Pirates Reportedly Acquire Derrek Lee For Aaron Baker
Well, he has to be better than Lyle Overbay. The Pirates would get Lee and cash, while the Orioles would get a Class low A hitter.
Lee is hitting .321 (17-for-53) with 3 HRs and 13 RBI since the All-Star break but is just .248/.306/.409 for the season.
UPDATE by Charlie: I suppose this is fine, as long as the Class A player isn't anyone terribly interesting, which I doubt. Given the prices other teams are paying right now for players better than this, I can't blame the Pirates for aiming a bit lower.
UPDATE 10:47 PM: Dan Connolly has a whole series of tweets on this. Connelly says the return is a Low-A player, which has people in the comments speculating that it's someone from State College. That's one possibility, I guess, but a lot of people say "Low-A" when they're referring to West Virginia's level, and a lot of the State College guys aren't eligible to be traded yet. Either way, there isn't a lot of interesting hitting at those levels, so I suppose that's good.
... All this assumes, of course, that Connolly's information is right and the return has been agreed upon, which might not be the case.
UPDATE 10:58 PM: More details: the Orioles are sending a bit of cash, and the minor-leaguer is "not expected to be a top prospect."
UPDATE 11:02 PM: I'll be on 104.7 with David Todd at about 11:10 to discuss this.
UPDATE: 11:10 PM: The Pirates have apparently traded Aaron Baker for Derrek Lee. I'm fine with this. It's a decent deal from Baltimore's perspective, too, but Baker isn't worth worrying about. He's nearly 24 and is still in Class A+, and his strikeouts and lack of any truly outstanding hitting tools keep him from being a great prospect. I don't think I've ever even had him in one of my top 30s. Matt Curry is a much better first-base prospect. This isn't a great deal, by any means, but it's an upgrade for a reasonable cost, and those haven't been easy to find this trading season. I would expect Lyle Overbay to be gone when Lee reports.
10 months ago
Brakeman8
561 comments
0 recs |
Email
PrintComments
Baltimore media reporting it is a done deal on those terms
"Throw strikes, but don't give him anything good to hit."
Dave Littlefield must have left some of his Dumb Pills in the executive washroom at PNC.
You're entitled to your own opinions. You're not entitled to your own facts.
Why?
He’s basically a free two month upgrade over Lyle. Sure it isn’t Pena or Davis, but it’s better than Lyle.
Isn’t he know as a second half guy?
It doesn’t cost a thing to believe and the payoff on a winner is huge!
IF... IF Lee performs... he could easily be just as bad as Lyle has been
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 10:26 PM EDT up reply actions
The guy has more home runs than Lyle has RBI since the ASG
I’m not saying he’s a good player, I’m simply saying he’s better than Lyle.
It doesn’t cost a thing to believe and the payoff on a winner is huge!
It would’ve made more sense just to give Bowker or Hague a shot. This is the kind of deal you make just for the sake of making a deal.
You're entitled to your own opinions. You're not entitled to your own facts.
Yeah, but unless they gave up Grossman or Cunningham...
…it’s not really that big a deal. He’ll be an upgrade over Overbay for no real cost. Why not?
Santa Roberto Clemente
Ora Pro Nobis
@ChristianTappe
In past 30 days: Lee, 6 HR, 19 RBIs; Overbay, 1 HR, 5 RBIs.
So onto my love rocket, climb, Inside tank of fuel is not fuel, but love.
by IAPiratesFan on Jul 30, 2011 11:02 PM EDT up reply actions
So.....
….is that what we go for now. Just to get someone that is better than the junk we have now? Not a good player, not someone that is going to help us in the future, just be better than Overbay. Heck Aaron Baker is better right now as a hitter than both of them. Not that he would make the jump to the majors but it tees me off to lose him for Derrek Lee.
Better than Overbay
He has at least posted better numbers since the last time I looked when he had about the same wOBA as Overbay. Better defensively as well.
But yeah, hopefully the A ball player isn’t that significant.
I'd far rather have had him than Overbay II
You're entitled to your own opinions. You're not entitled to your own facts.
I would really like it if we got DeJesus.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 30, 2011 10:21 PM EDT up reply actions
where has Calvin Anderson been?
I dont recall having seen him around in the box scores in a bit
by BurgherKing on Jul 30, 2011 10:28 PM EDT up reply actions
D.Lee
has been hot since june 27th, in his babip is around or even below career avg so its not a fluke, unlike pence, plus his move to the nl should improve those numbers
by Dalas Mallon-loeb on Jul 30, 2011 10:23 PM EDT reply actions
i thought we are giving them a LOW A player
grossman, cunningham and anderson are HIGH A players…
i cant even begin to guess whom it is.
i posted a list of mdoerately interesting low A players on the gamethread
and there’s not much there:
Rojas (surely not, i hope), Howard, Grovatt, Maggi, Noris, Diaz, Emsley Pai, Avila. Coupla other guys that I dont think the Os should be interested in at all.
by BurgherKing on Jul 30, 2011 10:30 PM EDT up reply actions
no, says low A
I dont know how to link to specific tweets but you can see it here: http://twitter.com/#!/danconnollysun
by BurgherKing on Jul 30, 2011 10:32 PM EDT up reply actions
dickerson is the only hitter of concern there right? not worried about that
Thats what she said! - Michael Gary Scott
yeah, dickerson's untradeable
Can’t be traded even as a PTBNL — he can’t be traded for ten months or so, PTBNLs have to be named within six.
Not actually affiliated with whygavs.
by WHYG Zane Smith on Jul 30, 2011 10:35 PM EDT up reply actions
oh i suppose
i think of WV as low A, and SC as short season A… not sure if thats a universal convention though
by BurgherKing on Jul 30, 2011 10:36 PM EDT up reply actions
Here.
(Looks like a update to the previoius tweet.)
Not actually affiliated with whygavs.
by WHYG Zane Smith on Jul 30, 2011 10:34 PM EDT up reply actions
qn
how do you actually get the individual tweet on a page? if i only know his twitter page address?
by BurgherKing on Jul 30, 2011 10:36 PM EDT up reply actions
Click where it says "31 minutes ago" or whatever
Not actually affiliated with whygavs.
by WHYG Zane Smith on Jul 30, 2011 10:38 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah
in a separate tweet linked by WHYGZS, he said low A- not sure if one overrules the other or whether they are meant to be connected
by BurgherKing on Jul 30, 2011 10:37 PM EDT up reply actions
but he now hits in PNC, not a RH friendly park…how is the Os home stadium?
Thats what she said! - Michael Gary Scott
well well this may not play out oh so well then…time will tell
Thats what she said! - Michael Gary Scott
we'll ROOT for Lee or whomever NH gets
hopefully we’ll also be kinder if Lee doesnt perform
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 10:35 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah PNC could be trouble for Lee...
but at this point, NH had to take a gamble like this…
by BurgherKing on Jul 30, 2011 10:38 PM EDT up reply actions
I'd be okay with this
Presuming it isn’t much of a prosect in return. We need more help than D. Lee who is nothing but a cheap rental, but teams are suddenly paying a high prospect cost for players. Sucks. I’m surprised the Tribe paid that price for Jimenez and glad we didn’t given the hbalth concerns. Barring the health concerns he would’ve been a good fit.
I’d be down w Kubel. I also hope NH is shopping our RP and Maholm to see what we could get (except for Hammer).
If no big move by 4 tomorrow need to make a splash in off season.
Good day.
by Uncle Nate on Jul 30, 2011 10:31 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
This deal isn’t meant to be a long-term thing though, just to get us through the season without Lyle continuing to suck at 1st, so as long as the cost isn’t much(and if it’s a low-A hitter, as long as it’s not Dickerson or Rojas, then the cost is pretty dang low), it’s a worthwhile rental. It still leaves us the issue of who’ll play 1st next year, but Neal can deal with that later.
Fully agree about Kubel though, for all the high hopes I had about GJ coming into the season he hasn’t produced, especially recently. Given that Tabata looks like he’s going to be out a while yet, getting Kubel would be a good move.
it cant be dickerson
but rojas looks like a possibility
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 10:39 PM EDT up reply actions
so is this
a high or low A hitter, could it be A.Baker or Anderson from Bradenton? Or a virtual no name at low A, unless it is rojas of course
Thats what she said! - Michael Gary Scott
I still can't believe the Injuns gave up Pomeranz
It doesn’t cost a thing to believe and the payoff on a winner is huge!
looks like the indians are "ALL IN-dians"
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 10:34 PM EDT up reply actions
Not really sure
Dejan says “prospect price high”, but if it’s a low A player I can’t even imagine who he’d be talking about.
He said low-A hitter, which takes Allie, Black, Cain, etc out. After that, the only low-A hitters that are marginally interesting would seem to be Dickerson at SC and Rojas at WV, so not sure what Dejan’s talking about.
Trades
I’m a bit disappointed to put it mildly.
I thought (for once) we might be active in getting someone that might make a real difference.
Great crowds through the summer, and winning baseball.
Is this all we are going to be rewarded with?
They should’ve made a real play for Pence.
It’s a tragedy to let Philly get him for two Class A players.
I can feel for the Astro fans because I’ve been through that before.
lol really dude, they gave up 2 top 50 prospects in the entire league and then some. learn some stuff before posting
Thats what she said! - Michael Gary Scott
by C Shint on Jul 30, 2011 10:36 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
+1
The tragedy is that the Bucs may have to deal with Singleton down the line, if he becomes a stud.
Not actually affiliated with whygavs.
by WHYG Zane Smith on Jul 30, 2011 10:37 PM EDT up reply actions
Shint
Hey, kindly shut your mouth.
Who do you think you are? Frank Coonelly Jr?
I know plenty, but I don’t have to sit on here and rub it in to the likes of would-be tough guy posters like you.
This is the reason I don’t visit this blog that often.
It’s not Pirate fan friendly in my opinion.
Yes, kill me. The Pirate FO should be doing more.
They have till tomorrow, so we’ll see.
I will state my opinion whether you like or not.
by HonzaBednarik on Jul 31, 2011 12:23 AM EDT up reply actions
Stating your opinion is perfectly fine, but in fairness to C Shint, it IS disingenuous to say that the Pirates should have gone after Pence because he was had for two class A players. He was had for two top 50 prospects. Pence absolutely is not worth that, and that’s a price the Pirates cannot afford to pay. The Phillies can because they can lock guys up beyond their team controlled years, but the Pirates have to be smarter and have to value prospects more than the Phillies do.
And
no.. you don’t know “plenty.”
Da'Sean Butler - A Mountaineer Legend
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Aug 1, 2011 1:22 AM EDT up reply actions
we were active...
it takes two to tango and sometimes three to slam dance.
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 10:36 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah
kinda sucks to be Overbay right now. Its unfortunate.
by BurgherKing on Jul 30, 2011 10:43 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah, hes a good guy
he knew his job was on the line. good luck to Lyle in his future endevours.
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 10:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Players are always happy when the team adds a name they recognize. I’m sure they were all ecstatic about Overdone.
You're entitled to your own opinions. You're not entitled to your own facts.
Esp that he was a former 2Bs champ.
"When I put on my uniform, I feel I am the proudest man on earth."
-Roberto
by blackjackfishtaco on Jul 30, 2011 10:56 PM EDT up reply actions
Overbay's had a good career
he deserves better than the horseshit said about him. it gets ridiculous
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 10:57 PM EDT up reply actions
And yet
you have no problem saying subjective stuff about Jones that, while they are more temperate in tone, are just as dismissive and often unfair in substance. This to me is a prime example of why these discussions go sideways. Prejudices make it impossible to evaluate players objectively. Overbay underproduced, so he is human garbage. We found out Jones wasn’t going to be a regular, which most of us knew, but because someone tried to ride his runaway 2009 horse for two years because we had nothing else, he should now be blamed for that and dismissed as completely useless. Ronny Cedeno was a slug and now people want to keep him next year. Let’s not even start with Doumit, or going back a few years to the ridiculous and downright ignorant crap that people dispensed about Craig Wilson. The only saving grace is that the Fan Posts and comments usually don’t read like the game threads, which have become depressing. The Pirates could do a service by having an event (charity, low contribution, whatever) where posters could meet the players and talk to them. I would bet anything that the tone here would change overnight if enough people came. Frankly, knowing that several of the players look in here and read some of the stuff that is written makes me wince in embarrassment. Yeah, they make a lot of money. Most are only lucky enough to do so for only a few short years, and then are forgotten and have to make it in the real world, just like everybody else. I have no problem with objective critiques of players’ abilities based on their actual performance. However, I have no interest in your mind’s eye view of a player, which sees all of his strikeouts and bad paths to scorching line drives, and misses his walks, singles and doubles. I have even less interest in that view when it is presented with the kind of vitriol that in more than a few cases was less harsh than what I’ve seen thrown at the Norwegian mass killer.
"Throw strikes, but don't give him anything good to hit."
by RichieHebner on Aug 2, 2011 3:01 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
so if they dont cut ties with Lyle right away, Pearce to AAA? he has kinda been really sorta bad since the recall
Thats what she said! - Michael Gary Scott
Also I wouldn’t be surprised if it is a Cunningham or Grossman, it’s been an insane sellers market this season
Can’t be Grossman or Cunningham since they said it was a low-A hitter. Looking at WV and SC’s rosters, the best guys on there would appear to be Dickerson and Rojas.
Grossman is a top prospect at his age
and leads baseball in walks or something
no, no hes not... not yet
not until he cuts down the K’s…
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 10:44 PM EDT up reply actions
and he's still getting on base
half the time. But in any event, as we’ve discussed before, he has them trending the right way, and i agree it needs to come down or all the peripherals need to stay in the same place as he climbs levels (which is naturally hard)
by BurgherKing on Jul 30, 2011 10:47 PM EDT up reply actions
He's only 21
If he was in the draft this year he would have been sent to high A for next year. The guy is one year above where he would be if he went to Texas.
I think Grossman has put himself in the Top 10 of Pirate prospects with his year this year.
No Way
Cunningham or Grossman are not the ones and sure as crap would not be going for two months of D- Wreck Lee
his best numbers were at Miller Park and Great American...
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 10:43 PM EDT up reply actions
i lold
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 30, 2011 11:01 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah, but
Now he won’t be facing the Pirate pitching that he accumulated those stats against.
Lee is a guy I specifically didn’t want last winter and I hope we dnt have after this season, but given the circumstances is an decent short term upgrade.
Good day.
by Uncle Nate on Jul 30, 2011 11:40 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I'm really surprised the O's are letting GIDPLee go,
given the great job that Showalter’s doing there.
Right, jackiejenkins?
Free your ass and your mind will follow.
ok
lets not call him gidplee just yet please?
by BurgherKing on Jul 30, 2011 10:44 PM EDT up reply actions
It was his nickname with the Cubs.
And until he’s a Pirate, I’m afraid I’ll have to continue.
I’m sure you understand.
Free your ass and your mind will follow.
by cocktailsfor2 on Jul 30, 2011 10:48 PM EDT up reply actions
showalter is the answer, baby
what was the O’s final score tonight anyway??? LOL
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 10:44 PM EDT up reply actions
I brought this up in the game thread
…it probably wouldn’t happen…but I’d dangle Kevin Correia in front of the Yankees who have missed out on all the starting pitching so far. They need it. The Red Sox have added Harden.
I bet the Yanks would overpay for KC’s 12 wins. Pirates call up Lincoln and, really, you’re probably no worse off…maybe even better off.
Santa Roberto Clemente
Ora Pro Nobis
@ChristianTappe
Harden is not an SP
do they plan to make him start?
by BurgherKing on Jul 30, 2011 10:45 PM EDT up reply actions
Harden IS a SP...
just one that can’t stay healthy very long.
rather
hasnt been used as an SP this year, because he’s liable to crack any minute. I assume the Bosox may be willing to take that chance and get what they can out of the arm.
by BurgherKing on Jul 30, 2011 10:49 PM EDT up reply actions
the yankees though tend to go the more flashier route at times, i could see a surprise contender make a move for correia, arizona? detriot? cleveland even? they would seem to be more inclined to overpay
Thats what she said! - Michael Gary Scott
i dont know what AZ would have given up
but if we knew they were looking at Marquis, I sure hope we approached them for correia
by BurgherKing on Jul 30, 2011 10:46 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, but there isn't a flashier route. That was Ubaldo.
KC would be kinda flashy. He has 12 wins.
Santa Roberto Clemente
Ora Pro Nobis
@ChristianTappe
well i wont argue with you on that one, except im not NH, so i cant call the yanks up about dealing them KC
Thats what she said! - Michael Gary Scott
I think that's true for like everybody who spent a few years in the NL Central.
Santa Roberto Clemente
Ora Pro Nobis
@ChristianTappe
http://twitter.com/#!/BiertempfelTrib/status/97495854457434112
Bucs not expecting to pay much of Lee’s remaining 2.6 mill.
I’ve see a tweet from a Baltimore reporter (MASN) indicating that the Orioles are only sending $400K.
hmmmmm, it would be hard for the O's to be shedding salary by paying us 100% of Lee's contract
Thunder is probably right on this one.
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 10:52 PM EDT up reply actions
That pays for the fireworks nights
Kidding folks, kidding.
I would ask give the Orioles..
Diaz, Overbay, and Pearce along with their A player as a sign of good fate.
apparently the deal may not be finalized till tomorrow
dangit. I m amused how quiet the Bucs are able to keep this thing.
That probably means...
it’s gonna take several hours to look over those medical records.
Those are quite possibly the least useful stats one could provide from that timespan. And yes, I am bitter about this trade.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 30, 2011 10:59 PM EDT up reply actions
i think NH has tried to get someone better than Lee in here...
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 10:59 PM EDT up reply actions
Who said hes done too ya know?
Lee and another OF bat tmrw ya never know. We got Lee for virtually nothing ya know
I’m sure he has. That won’t make meany happier about Derrek Lee being on the team. And giving up a living person for him.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 30, 2011 11:01 PM EDT up reply actions
matt curry hits in his sleep
Thats what she said! - Michael Gary Scott
by C Shint on Jul 30, 2011 10:59 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Trades
Get real.
I talked to several Philly fans and they are laughing in their sleep about the Pence deal.
Their words?
“We didn’t give up shite or shinola for Pence, and he’s ours.”
by HonzaBednarik on Jul 31, 2011 5:14 AM EDT up reply actions
when I look for knowledge and reason, I always turn to Philly sports fans
Not actually affiliated with whygavs.
by WHYG Zane Smith on Jul 31, 2011 8:09 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Your
“several Philly fans” are retarded. Cozart and Singleton aren’t “shite or shinola” and Pence is vastly overrated by both fans and the media.
His power has trended down each year (meaning he’s done the opposite of get better) and this year his average is driven by BABIP and is very fluky.
The Phillies came pretty damn close to overpaying for Pence, although he fits in solidly with their team for the next 2.5 years. Our team on the other hand has too many holes to fill for Pence to fill him, so he would “waste away” in Pittsburgh over the next 2.5 years as we kinda contend for the NL central, before he leaves. Meanwhile we would wistfully watch as Heredia and Marte or Taillon and Curry (similar packages) continue to be top prospects. Even if one player from each pair reached 90% of their potential while the other completely flamed out the Pence trade would go down as a horrible one for the Pirates.
Da'Sean Butler - A Mountaineer Legend
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Aug 1, 2011 1:35 AM EDT up reply actions
Just went to the Orioles SBNation blog
to get some intel – they don’t appear to realize that the trade has occurred yet….
What does that mean?!
Picky, picky
hasn’t stopped us from commenting on it.
What does that mean?!
by Trogluddite on Jul 30, 2011 11:08 PM EDT up reply actions
Other moves...
Orlando Cabrera from Indians to Giants. Return for Furcal to Cardinals is some money and a minor league outfielder not on the Cardinals 40 man roster.
Yeah, so they got Jimenez, and then gave up Cabrera
It’s like they went all in, then changed their mind
Fans are clingy complaining dip****s who will never ever be grateful for any concession you make. The sooner you tune out their shrill, tremulous voices, the better you'll be.
Ben "Yahtzee" Croshaw
Pittsburgh Pirates and Cleveland Browns fan, so I know suffering. I truly do.
by ytownbucsfan on Jul 30, 2011 11:03 PM EDT up reply actions
Not really
Living in y-town, all my friends who are indians fans are feast/famine about he Jimenez trade
Fans are clingy complaining dip****s who will never ever be grateful for any concession you make. The sooner you tune out their shrill, tremulous voices, the better you'll be.
Ben "Yahtzee" Croshaw
Pittsburgh Pirates and Cleveland Browns fan, so I know suffering. I truly do.
by ytownbucsfan on Jul 30, 2011 11:05 PM EDT up reply actions
sure
but what does cabrera have to with it? he’s pretty expendable
by BurgherKing on Jul 30, 2011 11:06 PM EDT up reply actions
I guess I just figured having a veteran presence helped. I guess they must have liked this Neal guy
Fans are clingy complaining dip****s who will never ever be grateful for any concession you make. The sooner you tune out their shrill, tremulous voices, the better you'll be.
Ben "Yahtzee" Croshaw
Pittsburgh Pirates and Cleveland Browns fan, so I know suffering. I truly do.
by ytownbucsfan on Jul 30, 2011 11:08 PM EDT up reply actions
Where does Cabrera even play for them? they have that new kid at 2b, and asbrudal? at SS
Thats what she said! - Michael Gary Scott
They got Thomas Neal for Cabrera...
Sell! Sell! Sell!
by nealtherealdeal on Jul 30, 2011 11:05 PM EDT up reply actions
was just gona post that
Neal has had a massive drop in AAA in the PCL for reasons not quite clear to me. Looked good till last year. Again, Sabean has been good at identifying falling prospects, so not sure yet they necessarily gave anything up
by BurgherKing on Jul 30, 2011 11:07 PM EDT up reply actions
i watched thomas neal quite a bit last season in Richmond
he can run. yawn.
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 11:08 PM EDT up reply actions
Well its better than Overpaid
At least we aren’t giving up Grossman.
BJ Upton to Bucs
please…please…please…please
It doesn’t cost a thing to believe and the payoff on a winner is huge!
I doubt we have what the Rays want
or we are willingly to part with what the Rays want.
presuming nobody too substantial is dealt, I like it
if the pirates add lee and DFA overbay, that gives the outward appearance of going out and adding someone to satisfy the players, fans and media while for all practical purposes, it’s basically standing pat… which is probably a wise move from a personnel standpoint…
by Captain Easychord on Jul 30, 2011 11:08 PM EDT reply actions
Excuse me while I pat myself on the back
Above you will see I suggested it was Baker or Anderson. :-)
Looks like it's Aaron Baker
http://twitter.com/#!/danconnollysun
Doesn’t seem like a big loss.
eh...we have Hague, Curry and Dickerson
It doesn’t cost a thing to believe and the payoff on a winner is huge!
baker is behind Hague, curry and dickerson
expendable
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 11:12 PM EDT up reply actions
Seriously,
If the Pirates had any confidence in Baker having much of a future, he would have been promoted to Altoona earlier in the year and Curry to Bradenton. Instead, they jumped Curry over Baker. Should tell us everything we need to know about Baker. That said, he is at least mildly interesting. But defintely behind the likes of Curry, Dickerson, Grossman, Cunningham, etc. I see no problem with this deal.
If they had no faith in him
they wouldn’t have effed with Curry’s development to keep him on the field.
but its glorious shit. with marshmallows and sprinkles.
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 11:13 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
I mean...
1.) There is time left.
2.) The asking prices (and gets) have been outrageous.
Further, he went hard after Beltran and Beltran didn’t want to come to Pittsburgh. The Cubs aren’t trading Pena. The Phillies paid huge for Pence.
I kind of have to hand it to Huntington for not making a desperation move and moving big prospects in this crazy seller’s market.
Santa Roberto Clemente
Ora Pro Nobis
@ChristianTappe
+999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 30, 2011 11:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Cool.
You win a free Leinenkugels!
So onto my love rocket, climb, Inside tank of fuel is not fuel, but love.
by IAPiratesFan on Jul 30, 2011 11:13 PM EDT up reply actions
hes the next bautista, maaaaaan
or future barista… either one is okay
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 11:14 PM EDT up reply actions
Lee for Aaron Baker - yes please!
Great deal by our GM
This deal will be irrelevant either way.
It does by goodwill from the yinzers so I guess that’s a plus, but I still would not have made this deal.
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
*buy
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
Because we aren't going to make the playoffs, and may not go .500 either.
Is Lee going to net any comp picks? If so that changes me to a yes vote, if not then I’d rather have a prospect with a 10% chance to make it than Lee for 2 months for money that we don’t need to spend.
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
what do u care about the money
Its Nutting’s. You seriously wanted to see B Wood and Overbay at 1st the rest of the season? Really?
Pirates have just traded someone that will probably never make it to the majors for someone in Lee that actually has a heartbeat. Seriously people are angry about this? Makes no sense.
I care about the money because I'd rather it be spent on prospects.
I’m not angry because it is irrelevant, but I still wouldn’t have made the deal unless I knew Lee was going to be Type A/B.
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
2 million's not precluding the Pirates from their normal (big) spending on prospects.
Santa Roberto Clemente
Ora Pro Nobis
@ChristianTappe
It's $2M less than we can spend on other players or on prospect facilities.
It matters.
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
Not sure, I'm not Neal Huntington.
But its $2M less than we could have spent, tough to argue that.
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
You are making a mountain of whatever is a rung or two below a mole hill.
Santa Roberto Clemente
Ora Pro Nobis
@ChristianTappe
Already posted this is an irrelevant move
Not sure how its a mountain.
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
Wringing your hands over not have enough money anymore to pay for prospects and facilities
Santa Roberto Clemente
Ora Pro Nobis
@ChristianTappe
Agreed
People are acting like we aren’t going to sign our draft picks now because of D. Lee. Omg we won’t get those king size beds at our dominican academy now. Please.
Hello people we brought in Chris Snyder at the deadline last year. That cost money and that didn’t stop us from signing our draft picks.
How can you know if we wouldn't have signed more?
You are using speculation as fact.
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
No, they aren't
It doesn’t matter what the Pirates say publicly, they are a single entity. Separate budgets is a term to appease the masses.
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
Because its true for any entity in the world unless they are legally separated with different tax codes.
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
So no company can set budgets for different aspects of their business unless they’re legally obligated?
If the company goes bankrupt, do they only take money from certain projects?
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
Who the hell is going bankrupt
You make no sense.
This has nothing to do with baseball
It’s how any company in the world works.
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
You act like the Pirates are on a shoestring budget
D Lee costs us like a million plus minus whatever the Orioles don’t cover.
NH spent 5 milion on Overbay this offseason. And you are worried about a million bucks to improve on the worst 1b in pirates history in Overpaid? C’mon
Yes I am because its a waste of resources.
Every dollar counts.
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
Again there are separate budgets for ML payroll and everything else.S o this effects nothing outside of ML payroll.
See above.
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
Right.
They’re only going to spend a fixed amount on draft/international and facilities, because anything past a certain point would give you diminishing returns. There are only so many blue-chip prospects in the draft or Latin America.
by Adam Reynolds on Jul 30, 2011 11:30 PM EDT up reply actions
Where is the analysis on that?
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
It’s just common sense. There isn’t an unlimited amount of prospects in a draft or the Latin countries. They can sign me, but that won’t do them any good…
Where’s the analysis that they don’t have separate budgets (like any other business)
by Adam Reynolds on Jul 30, 2011 11:34 PM EDT up reply actions
Because there are not two separate legal entities for the draft and for the MLB team.
It’s the same tax code, hence the same budget regardless of what the Pirates tell the yinz to appease them.
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
if you're going to use "yinz"
which is a classist, elitist, and bigoted phrase, AT LEAST use it correctly. In that context you should have said “what the Pirates tell the yinzers to appease them.” Ironically, your misuse of the epitaph makes you sound like a slack-jawed yokel.
Plus if you have too many prospects, the 40-man roster and the team rosters will be overcrowded.
by Adam Reynolds on Jul 30, 2011 11:35 PM EDT up reply actions
Then just cut Overbay to make room.
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
And waste over 2 millon dollars
for him to do nothing? WASTE OF RESOURCES
I’m sure there are seperate $$$ set aside for all aspects of the organization. To suggest that Derrek Lee will prevent us from signing Josh Bell is ridiculous.
by psudynasty1017 on Jul 30, 2011 11:30 PM EDT up reply actions
Totally agree
People are getting worked up over nothing.
I don’t think that his chances are anywhere near ten percent, but I mostly agree with you. But if this team gets over .500, that will be huge for the franchise. And I’m willing to give up Aaron Baker to help that happen.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 30, 2011 11:20 PM EDT up reply actions
Even if its 1% chance, I still don't make the deal.
We are wasting money for no reason besides buying yinz goodwill.
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
we either stand pat or we take on players
no way this team is traders this season. who is going to give us anything for our “talent”???
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 11:24 PM EDT up reply actions
I'd trade Maholm for any single C prospect or better.
Somebody would give that up easily
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
Nope
We owe him $10M next year, if he doesn’t put up 2.0 WAR we are losing value.
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
But if you decline it for nothing you don't get picks unless you offer arb, so why not take a prospect or multiple prospects?
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
The Pirates will be picking up that option
or negotiating a contract extension with Maholm.
He seems to want to stay and he’s a good 3rd starter who’s a lefty. None of which is in our system.
That would be a horrible idea.
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
yes
because the pirates should go back to fielding 105 loss teams
by Captain Easychord on Jul 30, 2011 11:37 PM EDT up reply actions
You think Maholm is the only reason we improved this year?
This is the worst comment of the month, congratulations.
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
Nobody has said that
But to act like Maholm hasn’t pitched well is idiotic on your part.
Ace of the staff…
Lot of it’s due to him and Cutch/Walker having good years.
by Adam Reynolds on Jul 30, 2011 11:39 PM EDT up reply actions
Which doesn't mean he is an Ace.
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
Maholm
hasnt put up less than 2 WAR since 2007, when he put up 1.8
by BurgherKing on Jul 30, 2011 11:46 PM EDT up reply actions
Velocity is down compared to career averages.
I wouldn’t say he’s a good bet to do that over the course of another long term deal.
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
Maholm never threw hard
And he’s only 29. Which is in the prime of his career.
Maybe we can call up Brian Burrows
to replace Maholm.
Lincoln
Nice try champ.
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
Why?
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
You watching the games?
The guy can’t pitch more than 6 innings and he’s getting bombed since his smoke and mirrors start. Also can’t find the plate. And he’s soft.
Morton will be the worst starter for the rest of season. Book that.
3.98 xFIP
Is fine to me. Over the long run he’s probably going to provide the most to the Pirates of anyone we have on the current staff.
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
What long run?
He’s only pitched well for like 2 1/2 months. Last month he had a “tired” arm. Did the WAR or xFIP show that when he couldn’t take the ball for the team?
Morton = Soft.
And on top of that BB wouldn't be 2nd on the list either.
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
I was being sarcastic with Burrows
Obviously it went over your head, not surprisingly.
/Huntington isn't that stupid.
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
Right
Wait who gave Overbay 5 million
Signed Matt Diaz to a 2 year deal who has 0 hrs
So you think Huntington is a bad GM?
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
Who do you want as GM?
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
Who do you want as GM?
Syd Thrift or Joe L. Brown. Too bad both men have passed.
by Bradley James McEachern on Jul 30, 2011 11:51 PM EDT up reply actions
I bet he puts up a 2.0 WAR next year, plus you can trade him next year.
I say keep him and pick up the option.
Santa Roberto Clemente
Ora Pro Nobis
@ChristianTappe
Again, I said I agree with you. Unless the team has a winning season and Lee helps, which would make up the money spent on him. Plus he’s extremely close to being a type B player, and moving to the NL should make him even closer. One slot out I believe. A slight improvement on this season plus a decent gamble on a pick for next year for Aaron Baker isn’t bad.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 30, 2011 11:26 PM EDT up reply actions
Its all about saving money for some
The fans just have to come to the park and watch wood and overbay. No improvements if its costs money
Attendance is up this year.
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
Yeah because we are winning
You think its because of Overbay? Pirates made the right move to improve that situation with D. Lee and gave up nothing of value.
We gave up value based on the differential of his WAR versus what we will have to pay him and the expected future value of Baker
Offset by any comp pick we get back, which is not guaranteed.
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
Lee is a name
attendance would have sunk if no move was made. Lee at least delays that, which offsets his contract.
Attendance was up without any moves, I doubt it would have gone down without Lee
It’s based on performance, Lee will be 1.5 WAR max.
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
And by 1.5 WAR max I'd bet he is going to be more like 0.5 WAR
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
which at current market rates is worth...
$2.5 million.
Not actually affiliated with whygavs.
by WHYG Zane Smith on Jul 31, 2011 8:14 AM EDT up reply actions
more for a team that's any kind of playoff contender in August, of course.
Not actually affiliated with whygavs.
by WHYG Zane Smith on Jul 31, 2011 8:14 AM EDT up reply actions
So you would of rather traded Taillon/Heredia for Pence than AARON BAKER for Lee?
by psudynasty1017 on Jul 30, 2011 11:32 PM EDT up reply actions
No, I want to be a seller
We shouldn’t have traded for anybody.
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
Goodwill
Not just for the yinzers. If I’m Andrew McCutchen, and I’m looking hard a contract extension, I’m also thinking hard about what it means to play in a small market like Pittsburgh. Even getting Lee makes me feel a lot better about my bosses.
For the record, I don’t think the Bucs are contenders this year, and I don’t think that Lee will make much of a difference. But an acquisition like this that costs very little and comes at a pivotal juncture in Pirates history likely has an off-the-field impact as well. That impact may or may not be negligible. It certainly can’t be quantified. But I don’t think that it can be dismissed, either.
by ThisYearsModel on Jul 31, 2011 12:01 AM EDT up reply actions
Lee is extremely close to being type B. And that’s without part of his recent hot streak He doesn’t have to bounce back much to be a type B. I think it’s a decent gamble on that front.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 30, 2011 11:31 PM EDT up reply actions
If he is a Type B then I am for the deal.
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
Considering if you take the latest Elias rankings and switch him to the NL ,he is one slot out of the comp picks, don’t you think it’s a decent bet that he rebounds a bit and becomes a type B? In addition to upgrading the team slightly for the time being.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 30, 2011 11:35 PM EDT up reply actions
Tough to say
What do you think the odds are?
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
Actual odds? Well, it’s tough to say because nobody knows for sure and those reverse engineered rankings can be a little iffy. But I do expect Lee to perform better the rest of this year, and the NL is weaker competition since there are no DH’s which are included in the AL rankings. I would give it above 50%. I would be willing to go maybe 70%, barring injury or just awful performance.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 30, 2011 11:42 PM EDT up reply actions
If I knew we got a comp pick for sure, I'd make the deal.
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
Well, the thing is, since those rankings aren’t released, you can’t be certain you’re going to get a pick with someone on the lower end. And if they are certain, the team giving him up knows and will generally ask more. So that’s why I think it’s a good move to go for someone who currently isn’t a type B, but could easily move into that range, but you don’t have to pay the premium.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 30, 2011 11:49 PM EDT up reply actions
Wouldn't he likely accept arbitration if it were offerred?
by WestCoastBuc on Jul 30, 2011 11:51 PM EDT up reply actions
You never know, they could come to a handshake agreement, or he could want to be a bench bat for a competitor, any number of things could happen.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 30, 2011 11:52 PM EDT up reply actions
eh Baker was kinda log jammed at high A, Curry at AA, Hague at AA, Dickerson most likely to low or High A….Baker was expendable, no harm no foul
Thats what she said! - Michael Gary Scott
it would have been better to send calvin anderson
but dang, who wants him anyway?
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 11:17 PM EDT up reply actions
AARON BAKER! NOT AARON BAKER!!!!!!!!!!!
Lolz. Sarcasm. I’ll take it.
at least we have nate baker
too many chefs in this kitchen
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 11:16 PM EDT up reply actions
thank god for that
I d hate to give up any of the 3 Zacks that come to mind right now, no sarcasm
by BurgherKing on Jul 30, 2011 11:48 PM EDT up reply actions
Fuesser?
Da'Sean Butler - A Mountaineer Legend
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Jul 30, 2011 11:53 PM EDT up reply actions
Dodson, Fuesser and ZVR were the 3 that came to my mind
by BurgherKing on Jul 31, 2011 12:01 AM EDT up reply actions
My opinion:
I don’t hate this deal, but I don’t love it either. Let’s just say my reaction to this one isn’t nearly as bad as the Matt Morris trade. I would rather see Hague. But I suppose a few months of Lee for Aaron Baker isn’t gonna destroy the franchise.
So, let’s hope that he continues to heat up and that he lets us win a few games….
So onto my love rocket, climb, Inside tank of fuel is not fuel, but love.
Pirates Prospects on the twittez:
It is. Baker is behind Curry and Dickerson on the depth chart. RT @HIP_H0P_JORGE: Is it just me or is this an excellent deal?
So onto my love rocket, climb, Inside tank of fuel is not fuel, but love.
its a good deal, just not a difference maker
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 11:17 PM EDT up reply actions
our offense is still not going to be any good
now our defense is beginning to unravel. quality hitters are lighting us up.
whew, good thing we have the Cubs and Friers coming up
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 11:18 PM EDT up reply actions
by no means, for our offense to be good, we will need alvarez, doumit, presley and tabata back…all internal fixes, lee is a slight improvement though
Thats what she said! - Michael Gary Scott
almost common sense, did you see adam reynolds post in the game with our lineups OPS. You add in the guys i just named with lee now and an improved pedro, its a very legit lineup…compared to the shit show we have now
Thats what she said! - Michael Gary Scott
our shit now is pretty much the same shit we had before that shit went down.
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 11:25 PM EDT up reply actions
Yep, it's pretty perfect
Price is low, he’ll improve on Overbay, casual fan will see we made a move and Neal still has 16 hours to do some more work. Not bad at all.
not bad, not really good either
this sounds bad, but its not a good year to be a contender aparently
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 11:19 PM EDT up reply actions
Great thing about baseball
Is you never, never know. Could be – still gotta retain the fan qualities, even through advanced analysis.
I don't think Baker is much of a defensive player either
He’s probably a DH if he ever makes it.
Baker has shown pop!
Oh wait he’s older than Tabata playing single A! Let him platoon with Overbay! Ok I was kidding!
by Joey Mooney on Jul 30, 2011 11:18 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
According to Elias
Lee is just short of Type B status too. Might a hot end to the season bump him up?
let's hope!
And let’s hope he doesn’t have something where he can’t be offered arbitration or a matching offer whatever iti s
yeah, but what if Lee accepts arbitration
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 11:21 PM EDT up reply actions
What would he get even if he did.
He signed for 7.25 this year and his numbers are down. So, what? 5.5 or 6 mill.
Overbay cost 5 this year.
I think it might be worth the risk.
He
will sign arbitration I bet. Guys don’t sign arbitration because they won’t long term deals. He’s too old to get one.
Da'Sean Butler - A Mountaineer Legend
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Jul 30, 2011 11:29 PM EDT up reply actions
The question is, would he be a bad sign at Overbay type money. Assuming we have not found a better 1B solution.
he is not going to get lower in arb
than what he made this year. Unless we can get a handshake agreement with lee to turn down arb, no chance we offer it to him, imo, unless he goes on a massive tear.
by BurgherKing on Jul 30, 2011 11:50 PM EDT up reply actions
Yep
Which we can hope for. I think what we should do (and I bet teams do this) is tell Lee to not accept arb… come to a number together arb would probably be, and tell Lee if no one signs him in Free Agency for more than arb would have been, we’d give him that number + 1 million dollars.
Da'Sean Butler - A Mountaineer Legend
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Jul 30, 2011 11:55 PM EDT up reply actions
If he plays well, I can see him back next year
We don’t have anyone coming up.
Then we have Derrek Lee for another year. As long as it isn’t for too much money, there are worse fates.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 30, 2011 11:22 PM EDT up reply actions
That'd be nice.
So onto my love rocket, climb, Inside tank of fuel is not fuel, but love.
by IAPiratesFan on Jul 30, 2011 11:20 PM EDT up reply actions
fwiw, Lee's historically been good on the road in NL Central parks...
by Captain Easychord on Jul 30, 2011 11:21 PM EDT reply actions
er... that's a home park, yo!
higher OPS at every other NLC park, save houston (!)…
by Captain Easychord on Jul 30, 2011 11:24 PM EDT up reply actions
er
it’s been a road park until now. In fact, still is until he plays a game there for the Buccos. lol
I was just looking at his numbers broken down by park… best at GABP (.998 OPS), then wrigley (.942), new busch (.889), miller (.870), pnc (.840), minute maid (.728)
by Captain Easychord on Jul 30, 2011 11:33 PM EDT up reply actions
This is a very fun pickup, to get a guy with the career Lee’s had. That said, we also need an outfielder and relief to prop up the magical run IMO.
i think we need a starter, but doubtful that happens
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 11:22 PM EDT up reply actions
dont forget sept call ups and ollie coming off the dl
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Jul 30, 2011 11:28 PM EDT up reply actions
Ohlie?
Ohlendorf? somehow I feel that wont be much of an upgrade… unless Morton keeps up what he’s been doing recently
by BurgherKing on Jul 30, 2011 11:51 PM EDT up reply actions
wouldnt mind an OF, doesnt seem like Tabata will be back soon.
Thats what she said! - Michael Gary Scott
Agreed. A Jones/Diaz platoon seemed decent enough at the start of the year, but neither’s shown the ability to be a starter this year hitting-wise, and Jones’ atrocious fielding the last 2 games just made it worse. If Tabata would be back soon then I wouldn’t want a deal, but since he apparently won’t be back till late next month at the earliest, I think acquiring someone else couldn’t hurt.
4 real players
Cutch
Walker
Alvarez (almost)
Lee
Perspective
Where would Baker rank on Pirates prospects list? I’ve seen nobody mentioning him as top 30. Would he even be top 40? Not sure why anyone would be upset about trading a guy who is just about a month shy of 24, and still in A ball – a truly marginal" prospect".
he would be top 50, im sure
he was at the beginning of the season, and his year so far has been pretty decent.
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 11:26 PM EDT up reply actions
You
Da'Sean Butler - A Mountaineer Legend
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Jul 30, 2011 11:27 PM EDT up reply actions
You
sure*
Da'Sean Butler - A Mountaineer Legend
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Jul 30, 2011 11:27 PM EDT up reply actions
no offense, but YOUR list??? lolol
sorry, had to be said
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 11:29 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm
confused.. my list, unless there’s something wrong with my list. I’d also be very confident believing Charlie, Vlad, WTM, and Tim Williams could find 50 guys as well.
confused.. my list, unless there’s something wrong with my list. I’d also be very confident believing Charlie, Vlad, WTM, and Tim Williams could find 50 guys as well.I mean we have 8 teams plus draftees. If you could get 6 draftees you like better than Baker, then you’d need 5.5 players from each minor league team you like better than Baker.
Da'Sean Butler - A Mountaineer Legend
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Jul 30, 2011 11:34 PM EDT up reply actions
well thats better
you said YOU could find 50 guys better than baker…
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 11:35 PM EDT up reply actions
Why
does it do that stupid repeating thing…?
I guess you are saying you wouldn’t put much merit into a top 50 list I put together.
Da'Sean Butler - A Mountaineer Legend
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Jul 30, 2011 11:37 PM EDT up reply actions
Baseball Prospectus didn't have him in the top 20.
So yeah, not a big loss.
So onto my love rocket, climb, Inside tank of fuel is not fuel, but love.
by IAPiratesFan on Jul 30, 2011 11:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Of course...
this move will require 25 and 40 man roster adjustments. I think we are pretty much out of guys to move to the 60 day DL…short of shutting down Tabata for the year.
Pretty much knocks it down to DFAs…one of the Wood brothers…or the unholy group of Jones, Paul, Overbay.
Well, Tabata wouldn’t be shut down for the year. He was injured in early June, so he’d be eligible to return in early September if that was the case, when rosters would’ve expanded. Of course, DFA’ing Overbay seems like the simplest solution.
Great
move because it cost absolutely nothing. Baker’s probably not even a top 50 prospect. One day he could turn into a below-average 1B (much like Overbay was this year), but I doubt he even gets a cup of coffee.
Using their own metric system (even though the mlbtraderumors article says he won’t be a compensation guy), he seems right on the cusp of being a type B free agent. If he hits well in the Burgh he probably will.
Now, the fact why he might not be is he simply could take arbitration because considering his age he probably won’t want to test the free agent market for a long-term contract he won’t get.
Da'Sean Butler - A Mountaineer Legend
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Jul 30, 2011 11:27 PM EDT reply actions
baker was top 50 beginning of the season, and he actually has been hitting better this season
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 11:27 PM EDT up reply actions
I’m not sure where exactly he ranked, but I could see him being bumped out by this season’s draft class.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 30, 2011 11:29 PM EDT up reply actions
Ya
Again, with this years draft class I could find 50 guys more interesting than Baker.
Da'Sean Butler - A Mountaineer Legend
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Jul 30, 2011 11:29 PM EDT up reply actions
Might not be only move either
Like the deal alot though
What?
It’s better than doing nothing. You want a impact player, your going to have pay alot for it. NH didn’t for a good bat and I thank him for that.
by Bradley James McEachern on Jul 30, 2011 11:29 PM EDT up reply actions
i think we should have got an impact bat
sorry, but thats what i believe should have been done
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 11:31 PM EDT up reply actions
Who?
Beltran said screw off and Pena isn’t going to be traded. Getting a impact bat will cost alot out there and this team isn’t in a position to do that. Why can’t you understand this.
by Bradley James McEachern on Jul 30, 2011 11:35 PM EDT up reply actions
He understands...
He wants more like every Pirate fan. Lee was a guy they could have went and got before the season and they didn’t. So I don’t look at as an upgrade more or less about 6 months late!
by Joey Mooney on Jul 30, 2011 11:38 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
It's still an upgrade over overfail no matter how you look at it.
Plus better late than ever. I understand he wants more but were not in a position to go out and overpaid and get more.
by Bradley James McEachern on Jul 30, 2011 11:41 PM EDT up reply actions
enough with the overbay nicknames
show the man some respect. his career is shot to shit. once hes released, then its carte blanche
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 11:42 PM EDT up reply actions
Once he's released i'll shown him respect.
I knew he was a great player, I liked him when he was Brewer. He just wasn’t one here.
by Bradley James McEachern on Jul 30, 2011 11:45 PM EDT up reply actions
Agreed.
Still about 17 hours until the deadline tomorrow. Still a lot of calls and negotiating that will happen. Asking prices will go up and down. It will be a frenetic finish. Ludwick, Willingham, Kubel and Upton are still out there. It will be a crazy finish as it always is.
Don’t know if it will be for a hitter or some pitching, but I think Neal makes one more move tomorrow.
Gonna be a fun day!
…And while I don’t like the Lee deal A LOT, I like it nonetheless. Anything’s better than Overbay.
OFF
subject COMPLETELY, but Zack Dodson had a very good start for the State College Spikes.
6IP, 6H, 2ER, BB, 8K
Da'Sean Butler - A Mountaineer Legend
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Jul 30, 2011 11:32 PM EDT reply actions
yessir
Da'Sean Butler - A Mountaineer Legend
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Jul 30, 2011 11:34 PM EDT up reply actions
OK... via Biertempfel...
Baker hit .282 with 15 bombs for Bradenton this year!
Uh… that’s pretty good. Is he really not a prospect?
He's older than Tabata and in A+ ball.
So onto my love rocket, climb, Inside tank of fuel is not fuel, but love.
by IAPiratesFan on Jul 30, 2011 11:34 PM EDT up reply actions
too old and defensive liability from what I have read
It doesn’t cost a thing to believe and the payoff on a winner is huge!
He's
23 and will be 24 in September. Put it this way, he’s older than Tabata, and a similar age as Cutch and Alvarez.
Da'Sean Butler - A Mountaineer Legend
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Jul 30, 2011 11:35 PM EDT up reply actions
Which
actually is fairly interesting cause the O’s could push him to AA, then start him in AAA next year and he would be decently age appropriate.
Da'Sean Butler - A Mountaineer Legend
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Jul 30, 2011 11:36 PM EDT up reply actions
OK...
Was just wondering. Don’t really follow every single prospect in the system.
Thanks.
I had
to look him up. Knew the name but didn’t know much about him. Stats scared me for a second, then I checked his age and breathed a sigh of relief.
Da'Sean Butler - A Mountaineer Legend
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Jul 30, 2011 11:37 PM EDT up reply actions
I heard the name Aaron Baker before...
But I had to look him up on Baseball-Reference to find out where he came from.
So onto my love rocket, climb, Inside tank of fuel is not fuel, but love.
by IAPiratesFan on Jul 30, 2011 11:45 PM EDT up reply actions
The home run numbers are also a little hollow. His isolated power is a not great .189. That’s decent, but not what his home run numbers suggest. Plus as a 23 year old in A ball he should be ahead of his competition.
by thecheeseisblue on Jul 30, 2011 11:39 PM EDT up reply actions
He's 2 hrs away in NYC.
He should be in the lineup tomorrow.
He might
BiertempfelTrib Rob Biertempfel
#Pirates new 1B Derrek Lee is 2 hours up the road w/O’s in NYC. Put him on a train, get him in lineup tomorrow v. Phils.
heard medicals were involved? is that right?
patient first closes at 10
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 11:41 PM EDT up reply actions
Talking to some guys at BleacherNation.
A guy named MichiganGoat says this about Carlos Pena and Derrek Lee:
It’s been mentioned and might just happen, I’d be fine with him on the team but not as a starter. He appears to be a stellar leader and great influence, but he just is too inconsistent and since he can only play first he can’t be a super-sub/utility guy. He’d have been a great influence on the young Pirates, Lee is a swell guy but he is a quiet person who never took to a leadership role as a Cub.
So onto my love rocket, climb, Inside tank of fuel is not fuel, but love.
Unfortuntanetly ...
… that’s what he does hits few dingers and PNC Park will turn many of those in to long outs in the notch.
The only thing that keeps this from being a truly awful trade is the fact the Pirates aren’t giveing up much to acquire a no hit, no walk right handed version of Lyle Overbay.
Very disappointing end to the season.
by UncleDirtNap on Jul 30, 2011 11:45 PM EDT up reply actions
you do know
they keep playing until at least october…still got 2 months.
Thats what she said! - Michael Gary Scott
Steelers time.
Baseball season over. The rest of the games are just for the stupid baseball nerds who think they need to play 162 games.
So onto my love rocket, climb, Inside tank of fuel is not fuel, but love.
by IAPiratesFan on Jul 30, 2011 11:46 PM EDT up reply actions
Per DK
Deal “very likely” to be done tonight. He could be in the line up tomorrow as he is only up the road in NYC.
reports? is someone being graded on this?
by white angus on Jul 30, 2011 11:43 PM EDT up reply actions
The same guy who checked Aki's medical reports.
So onto my love rocket, climb, Inside tank of fuel is not fuel, but love.
by IAPiratesFan on Jul 30, 2011 11:47 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Too Little, too Late!
Lee is a terrible fit for PNC Park, The only good thing about this trade is we apparently didn’t give up much to acquire nothing.
If this is indeed the trade all I can say is lost a lot of respect for Neal Huntington, have no confidence in him anymore.
he wanted beltran or pence…even though the one said no to us, the other one we didnt have enough in our system to dish out…
Thats what she said! - Michael Gary Scott
The notion he wanted Pence only underscores how in over his head Huntington might be at this point. The only difference between Pence and Lee are their positions and ages. Neither represents the slightest upgrade to the Pirate’s offense, both are terrible fits for PNC Park.
Anyone who thinks acquiring a right handed hitter with mediocre power to hit long fly ball outs to left center field in PNC is going to help them win is barking up the wrong tree.
by UncleDirtNap on Jul 30, 2011 11:50 PM EDT up reply actions
Of course now that you called him out
He’s quite. All talk and nothing else.
by Bradley James McEachern on Jul 30, 2011 11:56 PM EDT up reply actions
Eh
it’s his opinion and he’s entitled to it.
This move is fine for me. This isn’t the year to “go for it” so keep the farm. Low risk move, which is perfect. Works out even better if it nets us a draft pick later.
Da'Sean Butler - A Mountaineer Legend
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Jul 30, 2011 11:42 PM EDT up reply actions
But to say you lost respect for Huntington and have no confidence because he made this deal???? Come on
Who said this the only trade too?
There are so many other moves that NH has made in the past, yet this is the one you lose respect for him with?
by Zach Buccos on Jul 30, 2011 11:49 PM EDT up reply actions
Yup, lost all respect for the guy...
.. at crunch time he completely choked! there were a thousand and ways he could have approached the Pirates offensive problems and this pathetic feeble trade is just embarrassing.
Ring it up guys, season over. By the time they leave Milwaukee on the 14th of August they’ll be 8 games out of first and under .500 and I for one won’t waste on minute of the rest of my summer watching Derek Lee hit long fly ball outs in to the North Side notch as the season unravels for no other reason front office impudence.
Neal Huntington choked, plain and simple.
by UncleDirtNap on Jul 30, 2011 11:59 PM EDT up reply actions
there were a thousand and ways he could have approached the Pirates offensive problems
I’d like to hear, let’s say, five of the thousand, if you please, Uncle?
by BurgherKing on Jul 31, 2011 12:02 AM EDT up reply actions
People need to stop this.
NH went hard after Beltran and Pence. Beltran wouldn’t come, and the bidding became insane for Pence. The Cubs pulled Pena off the market and the Twins pulled Kubel (for now). A’s price for Willingham was too high.
There just aren’t that many players available and many of them aren’t worth the asking price, especially since the Pirates NEED to hold onto to prospects.
Before you go trashing people, what would you have done? Trade Heredia and Sanchez for Pence? Kidnapped Beltran?
Santa Roberto Clemente
Ora Pro Nobis
@ChristianTappe
Dejan reporting...
Pirates will be on the hook for about $1M of the remaining $2.6M on Lee’s contract.
Oh noes, we won't sign our draft picks now
1 million is way too much to spend.
snicker, snicker
How will they pay for water at the DR Complex!!?!?!!
Santa Roberto Clemente
Ora Pro Nobis
@ChristianTappe
Going to have cancel those king sized bed orders
twin beds for all the players now.
This is going to really impact the teams performance
I’m guessing they are going to have to stay at Red Roof Inn from here on out. Going to lead to bad sleeps and in turn, impact the teams performance.
by Zach Buccos on Jul 31, 2011 12:14 AM EDT up reply actions
A pittance
I don’t know. The more I’m reading about this deal, the more I like it. On the condition, we at least explore a RF bat. Not necessarily Upton
Fans are clingy complaining dip****s who will never ever be grateful for any concession you make. The sooner you tune out their shrill, tremulous voices, the better you'll be.
Ben "Yahtzee" Croshaw
Pittsburgh Pirates and Cleveland Browns fan, so I know suffering. I truly do.
by ytownbucsfan on Jul 30, 2011 11:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah. This proves Pence isn’t an impact bat, and Lee is basically just as good. They have similar walk and K rates, too.
by Adam Reynolds on Jul 30, 2011 11:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Pence's average is much better...
which obviously leads to a higher OBP, which is important for any offense’s success.
I’ll agree that Pence isn’t necessarily a world beater, but a lot of people undervalue Pence, and I don’t know why. He is a very good player.
I won’t say there aren’t differences, but given the price difference, I like the Lee deal better.
by Adam Reynolds on Jul 30, 2011 11:53 PM EDT up reply actions
I think you meant...
… Lee is basically as BAD as Pence. Both have horrible walk rates and mediocre power that will be swallowed up by PNC’s dimensions.
tjhe only reason this trade is slightly less worse than anything involving the over-hyped light weight Pence is we don’t give up a lot.
by UncleDirtNap on Jul 31, 2011 12:04 AM EDT up reply actions
nice trade
Pretty much exactly the type of trade NH should be making right now. It doesn’t make us a contender, but realistically there’s not really anything we can do to be a legit contender right now. It improves the team, gives us a better chance at .500, and the cost is minimal. Plus, it might convince some more people to come out to the ballpark, which is good business and good for the fans. I’m pretty happy about this.
Completely agree – I wonder where the Bucs would be without all these injuries and a moderately successful Alvarez.
I know everyone likes mckenry
But Snyder’s missing bat is hurting this team a lot.
Good post epoc
Good business move here. Getting rid of Overbay is a plus for me. We aren’t going to win the division but I do think its important that we do finish over 500.
Except ...
… It’s not likely to happen with Lee in the lineup. Finishing over .500 now seems like a long shot with H.R. Whiffenstuff hitting long fly balls into the notch ant PNC.
I hate to tell you all this but after just few games of watching Lee make copious amounts of outs at PNC you’re going to be begging for the return of Lyle Overbay.
Terrible fit for the tea, just terrible.
by UncleDirtNap on Jul 31, 2011 12:09 AM EDT up reply actions
nothing to hate about this trade
gave up nothing and we have a replacement for Overbay.
Why complain over it?
by dulciusXasperis on Jul 30, 2011 11:49 PM EDT reply actions
Nothing to hate...
as long as Overbay is the corresponding roster move.
Have a feeling they might wait til Presley comes back...
Santa Roberto Clemente
Ora Pro Nobis
@ChristianTappe
Because ...
… the replacement is probably going to be significantly worse than Overbay as hard as that is to imagine.
Get ready to watch of lot of long fly ball outs in left center field in key situations. Terrible fit.
by UncleDirtNap on Jul 31, 2011 12:11 AM EDT up reply actions
yup
neil walker hurt himself sneezing and joined the rest of the team on the DL
by Captain Easychord on Jul 30, 2011 11:53 PM EDT up reply actions
Your not a hockey guy are you?
If not you won’t understand that joke.
by Bradley James McEachern on Jul 30, 2011 11:54 PM EDT up reply actions
I follow hockey...
and I don’t understand it.
Same
Da'Sean Butler - A Mountaineer Legend
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Jul 30, 2011 11:57 PM EDT up reply actions
When Presley and Doumit get back
Presley LF
Walker 2B
Cutch CF
Lee 1B
Alvarez 3B
Doumit/McKenry C
Jones/Diaz/Pearce (player to be traded for tomorrow)
Cedeno SS
I like it.
I do as well
But look at the current market trends. That is going to happen. We would have to give up one of the big three pitchers to get him based on this market
by Zach Buccos on Jul 30, 2011 11:57 PM EDT up reply actions
Me too.
But unless the Rays are just ready to get rid of him and lower the asking price, which they could with Jennings ready to take over in CF, I think the asking price will be too much.
We’ll have to make offers with 3 or 4 other teams I’m sure, and the Rays will obviously be taking the best deal if they do decide to trade him. And I doubt we’ll be giving them the best offer out of everybody.
Would you give up
Marte, Colton Cain and Bryan Morris for him?
The question is
Will this lineup be available when we enter the NL Central portion of the schedule
Walker hitting...
… anywhere near the top of the order is a sure way to reduce offensive output.
by UncleDirtNap on Jul 31, 2011 12:13 AM EDT up reply actions
Having you on this blog, sure way to increase offensive output!
by Brakeman8 on Jul 31, 2011 12:38 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Yikes.
I remember when they said the Yankees stole Xavier Nady from us.
Should I be worried?
So onto my love rocket, climb, Inside tank of fuel is not fuel, but love.
by IAPiratesFan on Jul 31, 2011 12:06 AM EDT up reply actions
Whoo Hoo
First my lil ol Fan Shot gets moved to the main page and now an overflow!
Thank you, Derrek Lee (and Charlie).
FWIW
Gave up very little, paying very little, should be a visible, if not significant upgrade. Type B would be a big bonus. Not actually exciting, but worthwhile.
Incidentally, this is exactly the kind of move DK was demanding. Made the team better without hurting the org.
by JRoth95 on Jul 31, 2011 12:13 AM EDT via mobile reply actions
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
Related FanPosts on Bucs Dugout
Related FanShots on Bucs Dugout
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
Baseball Nation Recent Stories
In Association With
Big League Stew - MLB - Yahoo! Sports
- College player makes impossible over the fence catch to save tournament game (Video)
- Security!: Camden Yards guard collides with Royals’ Mike Moustakas
- The Juice: Nelson Cruz matches career high eight RBIs, Pujols stays hot in Seattle
- Benches clear at Fenway as Red Sox-Rays rivalry heats up
- Keeping good company: Albert Pujols becomes fourth-youngest player to hit 450 home runs
