the order. Period.
and this happens how?
with pena? buying a bat from the outside who hits for a whopping 227? really? we are going to get that presence, but getting a shadow of that presence does this club no good. we don’t have the funds or the prospects to just shit out consistent power in the middle of our line-up.
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 22, 2011 11:09 PM EDT up reply actions
we need to play small ball better then other clubs play long ball
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 22, 2011 11:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Good thing batting average isn’t the be-all end-all.
Thank you Ned Colletti.
by ryebr3ad on Jul 22, 2011 11:14 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
good thing
slugging isnt either. his babip is even worse the overbays
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 22, 2011 11:16 PM EDT up reply actions
Knowing what BABIP is, you do realize that he can only get better, right?
Thank you Ned Colletti.
by ryebr3ad on Jul 23, 2011 12:38 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
cuz it cant get any friggin worse...
yeah i get that part
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 12:39 AM EDT up reply actions
Hey, he has no control on whether the defense catches his balls in play or not. To say it’s lower than Overbay’s is worse on Overbay, since he’s being luckier on those balls in play.
Thank you Ned Colletti.
by ryebr3ad on Jul 23, 2011 12:56 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
So having a guy that already has 20 HRs in Pena wouldn't improve our offense?
Not to mention that Pena can draw walks with a good eye, unlike Overbay. And Pena wouldn’t cost our best prospects. He could be had relatively cheaply.
Pena is a significant upgrade over Overbay.
If you can’t see that, you’ve lost your mind.
how many times to i have to say this
I’m not saying he is not an upgrade on overbay. I am saying if we are going to get a bat, get one who isn’t all or nothing, and who is a better fielder
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 22, 2011 11:17 PM EDT up reply actions
What?!
Pena is one of the best defensive 1B in baseball!
And who would you suggest? Because the Pirates just aren’t gonna give up their top prospects for a superstar. Pena is a REALISTIC — keyword being realistic — trade target for us that can be a significant upgrade for relatively cheap.
We’re not getting Beltran, Pence, etc. Pena is as good of a target for us as any.
stat comparison
pena:
babip: .258. walk%: 14.4, k%26.6 uzr -1.8 uzr150: -3.7
failsauce (overbay):
babip: .279 walk%: 8.7 k% 19.4 uzr -6.0 uzr150 -12.2
the only difference is a sizable decrease in defensive skills. oh and 20 yard balls..again all or nothing with pena.
If pena is the only thing available the we should do nothing
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 22, 2011 11:30 PM EDT up reply actions
derp
increase in defensive skills
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 22, 2011 11:30 PM EDT up reply actions
so i guess
stirking out 27% of the time is a good thing as long as he goes yard once a game
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 22, 2011 11:37 PM EDT up reply actions
If he goes yard once a game. . .
he can strike out 75% of the time.
Everything that guy just said is bullshit . . .thank you
I don’t actually think that type of performance would be that helpful.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 1:02 AM EDT up reply actions
You’d be incorrect. 1-for-4 w/1 HR, however many RBIs 1-4 based on who is on ahead of him and 3 Ks for every game (obvious hypothetical) would be remarkably value.
An OPS of about 1.000? It would be valuable, sure, but not extremely valuable. His performance each night would vary completely depending on the hitters above him. Not to mention how you could treat him strategically, knowing that he will either go yard or not get on base.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 1:10 AM EDT up reply actions
This is the funnest hypothetical ever.
I’m being completely serious.
Santa Roberto Clemente
Ora Pro Nobis
@ChristianTappe
Rough estimate, about a .340-.350 wOBA for that kind of performance. Again, valuable, but not extremely so. And personally I would prefer a guy who got on base ever.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 1:18 AM EDT up reply actions
And I think that estimate is a little high. I really need to stop taking this so seriously.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 1:20 AM EDT up reply actions
i think
we all do… comes with the territory of being new to this whole above 500 thing me thinks
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 1:22 AM EDT up reply actions
Ha!
I just think it’s fascinating to think about…by the way, I’m not sure if it’s correct, but this wOBA calculator would give ZombiePena a .487 wOBA (assuming 162 HRs, and 4 ABs a game, without reaching base any other way but via HR.) It doesn’t take into account Ks, which I’m pretty sure wOBA doesn’t, so that would at least be accurate.
Santa Roberto Clemente
Ora Pro Nobis
@ChristianTappe
A little low, but not if he’s getting more than 4 AB’s a game. But in reality he would probably have less, considering if he hit his home run earlier in the game the manager could just pull him, knowing he would be useless for the rest.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 1:40 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
i sense
sarcasm here…but not quiet sure
=p
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 1:41 AM EDT up reply actions
Absolutely no sarcasm.
I’m having a ton of fun thinking about a guy who homers once a game and strikes out the rest of the time.
Santa Roberto Clemente
Ora Pro Nobis
@ChristianTappe
I think he would be overvalued due to his record destroying numbers. I would try to trade him for some people who get on base. You could probably get a whole lot more in return from somebody.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 1:44 AM EDT up reply actions
I feel like in our little hypothetical, the manager would be obligated to use him the whole game even if he hit his HR in the first inning. Otherwise, he might get his 162 HRs in like 200 ABs which would skyrocket his value, no?
Well, I guess you don’t want to skyrocket his value if you plan on keeping him. I was planning on trading him at the break or in the offseason. Imagine the packages you could get. Or what he could pull in arbitration.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 1:48 AM EDT up reply actions
makes arods contract
look like chump change
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 1:49 AM EDT up reply actions
accountants
and tax attorneys waiting in the hallways making their pitch with their 10% fees
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 1:51 AM EDT up reply actions
Would certainly suck to be the person to make that decision.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 1:51 AM EDT up reply actions
gm's
looking to citibank for loans to pay the salary…only to have the loan denied due to lack of capital….
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 1:57 AM EDT up reply actions
zomg
fml i need to ask for a ballot measure in the next election to pay this guy…great idea picking this joker up…ffs
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 2:02 AM EDT up reply actions
I wasn’t supposing 4 AB’s a game. I was going by the rough association of (OBP x 2 + SLG)/3 – about .03 or .035. So say he’as got like a .225 OBP due to getting more than four AB’s a game, and has a SLG of about .850, that would give him roughly a .370 wOBA. So I guess I was initally on the low end, probably because I was giving him 5 AB’s a game.
Either way, I don’t think any statistics could actually apply in such a circumstance.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 1:39 AM EDT up reply actions
Actually I think that’s off a tad. Don’t do math in your head at 2 in the morning folks. He would probably be just under a .400 wOBA I think.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 1:43 AM EDT up reply actions
Mine's way off, by the way
Numbers were standing on their own, not taking into account league average.
Santa Roberto Clemente
Ora Pro Nobis
@ChristianTappe
I think he’d be pretty beastly, especially if cheese’s theory came into play whereby the mgr could remove ZombiePena right after the HR.
It occurs to me, though,
that our already flawed hypothetical gets even more flawed with the 3Ks 1 HR/game thing. It’d have to be a general 75% 25% ratio throughout the season, because if it’s 3-1 each game, the flip side is if he Ks in his first 3 ABs, then you just walk him in his 4th…unless, of course, he has like a 15 ft. wingspan.
Santa Roberto Clemente
Ora Pro Nobis
@ChristianTappe
However
if we’re making the mgr bat him for 4 ABs even if he hits the HR in the first, then teams can’t pitch around him in the first 3 ABs are Ks. Which of course means he’d purposely K early on… but what if he doesn’t bat a fourth time?! Obviously, it’s a MASSIVELY flawed hypothetical, but fun nonetheless!!
True
Our hypothetical relies heavily on the honor system. As it should.
Santa Roberto Clemente
Ora Pro Nobis
@ChristianTappe
But he has to homer, it’s like a logical fallacy for him to not homer. So if he hasn’t homered in his first three, he will get a fourth because he must homer.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 2:06 AM EDT up reply actions
Then it’s like, knowing the future. If he hasn’t hit a home run in his first three, and you don’t know if he’ll get another, you know you’re going to come back because he has to get his home run.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 2:08 AM EDT up reply actions
Man. These things are hard!
I’ve gotta go to bed. Tomorrow I’ll float my idea of the DH with 45-foot legs. As long as he keeps it on the ground, he’s nigh impossible to get out. And catching him stealing? Forget about it.
Santa Roberto Clemente
Ora Pro Nobis
@ChristianTappe
This hypothetical has provided a good lolz
crazy stuff
Or he could just draw walks all the time. I think that would be a pretty tough strike zone to hit and judge.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 2:12 AM EDT up reply actions
Also true.
You’d have to throw it up at like a 45 degree angle, which wouldn’t be THAT hard, but it’d definitely screw up your mechanics.
Regardless, he’d be a beast on the base paths. A variation of the hidden ball trick would be your only hope.
Santa Roberto Clemente
Ora Pro Nobis
@ChristianTappe
in fairness
dude does walk a ton..but you go inside on him and he’s done. at least that’s the book on him anyways
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 1:18 AM EDT up reply actions
does it register that
he strikes out a little more then 1 in 4 times at the plate, walks one in 7 times at the plate? and only puts a ball in play at most once a game?
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 22, 2011 11:40 PM EDT up reply actions
Pena is a better player than Overbay in just about every way
He gets on base more, hits with more power and plays better defense. The only thing Overbay does better is make contact. Unfortunately, most of Overbay’s contact consists of weak grounders to second.
Replacing Overbay with Pena would absolutely make the Pirates a better team.
pena makes harder contact fo sho
and he is better defensively, but i just dont see spending b level prospect to get him. hes got an inflated obp because hes getting pitched around.that doesnt do us any good….what is chase going to drive him in? if his babip was high i would be all over the get the pena here now train
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 22, 2011 11:52 PM EDT up reply actions
You're misinterpreting what BABIP represents
BABIP is stat that tends to be used to determine how lucky/unlucky a hitter has been. In general league BABIP tends to be somewhere near .300, though I think it’s somewhere a bit under .290 this year, though specific players can have their expected BABIP be higher or lower, and it’s usually a good idea to look at career averages for that. Pena’s career BABIP is .278, so it could be taken that so far this year he has been slightly unlucky, and for the rest of the year he could have a slight higher average, which would in turn increase his Batting Average some.
But comparing Pena’s BABIP to Overbay’s BABIP and saying that Pena’s is lower so he’s not as good doesn’t really matter. What matters is his OBP, SLG, OPS, wOBA, the numbers that directly correlate into batting runs.
Striking out a lot doesn’t actually matter that much in this context, since he is still walking a ton and hitting for good power. His OPS is hovering around .800, and with the chance of that even improving, there’s absolutely no question that he would be a significant upgrade over Overbay.
has everyone forgotten how to read.....
how many times to i have to say this
I’m not saying he is not an upgrade on overbay.
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 12:10 AM EDT up reply actions
well
you did do that selective stat comparison and completely failed to realize how much better Pena was than Overbay at that point so what was the point of that random stat compare?
hes got an inflated obp because hes getting pitched around.that doesnt do us any good…
This is completely made up nothingness. It’s patently false. He has a high OBP because he always does because he has an incredible eye. He’s so much better than Overbay, it’s not even funny. And you’re overrating what he’d cost by a lot.
you dont think
that the cubs would ask for at minimum a b level prospect for pena…going inside the division? and if his eye is so damn good as everyone seems to hold on to…why in gods name does he strike out so damn much?
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 12:07 AM EDT up reply actions
no
I don’t think that. They don’t have any leverage. He’s on a 1-year deal and the Cubs are toast, it’s not like he’ll be punishing them. The Tigers gave two nothing lottery ticket prospects for Betemit in a trade intra-division w/KC.
Do you really equate striking out to have a bad eye? C’mon man. Many of the players with the best plate patience strike out. They get deep into counts which creates more Ks. Ks doesn’t always equal someone without a clue. Many would regard Youkilis as having the best eye in baseball and he has 4 100+ K seasons.
It’s weird because on one hand, you’re vastly underrating Pena and not really understanding what he offers and then on the other you’re saying his price tag is going to be high.
You’re harping on all the wrong and meaningless things about Pena in one breath (namely the Ks) and then suggesting he’s going to have this massive cost for the Pirates (which he’s not, because his contract runs out after this year primarily).
i contend
that everybody see 20hr’s and is vastly overrating his value
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 12:16 AM EDT up reply actions
it is...im not saying its not
but what good is it when NOBODY is getting on in front of him
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 12:18 AM EDT up reply actions
If Tabata comes back you could have Presley, Tabs, and McCutchen batting ahead of him with NFW batting after him. I think that could generate some runs. Throw in Cedeno, a revived Pedro and Doumit and I think this offense could be respectable.
Put on your dancin' shoes.
not respectable,
potent. but the problem there is If tabs comes back. which is why i kinda like going after dejesus after some thought on it.
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 11:06 AM EDT up reply actions
it is…im not saying its not
but what good is it when NOBODY is getting on in front of him
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 12:20 AM EDT up reply actions
Well, hypothetically...
…if no one ever got on in front of Pena ever, it’d still be 20 runs good.
Santa Roberto Clemente
Ora Pro Nobis
@ChristianTappe
in a lineup with pedro
pena is a good add, but i dont see how a guy who strikes out 1 in four times and puts a ball in play 1 in four times is a must get for this team. that is what i have been saying since the buy the pena train started,
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 12:29 AM EDT up reply actions
You're discounting his on-base ability
and downplaying his power. He has elite power and elite on-base skills. This team needs people on base and it needs power. That’s why he’s a “must get”
Santa Roberto Clemente
Ora Pro Nobis
@ChristianTappe
Just stop
CTapps, he’s really not going to get it no matter how you phrase it. He doesn’t want to get it and he’s just not, so don’t waste your energy.
He’s repeating the same worthless tidbits as if they’re meaningful and ignoring literally every single part of the discussion that blows him out of the water. His type is common on the internet, lol.
this is how you argue a point
not you’re an idiot for thinking that way.
well done tapps….
but ffs im not saying the dude doesnt have pop and a ton of it….i am saying that with his avg, his babip i dont think hes a must add
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 12:38 AM EDT up reply actions
So if you were NH...
would you give up a couple B prospects for Pena and replace Overbay with him?
Keep in mind that there could be a good chance Pena could be signed after the season to another one-yr deal. He could be more than a rental.
Vastly more power, high number of walks and better defense. I’m making that deal.
Irrelevant
Because that’s not what he’d cost. They’re not squeezing anyone for two B prospects for 2 months of Carlos Pena.
how do you know they arent squeezing
clubs for two b level prospects…you dont….more speculation
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 12:45 AM EDT up reply actions
im not
not for a 2 month deal. he agrees to a long term deal then yeah
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 12:43 AM EDT up reply actions
Well who would you play at first base then?
And please don’t say Steve Pearce.
pick up a guy like dejesus
or willlingham, platoon peirce and jones at 1st
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 12:46 AM EDT up reply actions
Jones is a lost cause bro
He’s at .230 and plummeting.
which is prolly why
he’s not in a pirates uni come aug 1
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 12:49 AM EDT up reply actions
Look — you can argue all you want, but can you learn what BABIP represents before trying to use it in an argument?
Thank you Ned Colletti.
by ryebr3ad on Jul 23, 2011 12:45 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
uhhhh
batting average on balls in play….
over the past four years his babip has been 258, 222, 250, and 298. the point im trying to get across is that if this joker was able to reach the form he posted when with the rays in 08, go get him. right now his 258 looks like more of the norm
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 12:55 AM EDT up reply actions
The fact remains
that low BABIP or no, his OBP would instantly be second among qualified Pirates, and his HR total would be first.
Santa Roberto Clemente
Ora Pro Nobis
@ChristianTappe
Why do you keep equating BABIP to value???? Stop. It’s wrong. It’s completely flawed and it’s making you look bad as you continue to misuse it.
it has a direct corelation
to his declining average…
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 1:04 AM EDT up reply actions
i would much rather have a guy who
doesnt have prodigous power but can plate runners consistently then a bubba who can only plate them by going yard or a sac fly
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 1:07 AM EDT up reply actions
What does that even mean? Plating runners has more to do with the rest of your team than it does the actual hitter.
EXACTLY MY POINT
get guys who can actually friggin hit for contact then get power bats like pena
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 1:15 AM EDT up reply actions
my point is
getting pena is an upgrade on overbay, thats nothing new…not breaking news…none of that. the fact is the pirates as a club are in the 20’s as far as team ba goes. i dont know what the team obp is but im almost positive its complete garbage. we need to get on base more to enhance a guy like pena.
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 1:27 AM EDT up reply actions
But that has nothing to do with Pena. You’ve spent over an hour downing Pena to come to this conclusion. It’s not even the same discussion, bro. Of course they need more than one upgrade, it’s really not a good offense outside of Cutch, but that’s the discussion.
And you can’t just go out & remake the lineup in July. You have to deal with what’s available. In light of the fact that NH & Co. know that this probably isn’t a terribly strong contender, they aren’t gonna push on the best guys available (Beltran & Pence), so you go down to the affordable levels where you’re not sacrificing any legitimate future pieces yet still making a real impact and that lands on Pena.
As I said earlier, who do you think would be batting in front of him? Cutch of course and his being on base 38% of the time would work pretty well for a masher like Pena, especially if he hits another hot streak where goes off for 15-20 days. Tabata and his 35% on base when he returns would be there, too. He could be a major boost to the lineup.
Your primary contention, about rebuilding the offense, is an entirely different discussion and one best had in the offseason anyway.
it has everything to do with pena
if we are going to spend even one prospect for this guy imo its an overpay. we need to spend the prospects to help make this team better in the future, not now. spending the stuff to get a guy like pena for a 2 month long run and hoppping he gets hot, hopping tab’s comes back, and hoping pedro comes back…it just isnt a good move imo. its unclear at this point whether or not he would even think of sticking around, get the guys who have contracts that have team control past 2012
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 1:37 AM EDT up reply actions
Dude, no one was talking about anything long-term. You’ve completely changed the frame of reference on the conversation. The whole discussion is about this year’s trade deadline for this year’s team.
There aren’t trades to be made by next Sunday that are for the future of this team unless they start trading vets. C’mon man, if that’s the train you were on from the jump, you had to know it was completely different than what everyone else was discussing.
I still think you missed the boat on Pena’s value. You’re trying to ding him for not being something he’s never been which is patently unfair. And then only at the very end did you uncover that you were talking about something entirely different than everyone else. Do you see where the confusion can come in?
this managements mantra has always been
the future. the future is not now its next year and beyond. getting pena provied short term relief for power in the middle of the line-up but nothing long term (ie 2 years down the road). if god and everybody wants to make a play for this year, go get pena. you want to build a club go get a guy like butler.
and yes i do see where some confusion could come from if you loose sight of the long term goal which is never returning to this abysmal streak again.
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 1:47 AM EDT up reply actions
Look, we’re on the same page in a lot of respects. I wrote a long piece basically saying they needn’t make a serious push at this year. It just ain’t happening. They’re at best the 3rd most talented team in the division and with so much time left in the season, the cream will likely rise.
As much I’ve loved Butler from a fantasy aspect, I would not want the Pirates to get him. He cannot play 1st at all and he just doesn’t have enough power for the position. Now if they could get an outfielder that hits like him, I’m with ya.
But in terms of the long term v. short term, I’m still thinking long term. This year is a gift for them, but it shouldn’t disrupt the plan that was slated for ‘12-’13-’14 area.
And???
Who cares about batting average? He’s never been a batting average asset save one dream season and despite that he’s maintained value for many more beyond that one. You’re continued focus on BABIP and AVG means nothing. It doesn’t prove anything one way or another. Next you’re going to tell me he doesn’t steal enough or bunt very well. Everyone with any semblance of who Carlos Pena is knows he doesn’t hit for average. Who cares???
i care because
we have 5 guys on this frigign roster who cant hit right now. screw it lets add a 6th because the dude has a high slugging percentage has gone yard 20 times and has a high ops in not necessarily the most friendly pitchers park.
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 1:13 AM EDT up reply actions
As far as "value" goes, though
it’s largely out of a player’s control. Sure there are certain factors (Players slowing down, not hitting the ball as hard, popping up a ton, etc)….but Pena’s sustained power numbers suggest that’s not the case. Furthermore, batting average itself isn’t all that indicative of value, especially if a guy is getting on base at a very good clip as Pena is.
Santa Roberto Clemente
Ora Pro Nobis
@ChristianTappe
i try
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 1:27 AM EDT up reply actions
A presence can hit singles. We need the middle of the lineup to be able to get on base, which they haven’t done. It’s really hard to string together hits when you have four black holes in the lineup. We don’t need power, we just need people who can hit the ball.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 22, 2011 11:31 PM EDT up reply actions
got one of em back today
in ronny.
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 22, 2011 11:33 PM EDT up reply actions
If we can't string runners together
doesn’t that make a bopper even more valuable? Guaranteed runs > stranded runners
Well, in that case we are gonna need about four more bats with higher On Base Percentages. I would like at least a little doubles power in the lower half of the line up.
Put on your dancin' shoes.
they are all on the dl
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 11:00 AM EDT up reply actions
@BiertempfelTrib
Pedro Alvarez’s locker in #Pirates clubhouse has been cleaned out. Even name plate is gone. Message: don’t expect quick return from minors.
The frick??
I agree he shouldn't be rushed...
but completely cleaning out the guy’s locker? That sounds serious.
It does...
and the target of the message is clear.
If they are sending him elsewhere for the rest of the year, then something is obviously wrong. But, what that something is, who knows?
I didn’t want Pedro brought up until August of last year, but quickly forgot that as I caught the rush he brought once he got to the team. All of these guys need development to some degree.
"Never mistake motion for action." - Ernest Hemingway
I guess there must be something specific they want him to improve on...
…because he’s got a .400 wOBA at AAA. Could just be trying to light a fire, I guess.
Santa Roberto Clemente
Ora Pro Nobis
@ChristianTappe
Could just be trying to light a fire, I guess
I’ve wondered about this. Remember the Neil-Walker-Attitude narrative that we got from the FO?
"Never mistake motion for action." - Ernest Hemingway
Our front office??
They don’t do things like that. [/sarcasm]
Probably the not missing the ball so much that they didn’t teach him when they rushed him to the majors.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 1:04 AM EDT up reply actions
They've stated they want him to go the other way (use the whole field)...
stop being so pull happy and then by doing that he would naturally cut down on his K’s. Until he starts using the whole field I wouldn’t expect to see him in Pittsburgh. That said I also read that Huntington was keeping a close eye on how Pedro performs this weekend. He may be back in the Burg sooner than we think.
#AllTheBuntsAreBad!
Does anyone on a minor league roster have a locker in Pittsburgh?
Doesn’t make any sense that he would have one.
by sanny manguillen on Jul 23, 2011 12:56 AM EDT up reply actions
i dont know what this means?
do they keep guys lockers when they are sent to the minors? I mean, it seems that this would be the normal thing to do, but apparently not…
smoke and mirrors?
Maybe we need to become sellers after all,because huntington ain’t doin SHIT!!!!!!
I'll say this...
If NH doesn’t try to make a upgrade at 1B, then I’d have to seriously question what the FO is doing. No reason for Overbay to be our 1B after July.
Every indication is that he is trying.
What you’re saying is that he has to make a deal or youre questioning what he’s doing. Which means a deal, good or bad. Can’t agree with that.
by Horace Clarke on Jul 23, 2011 1:11 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Hague would be fine. Overbay should have been replaced 3 weeks ago
by Mr. E on Jul 23, 2011 4:16 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
MORE IMPORTANTLY... HERE IS THE 9TH INNING RALLY VIDEO THAT DEBUT TONIGHT AT PNC THAT APPARENTLY FIRED UP THE CROWD
AND IT… IS… FUCKING… AWESOME
Yeah...
That chick getting all worked up is kinda hot though…
"So you think 25 percent of the country is retarded?! Yea. Atleast 25 percent. Well lets do a sample. There are 4 of us an you're retarded. Thats 25 percent." Southpark; Mystery of the Urinal Deuce
RIP Corey Keller, James Taylor, M. Jay Darby, Derek Davis.
by gorillakilla34 on Jul 23, 2011 1:50 AM EDT up reply actions
dude thats keira knightly
she’s smoking hot, 8 fingers on the scale
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 1:52 AM EDT up reply actions
8's a little high
she needs to get a burger & a dentist, stat. Cute face, unquestionably, but not an eight with that grill & figure. I prefer the American version of her: Natalie Portman. Of course neither holds a candle to Portman’s Black Swan co-star, Mila Kunis… now we’re talking 8+!
Yes! Kunis is bad ass.
But I wasn’t referring to her being hot as much as I was referring to her getting worked up as hot… she’s still hot though…
"So you think 25 percent of the country is retarded?! Yea. Atleast 25 percent. Well lets do a sample. There are 4 of us an you're retarded. Thats 25 percent." Southpark; Mystery of the Urinal Deuce
RIP Corey Keller, James Taylor, M. Jay Darby, Derek Davis.
by gorillakilla34 on Jul 23, 2011 1:59 AM EDT up reply actions
scratch that
on the teeth, she appears to have veneers in that video link. always a good option. still lacking the curves to pull an eight, ya know?
you friggin people have no taste
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 2:00 AM EDT up reply actions
How so?
You’re dolin’ out 8s to chicks with the figure of a 14 year old boy and you’re saying we have no taste?? C’mon!! I’m giving you that her face is supercute, but she’s no eight man. Maybe in England, but not in Texas.
Lol.
Yeah I mean Prince Harry is considered a hot chick in England.
"So you think 25 percent of the country is retarded?! Yea. Atleast 25 percent. Well lets do a sample. There are 4 of us an you're retarded. Thats 25 percent." Southpark; Mystery of the Urinal Deuce
RIP Corey Keller, James Taylor, M. Jay Darby, Derek Davis.
by gorillakilla34 on Jul 23, 2011 2:04 AM EDT up reply actions
Not such a big fan of objectifying women.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 2:04 AM EDT up reply actions
Then don’t engage in the convo, but spare us your condescending nonsense at the same time please. You really found it that abhorrent to talk about how pretty some hollywood starlets are?? C’mon man, that’s a pretty high horse there.
I don’t care who it is. I always get on people on this board for how they talk about women. I just don’t like how people on here talk about women. It’s offensive to me, and generally insulting to them. If a woman ever came on these boards she would probably be pretty offended at times, especially in a game thread.
I’m just sick of every time a woman is in a photo or video on here, people have to talk about how hot she is or how they would bang her or something. It’s not necessary, there are other places for that sort of talk.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 2:11 AM EDT up reply actions
the best is
hot chick in the bikini with the pirate flag photoshoped in when we raise the jolly roger…now thats bad
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 2:13 AM EDT up reply actions
The best was the one game thread when we won and people started posting pictures of women in bikinis without having anything to do with the Pirates.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 2:14 AM EDT up reply actions
lol
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 2:14 AM EDT up reply actions
Ya, internet msg boards… c’mon man, you’re really trying to police men talking about girls on an internet msg board? I mean, keep fighting the good fight, but good luck.
by psporer on Jul 23, 2011 2:13 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I would just like people to tone it down a bit. Not everyone enjoys that type of thing.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 2:14 AM EDT up reply actions
this
to each his own, but dont try and force sheet on the frequenters of bd…same goes for politics,religion etc.
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 2:15 AM EDT up reply actions
I’m not trying to force anything on anyone. You can talk about women however you want, just preferably not in a public setting where people may come and be offended. Speaking of religion, if I started to talk about certain religious figures how I feel about them, people would be insulted. Just because a larger majority would be insulted doesn’t mean it’s any more of an injustice.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 2:18 AM EDT up reply actions
Like I said, this was toned down. I didn’t think it was much of anything really. And again, since it’s not lewd and inappropriate, there’s really no need to police it like that.
I didn’t say it was inappropriate, I said it was objectifying women.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 2:16 AM EDT up reply actions
Semantics
You implied it was wrong & inappropriate and offensive enough to drawn your condescension which I didn’t really think it did.
To each his own. And I wasn’t necessarily offended by the conversation you were having, so much as a culmination of the treatment of women on these boards. Poor Lacee…
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 2:19 AM EDT up reply actions
Now if anyone was posting details on what they’d do to some chick then maybe I’d slightly agree with you… but just to say a girl is hot? How is that offensive?
"So you think 25 percent of the country is retarded?! Yea. Atleast 25 percent. Well lets do a sample. There are 4 of us an you're retarded. Thats 25 percent." Southpark; Mystery of the Urinal Deuce
RIP Corey Keller, James Taylor, M. Jay Darby, Derek Davis.
by gorillakilla34 on Jul 23, 2011 2:13 AM EDT up reply actions
Saying a woman is attractive is not a problem. When you start rating them, and analyzing them on specific attributes and talking about how one is better than the other because of this or that, how is that not treating them like an object?
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 2:15 AM EDT up reply actions
I dunno man...
I can’t say that I’ve really given it much thought. I’m a steelworker so it’s almost part of my job. Lol. I just don’t really see how that’s offensive but if it means that much to you cheese I’ll make a conscious effort to not do it. cool?
"So you think 25 percent of the country is retarded?! Yea. Atleast 25 percent. Well lets do a sample. There are 4 of us an you're retarded. Thats 25 percent." Southpark; Mystery of the Urinal Deuce
RIP Corey Keller, James Taylor, M. Jay Darby, Derek Davis.
by gorillakilla34 on Jul 23, 2011 2:19 AM EDT up reply actions
Nah, I mean I overreacted to be sure. This was a relatively tame conversation, it was just more a culmination of things. This type of thing is probably not a big deal, I just want people to watch it sometimes, that’s all.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 2:21 AM EDT up reply actions
Maybe come in with that first instead of the lead you gave us. Like I said, as did gorilla, I’ll be mindful of you in threads where women talk comes up, but we just made a few quick statements about some good actresses who are also really pretty.
I mean yeah, I could have said something different. And when it isn’t 2:30 in the morning I probably would have. I just get frustrated by this sort of thing all the time. Not this conversation, or this blog. I just get very angry about how men treat women sometimes, and if I get a whiff of it, I’ll probably be upset.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 2:26 AM EDT up reply actions
Honestly
I’m not the least bit interested in breaking down the semantics and details of your definition of objectification of women. I came here to talk Pirates and then a few off-handed comments about a few famous women were made and within bounds as far as I saw it. Sorry you’re offended, but that will happen on internet message boards. I’ll be mindful when you’re around, but you’re also free to ignore it.
As I said above, did I overreact a bit? Yes. It’s more of a combination of things than this conversation itself. And yes, I’m free to ignore it. But I don’t think I should have to.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 2:23 AM EDT up reply actions
we're going in cirlces
bc we’re missing posts while typing others.
on some level, you’re also asking the entire board to cater to your needs which is a pretty big ask. for me, it’s no real skin off my back as that’s not even what i come to this site for, but I just didn’t like how you approached from the jump which has been apologized for & fully accepted.
Alright, fair enough.
But I would like to point out that these aren’t just my needs. I’m sure there are other people who feel similarly. I’m just asking people to watch themselves, because this isn’t an old boy’s club, it’s a public forum and you never know who’s looking and who will be offended.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 2:29 AM EDT up reply actions
you don't have to tell me...
I use my real name all over the net whether at the sites I write (paulsporer.com, pittplank.com, rotohardball.com – shameless plug in the house!!!) or on twitter, fb and msg boards and I also work in Corporate America so I mind my p’s & q’s. At least within the bounds I feel I should be.
As I said earlier, keep fighting the good fight, but I imagine it ain’t easy out there for you. I’m more than happy to keep things Pirates-centric & baseball-centric.
And you probably were perfectly within acceptable bounds. But the conversation set me off, what can I say? It happens.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 2:38 AM EDT up reply actions
I hear ya
I think it’s pretty clear for me to say I have been there given my tussle with oldtimehockey. But I hope he truly understands I wasn’t making personal attacks on him, rather I was disagreeing (perhaps too strongly) with his points.
Not usually this many. But it’s tough to say. With the team in competition, most threads have been pretty huge lately. Traffic has certainly been booming. This is a long one, but not abnormally so.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 2:46 AM EDT up reply actions
That depends, are you his equal? I think not.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 4:40 PM EDT up reply actions
Men Stuff
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e7qLm8nZxQc
It’s what we do, we make our own beef jerky, go on river boat gambling trips and talk about hot women.
I’m against any over the top behavior in this way but you are a tad hyper-sensitive
Maybe I am hyper-sensitive. Or maybe I’m just preemptive where I see there could be a potential problem. Or maybe you shouldn’t be reviving what was a dead issue 12 hours later to crack poor jokes about it. Who can say?
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions
It's not dead if you keep doing this
This was just the most egregious of your objections. and I just got here, pardon me.
As I said many times, it wasn’t this particular issue, it’s the behavior I find on this site in general towards the topic of women.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 4:48 PM EDT up reply actions
and I think you’re hypersensitive if what was said above even registered a bleep on your radar. Maybe it’s a generational or cultural gap, but that’s the way I feel. FWIW (i.e. nothing) I talked to 3 female friends about this sort of thing and all pretty much shrugged and accepted men are pigish. If you’re worried about kids, I can see it as inappropriate completely.
I guess it’s just that they shrug and say that, I don’t think they should have to, and I’m offended when men behave piggishly. I don’t believe it has a place here.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 23, 2011 8:26 PM EDT up reply actions
i liked it and the little kids sitting next to me (about 6-9) really liked it. It’s corny but it’s a baseball game. corny and ball games go hand in hand :)
Yinzers uber alles
I like it also
but i didn’t see forts homer in there, im kinda bummed about that but i still think its pretty bad….pens need to come up with something along these lines
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 10:10 AM EDT up reply actions
Good news for the night
R Ro Ronny Cedeno is back in action….ill be glad to admit that i missed his sorry ass lol
Thats what she said! - Michael Gary Scott
upton....
The Rays have pulled B.J. Upton and prospect Desmond Jennings from their respective games, tweets Adam Kilgore of the Washington Post (via Twitter). Kilgore notes that the Nationals scouted Tampa Bay earlier this week.
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 22, 2011 11:35 PM EDT reply actions
heh the Nationals can suck it, hope they trade the farm for ’em
Thats what she said! - Michael Gary Scott
which from what i gather
is what the rays were asking for him
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 22, 2011 11:39 PM EDT up reply actions
If the Nats give up a lot of their best prospects for BJ Upton....
then their GM is an idiot. First, he signs Jayson Werth to a HUGE contract with little to no pieces around him to help and now possibly giving up the farm for a player somewhat on the decline?
Sure, Upton’s still young, but I’m giving all that up (possibly) for him. I guess we’ll see
i wouldnt mind
having upton
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 12:33 AM EDT up reply actions
Giving up all what? What is the prospective deal? All I’ve heard if Upton for Ian Desmond at this point.
Oh
I was just wondering if I had missed something with some names outside of Desmond.
I actually really like Upton and I think it’d be smart for the Nats to get him at the right price. They wouldn’t have to give an egregious price, IMO, and he’d be a nice addition to their core.
Doesn't mean the Nationals made the deal
All they wrote was that they scouted them
by Zach Buccos on Jul 22, 2011 11:40 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah
but they (the rays) wouldnt pull him and a prospect on the same day unless a deal was about to get done. he is going somewhere fo sho
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 22, 2011 11:41 PM EDT up reply actions
That's not true at all.
It’s just as likely a coincidence as it is indicative of a move. Jennings was never in. He may go somewhere, but right now it’s 100% speculation and reading deeply into every little move because it’s almost July 31st.
heh im just in a pissy mood right now as im playing a game and losing. sorry for the temper flare haha
Thats what she said! - Michael Gary Scott
and unless im reading into this in the wrong manner, the Nats dont seem like they are in a position to buy. currently under .500 and in no wild card race or divisional race. unless they are just trying to secure an above .500 season, a move like this would seem almost pointless
Thats what she said! - Michael Gary Scott
i was just reading on mlbtr
that the phillies were also taking a look at him…but the philies try and buy everything
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 22, 2011 11:46 PM EDT up reply actions
It's a move for the future
They think Stras and Zimm can carry a rotation next year and that Harper will be patrolling the OF at some point. Upton isn’t a FA to be
Jennings was called up...
because Reid Brignac was optioned to the minors.
IIRC though
The Rays have like 4 guys who can all play SS
Santa Roberto Clemente
Ora Pro Nobis
@ChristianTappe
Not really
Elliot Johnson is really the only one. Sean Rodriguez has stood there a little, but he’s not a legitimate full-time option. Zobrist and Upton have both played there in the past, but both would have stayed there if they were capable.
Huh?
Teams don’t always do like-for-like on call-ups/send downs. TB won’t trade Upton if they don’t get what they desire.
Sure
But that’s not the only piece of information we have. TB’s been actively shopping Upton for some time, they’re pretty much out of contention now and they just called up their CF of the future. I really don’t think Upton is a Ray on 1 Aug.
The “that makes no sense” thing was all I was responding to. There’s nothing nonsensical about it. He may well be traded, but that move on its own isn’t nonsensical. That’s all I was saying.
d'Arnaud
Anybody else ready to see him sent back down? He might be a good mlb player in a year or two but 0-4 with 3k’s every night from the 2 spot drives me nuts. He’s got 1 fracking rbi,1. He makes some nice plays in the field, but still has an error every other game too. Wood atleast might be able to hit one out, d’Anaud is almost an automatic out, then there’s one out atleast with our best hitters coming up everytime. Put him at 8 if he’s gotta play but it just makes me crazy having him at 2 every night.
dude
we’ve been ready to send him back down, but there really isnt anyone to replace him with. harrisons pretty good…we just need our normal lineup back
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 22, 2011 11:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Harrison is awful
Everything that guy just said is bullshit . . .thank you
he's not awful
but he certainly isnt great….he’s a good player but like chase needs more time on the farm…like virtually everyone in the dugout right now.
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 22, 2011 11:54 PM EDT up reply actions
Why was Diaz pinch-hitting instead of Pearce?
I mean, it’s obvious to anyone with a functioning brain that Pearce is a better hitter.
Everything that guy just said is bullshit . . .thank you
UPTON NOT TRADED
according to talkingchop
http://www.talkingchop.com/2011/7/22/2289535/uggla-lifts-braves-to-6-4-win-as-kimbrel-notches-record#comments
seems as though brignac was summoned to the managers office though according to those guys, wonder what the move is then
Thats what she said! - Michael Gary Scott
so brignac demoted/traded/something jennings promoted and upton pulled?
Thats what she said! - Michael Gary Scott
Seems like Upton being pulled was just a coincidence
Santa Roberto Clemente
Ora Pro Nobis
@ChristianTappe
my money is on
him being moved. at some point tomorrow…or very soon at least
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 12:02 AM EDT up reply actions
But he wouldn’t get pulled from tonight’s game unless he was being moved now so it’s pure speculation to believe he’s on the move.
which is what we ARE ALL DOING
IS IT YOUR INTENT TO TROLL EVERYONE OF MY POSTS TONIGHT FFS
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 12:17 AM EDT up reply actions
LOL
Because I disagree with the wildly incorrect assertions you’re making, I’m trolling your posts? Oh ok, some more of your sound logic. Thin skin much?
forgive me if
i dont particularly liked being called an internet by some guy who just joined the site in the last week. my bad
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 12:43 AM EDT up reply actions
*idiot
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 12:47 AM EDT up reply actions
I didn’t call you an idiot. I pointed out where you were wrong and your thin skinned-self absorbed that as a personal attack. Don’t put your points and assertions out on the net to be read if you aren’t ready to hear when you’re incorrect. Like I said, toughen up a bit.
wildly incorrect assertions you’re making
He’s repeating the same worthless tidbits as if they’re meaningful and ignoring literally every single part of the discussion that blows him out of the water
That’s not a terribly bright way to look at it.
sounds pretty cut and dry there sport.
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 12:59 AM EDT up reply actions
Cut and dried that the stuff you’re saying is incorrect. I stand behind it. You’re taking it as a personal attack instead of trying to learn where you’re wrong and actually move the discourse forward.
Dudes...
You guys totally need to meet somewhere and fight. That’d be cool.
"So you think 25 percent of the country is retarded?! Yea. Atleast 25 percent. Well lets do a sample. There are 4 of us an you're retarded. Thats 25 percent." Southpark; Mystery of the Urinal Deuce
RIP Corey Keller, James Taylor, M. Jay Darby, Derek Davis.
by gorillakilla34 on Jul 23, 2011 1:57 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Sigh...
First it was a joke dude. Second quit being a douche. Imagine what I said taken in the context of a Beavis and Butthead episode because that’s totally how it sounded in my head…
"So you think 25 percent of the country is retarded?! Yea. Atleast 25 percent. Well lets do a sample. There are 4 of us an you're retarded. Thats 25 percent." Southpark; Mystery of the Urinal Deuce
RIP Corey Keller, James Taylor, M. Jay Darby, Derek Davis.
by gorillakilla34 on Jul 23, 2011 2:02 AM EDT up reply actions
this is why
im going to the gym…
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 2:03 AM EDT up reply actions
Because that context is 100% clear in the first msg… ya, but go ahead and resort to namecalling because your intentions weren’t picked up over text. That’s some nice logic there.
Lol.
You’re ridiculous dude. I’m not trying to get into a lame ass internet fight with you. Go be anal on someone else. You seemed to have taken a liking to oldtimehockey09…
"So you think 25 percent of the country is retarded?! Yea. Atleast 25 percent. Well lets do a sample. There are 4 of us an you're retarded. Thats 25 percent." Southpark; Mystery of the Urinal Deuce
RIP Corey Keller, James Taylor, M. Jay Darby, Derek Davis.
by gorillakilla34 on Jul 23, 2011 2:10 AM EDT up reply actions
THANK YOU!
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 2:11 AM EDT up reply actions
LOL
I like you. Want to be my facebook friend too?
"So you think 25 percent of the country is retarded?! Yea. Atleast 25 percent. Well lets do a sample. There are 4 of us an you're retarded. Thats 25 percent." Southpark; Mystery of the Urinal Deuce
RIP Corey Keller, James Taylor, M. Jay Darby, Derek Davis.
by gorillakilla34 on Jul 23, 2011 2:16 AM EDT up reply actions
Cool. I’ll be sending you event invites and game requests in no time.
"So you think 25 percent of the country is retarded?! Yea. Atleast 25 percent. Well lets do a sample. There are 4 of us an you're retarded. Thats 25 percent." Southpark; Mystery of the Urinal Deuce
RIP Corey Keller, James Taylor, M. Jay Darby, Derek Davis.
by gorillakilla34 on Jul 23, 2011 2:25 AM EDT up reply actions
I’m having a birthday party for my friend’s sister’s boyfriend’s dog, should I send you the E-vite or just assume you’re totally in? :)
Let’s put it this way: Is the sister hot? And will there be beer? …but I’ll probably be in either way…
"So you think 25 percent of the country is retarded?! Yea. Atleast 25 percent. Well lets do a sample. There are 4 of us an you're retarded. Thats 25 percent." Southpark; Mystery of the Urinal Deuce
RIP Corey Keller, James Taylor, M. Jay Darby, Derek Davis.
by gorillakilla34 on Jul 23, 2011 2:29 AM EDT up reply actions
OK
On the real, we totally have to be friends because you put my alma mater, University of Texas, as one of your favorites in your profile.
I’m origionally from Houston. I was born there and moved to the Pittsburgh area as a young kid. Most relatives I have that like college sports are Texas fans so it was a natural choice for me.
"So you think 25 percent of the country is retarded?! Yea. Atleast 25 percent. Well lets do a sample. There are 4 of us an you're retarded. Thats 25 percent." Southpark; Mystery of the Urinal Deuce
RIP Corey Keller, James Taylor, M. Jay Darby, Derek Davis.
by gorillakilla34 on Jul 23, 2011 2:35 AM EDT up reply actions
and perhaps
if you would present valid counterpoints rather then thinly veiled insults you would get farther
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 1:05 AM EDT up reply actions
by trolling them
and throwing out insults. not by going point to point and being civil
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 1:09 AM EDT up reply actions
That's not even close to true
Again, you need to stop getting your feelings hurt so much. Instead of paying attention to all the times I refuted your points, you took it personally and continued to bring up things like AVG & BABIP that don’t matter. You keep trying to shift the focus of the debate because you keep saying incorrect things.
how do you not take
That’s not a terribly bright way to look at it.
personally
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 1:14 AM EDT up reply actions
looking like Rays fans are speculating Ian Desmond from the Nats
Thats what she said! - Michael Gary Scott
Jaramillo?
Caught his second game tonight. Does it make sense that he’d be called up for Sunday? It doesn’t seem like they’re eager to use Frey.
by sanny manguillen on Jul 22, 2011 11:56 PM EDT reply actions
In the "Gee, What's New?" Department...
Nyjer’s acting like a mega-douche in center field again, this time pretty much flipping off everyone in the bleachers in SF. Stay classy, Nyjer…
lol
suprise!
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 12:31 AM EDT up reply actions
I would be entertained
if Wilson drilled Morgan in his next AB.
by bruinbowler on Jul 23, 2011 12:40 AM EDT up reply actions
id be happy
if it happened in every ab
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 12:41 AM EDT up reply actions
Video:
The Giants broadcast caught it live, then for some reason decided to go back and show it again in slow motion.
http://www.sportsgrid.com/mlb/video-brewers-of-nyjer-morgan-flips-giants-fans-the-bird/
Tony Plush is a nut
I think some of the fans in the bleachers out there were yelling stuff at him and egging him on and of course Nyjer responded.
Soriano is the same way.
He is very easily agitated and responded with stare downs and hand gestures.
"So you think 25 percent of the country is retarded?! Yea. Atleast 25 percent. Well lets do a sample. There are 4 of us an you're retarded. Thats 25 percent." Southpark; Mystery of the Urinal Deuce
RIP Corey Keller, James Taylor, M. Jay Darby, Derek Davis.
by gorillakilla34 on Jul 23, 2011 2:39 AM EDT up reply actions
Looks like he DIDN'T actually flip anyone off...just the two outs sign...or some other goofy Morgan thing
Santa Roberto Clemente
Ora Pro Nobis
@ChristianTappe
Agreed
I saw a still shot taken from the side that made it impossible to determine that two fingers were extended, but the whole up-yours motion can’t be argued. “Flipping off” was the wrong choice of words, but it wasn’t far off from that…
Everyone? Not very classy to make things up.
"Prince Fielder is too fat even for the Oakland A’s" - Billy Beane
How am I making things up?
Yes, everyone. While he may have been goaded into his predictable actions by just one, or a handful, or an entire section of Giants fans, he did the ol’ whirly-bird with the universal up-yours salute while in the middle of center field where anyone and everyone could see it. He may not have flipped the traditional bird, but the intent is pretty clear. I’m not offended by the act itself, but I’m extremely tired of his entire act. It’s time to grow up…
The Brewers can have him – good riddance…
By everyone, you obviously mean almost no one. Yes, that’s making things up.
"Prince Fielder is too fat even for the Oakland A’s" - Billy Beane
Your interpretation of what I “obviously” mean is inaccurate. His intent may have been to immaturely stick it to just a few fans, but by doing so on center stage in a public forum, he subjected everyone to it.
In the grand scheme of things, it’s insignificant. You like him. I don’t. Let’s just drop it. Fair enough?
Maybe a little suspension?
The Brewers have already lost one CF on this trip.
by sanny manguillen on Jul 23, 2011 12:51 AM EDT reply actions
was at the game, and pretty disappointed
but, good things first…
[ 1 ] The crowd was great. I had to grab a SRO ticket since (as usual) I am unable to figure out if i can make it till the last possible second…
[ 2 ] The Bucs made a game of it. I couldn’t imagine the 2010 Bucs even getting into the game after being down 4-0
The bad:
[ 1 ] Bad running on the bases. Might have cost us the game.
[ 2 ] XP shouldn’t be considered a bat off the bench just because he’s a lefty. I swore (to the surprise of everyone around ;) when he was announced, and I still feel it should have been Pearce or Wood.
[ 3 ] Walk Pujols. Esp Maholm. Seriously, just walk him.
[ 4 ] From v far away and a bad angle, Grilli looked borderline good. I was kinda afraid that we would blow the game there, and maybe the low expectations played a part…
[ 5 ] No Pearce. I suppose they trust Chase’s glove more, but he shouldn’t be seeing the 2 spot for awhile. And by awhile, I mean a loooong time…
Cedeno's got the hot bat.
He should be in the 2 hole. If d’Arnaud is gonna play, I’d bat him 7th, just to keep from having 2 black holes in a row at 8 and 9.
What are we at the park for except to win? I'd trip my mother. I'd help her up, brush her off, tell her I'm sorry. But mother don't make it to third. ~Leo Durocher
McKenry (#8) was 3 for 4 tonite...BA up to .250
by Central*Scrutinizer on Jul 23, 2011 6:06 AM EDT up reply actions
yup fort did pretty well
glad to see cedeno back in the line up. e played well all around. i havent seen any footage of grillicheese’s pitches would love to see his appearance on film. but i dont think the bad running cost us the game, it cost us at best one run, the friggin rbi single given up to carpenter cost us the game. molina’s homer just sealed it. lotta things went wrong last night, but a lot went right tbh. the boys showed a lot of resiliency coming back from four down against one of the better pitchers in the nl. bad first inning for paul but he righted the ship and performed back to his norm the rest of the way which I’m also glad to have seen. just too many runs to over come when you have a triple a line up with three major leaguers sprinkled in between. gotta get healthy
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 6:11 AM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, that was my point. If d"Arnaud bats 8th, that's 2 black holes in a row
What are we at the park for except to win? I'd trip my mother. I'd help her up, brush her off, tell her I'm sorry. But mother don't make it to third. ~Leo Durocher
i would much rather
see them all bottled up at the bottom of the line up….you intermix them and you get rally killers. just my opinion though
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 23, 2011 11:01 AM EDT up reply actions
“XP shouldn’t be considered a bat off the bench just because he’s a lefty. I swore (to the surprise of everyone around ;) when he was announced, and I still feel it should have been Pearce or Wood”
My jaw literally dropped when Pearce didn’t come in there.
Paul pinch hitting is just a waste of everyone’s time. He’s like what, 2-30?
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