Community Prospect #18
by epoc on Jan 12, 2012 6:49 PM EST
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With 31% of the vote, Jordy Mercer is elected community prospect #17. Dodson, Wilson, and Morris were all bunched up in second place. The list:
1. Gerrit Cole
2. Jameson Taillon
3. Starling Marte
4. Josh Bell
5. Luis Heredia
6. Robbie Grossman
7. Tony Sanchez
8. Kyle McPherson
9. Stetson Allie
10. Nick Kingham
11. Rudy Owens
12. Jeff Locke
13. Jarek Cunningham
14. Alex Dickerson
15. Zack Von Rosenberg
16. Colton Cain
17. Jordy Mercer
I'm adding Brock Holt, Jose Osuna, Gorkys Hernandez, and Ramon Cabrera to the poll. Other suggestions are welcome. Poll will run for 24 hours.
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of the managing editor (Charlie) or SB Nation. FanPosts are written by Bucs Dugout readers.
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+1
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
by Kosstic518 on Jan 12, 2012 7:13 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
+1
Not actually affiliated with whygavs.
by WHYG Zane Smith on Jan 12, 2012 7:40 PM EST up reply actions
+1
"So you think 25 percent of the country is retarded?! Yea. Atleast 25 percent. Well lets do a sample. There are 4 of us an you're retarded. Thats 25 percent." Southpark; Mystery of the Urinal Deuce
RIP Corey Keller, James Taylor, M. Jay Darby, Derek Davis.
by gorillakilla34 on Jan 13, 2012 11:03 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
+1
Hard work always beats talent if talent doesn't work hard.
"Matt Cooke and Evgeni Malkin for Brian Boyle, Derek Stepan, Brandon Dubinsky, Mike Rupp, and a first round pick." -JackCampbell
How many brooks would a Brooks Laich like if a Brooks Laich could like brooks?
suggestions
Some guys to think about as possible testers/selections:
Yamaico Navarro
Phil Irwin
Mel Rojas
Matt Hague
Adalberto Santos
Gustavo Nunez
Gift Ngoepe
Ryan Hafner
Elevys Gonzalez
Nate Baker
Joely Rodriguez
Eric Fryer
Colten Brewer
Tyler Glasnow
Jake Burnette
Jason Creasy
Taylor Lewis
Candon Myles
Brandon Cumpton
Tyler Waldron
Elias Diaz
Drew Maggi
Andrew Lambo
Carlos Paulino
Evan Chambers
Zac Fuesser
Wes Freeman
Cesar Lopez
Gregory Polanco
Willy Garcia
Harold Ramirez
Elvis Escobar
Jodaneli Carvajal
Yhonathan Barrios
Jin-De Jhang
Dennis Hurtarte
Dilson Herrera
and just for MCTruth: Dovydas Neverauskas
I apologize if I left out anybody’s favorite pet prospect. I just wanted to throw out some names so we don’t overlook guys just because they’re not on the poll at the moment.
Damn
I don’t feel like you could’ve missed anyone! You’re really a Hanson fan huh?
The glare of the spotlight is harsh, and the pressure that success breeds immense. We revere our heroes, but expect much. And criticism can come as easily as praise.
Perspectives become reality.
Twitter: @shanecglass
By the way
you’re support of Hanson in the last round was quite pursuasive. I probably won’t vote again after Hanson makes the cut as I have very little opinion about anyone left on the board.
Singh and Cayonez
Yeah, they could certainly be considered at some point.
Should Jeff Inman be in there?
I feel like we Mercer types should be giving Fryer a look in there.
Not actually affiliated with whygavs.
by WHYG Zane Smith on Jan 12, 2012 7:43 PM EST up reply actions
Fryer v. Mercer
I completely agree. I don’t think Fryer’s much of a prospect, but I don’t see how he can be far behind Mercer, if at all.
Inman
He could be considered at some point, but I don’t know what basis there is to even compare him to anyone else. I saw him pitch a couple times in Bradenton last year, and I still don’t have any idea what to think of him. When I saw him, he was only throwing fastballs. There are a bunch of semi-interesting, perennially-injured pitchers in the system, though.
Sigh.
I’m NEVER gonna get to stop voting for Holmes, ‘cause he’s never gonna win a vote. =P
Hard work always beats talent if talent doesn't work hard.
"Matt Cooke and Evgeni Malkin for Brian Boyle, Derek Stepan, Brandon Dubinsky, Mike Rupp, and a first round pick." -JackCampbell
How many brooks would a Brooks Laich like if a Brooks Laich could like brooks?
agree totally
I think Holmes is being way overrated compared to the other HS pitchers from the 2011 draft, and Glasnow is my favorite among them. Holmes throws 90-93 with questionable mechanics and an inconsistent slider. He doesn’t have much projection remaining. He’s reportedly pretty smart. Glasnow throws 88-91 but has touched 93, has a ton of projection remaining. His velo will probably play up too, since he’s 6’7". His curve was rated the best in the Pirate draft class by BA, and he has a changeup (nominally, at least – I haven’t seen any firm grades on it). He’s also very young and will pitch the bulk of the 2012 season at age 18. Holmes turns 19 in March.
Glasnow is really flying under the radar right now.
glasnow/Burnette both have solid cases
and could be the Kinghams for 2012. At this point, though, I have no idea what to expect from either, since I know v little abt both.
by BurgherKing on Jan 13, 2012 12:19 AM EST up reply actions
Quinton Miller
is he a prospect at all anymore? If he’s still in the org. I imagine he will be in a bullpen somewhere this year.
Maybe we should limit it
I am not sure I feel qualified to rate people who have only played in the DSL or VSL. I like Dilson Herrera, but what do I really know about how to evaluate people in those leagues. Can we make a rule to restrict it only to people who have played in at least Rookie level ball?
by SojourningPirate on Jan 12, 2012 10:26 PM EST up reply actions
The community can make any rule it wants for itself. What do other people think about this.
(Personally, I agree that it’s very tough to rank guys we haven’t seen, but I wouldn’t want to artificially restrict the voting. People vote for guys based on reasons I don’t understand or agree with all the time, whether in the states or not. They should be free to do so. And depending on how deep we go, I’m going to be voting for foreign guys at some point over marginal guys like Drew Maggi and Elevys Gonzalez who are in the states.)
At the same time
has anybody on here seen Josh Bell? If you restrict guys who have only played in foreign summer leagues, wouldn’t you also have to restrict (most of) the last draft class? Also, while I have had a chance to see several of the guys on the list, there are others that I can only go on scouting reports, numbers etc. because I haven’t had a chance to catch one of their games. If you want to vote for a guy like Herrera or Harold Ramirez based on scouting reports, reputation or a gut feeling, I think that’s fine just like it’s fine to vote for Yamaico Navarro even if you’ve never actually seen one of his games. Just my couple of pennies…
by KentuckyPirate on Jan 13, 2012 10:48 AM EST up reply actions
I agree with your main point, but the foreign league guys are different than the 2011 draftees. You can watch video and read reports about the draftees, at least. I’ve never even seen a picture of Dilson Herrera. There’s a lot more info about guys who’ve played in the states.
That's fair
and actually, I think most on this site have seen Bell at least a little because I remember videos of him being posted after he was drafted and/or signed. I still think everybody in the organization should be eligible partly because, as you said, there are at least a few guys in the foreign leagues I’d take over somebody like Maggi (for example). Also, if somebody wanted to, it would be perfectly rational to say “I’d vote for Herrera, except I want to see him play in the states first so I’ll drop him behind Player X.” I feel like playing in the DSL is just another piece of the prospect pie.
by KentuckyPirate on Jan 13, 2012 1:01 PM EST up reply actions
if we need to be qualified I should probably stop right now
(which epoc might like, since I may have been the biggest Mercer advocate).
I think we should leave it open to anyone in the system — the DSL/VSL guys will lose support because people aren’t familiar with them, and that’s how it should be.
Not actually affiliated with whygavs.
by WHYG Zane Smith on Jan 13, 2012 11:57 AM EST up reply actions
Dodson
If you liked Kingham I’m not sure why one wouldn’t like Dodson as well. Zack basically had the same season Kingham did, but a level higher and a year older. He’s also left handed and has a nice frame although probably without the future projection that Kingham has.
I think Kingham’s got better stuff across the board (plus the projection you mention), but I agree that Dodson is being underrated, especially relative to Cain and ZVR. His upside isn’t as high as those guys, but he doesn’t have as many red flags either. KLaw said he looked like the best of the 2009 HS pitchers this year.
Cabrera
I don’t like Cabrera here. His defense is questionable enough that I’m not optimistic he’ll stick as a catcher, and he’s not going to be able to play anywhere else on the diamond. He also has absolutely no power, which is going to catch up to him eventually. It’s a shame because he has a great approach and is a good pure hitter, but I don’t think he has the body/athleticism/strength to make it work at the highest level.
The votes are getting too splintered
We need to start runoffs
Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?
http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained
by Kosstic518 on Jan 13, 2012 7:12 AM EST via mobile reply actions
Does anybody else have an opinion on this? My own feeling is that unless there’s an actual tie, there’s no need for a runoff. But having runoffs for anything close might give the more accurate ranking.
In some ways
it could make sense. While I feel like I have to vote for Wilson until he gets in somewhere because I think he should be next in line, I was stunned to see Mercer get the nod at 17. I probably would have put him at least 10 spots lower. Ultimately, though, I like having to stick to my guns instead of saying “well, if my guy can’t win, I guess…”. For something like this where we really don’t need to be accurate for any reason and we haven’t done it up to this point, I don’t think it’s necessary. Having said that, if we start doing runoffs, I’ll definitely participate.
by KentuckyPirate on Jan 13, 2012 10:42 AM EST up reply actions
Mercer got almost twice as many votes as the runners-up in the #17 poll. I’d prefer not to do run-offs if the margin of victory is that big. It might end up more accurate, but it would be much slower and more tedious. I don’t think the runner-up has been within 5% of the winner in any of the polls so far. That said, I’m open to whatever the community wants to do.
Mercer
KentuckyPirate,
Do I have a better chance of walking versus Mercer is the Pirates everyday shortstop?
George
I dunno
It’s not that I dislike Mercer, he just strikes me as a guy who is decent at a lot of things without really being good at anything. I’ve seen some on here compare him to Clint Barmes if everything breaks right and if that’s the case, he could make a decent SS to ride through his arbitration years but I’m just not a really big fan.
by KentuckyPirate on Jan 13, 2012 1:07 PM EST up reply actions
agreed that there's no need
I think runoffs would really slow things down to not much purpose. This isn’t the most scientific exercise anyway; first-past-the-post seems like it works except in actual ties or maybe virtual ties.
Also runoffs aren’t guaranteed to work — say 1/5 of everyone likes a different low-A pitching prospect, and everyone has Gorkys as their runner-up. Maybe Gorkys should win — he’d win head-to-head with anyone — but he wouldn’t make it into the runoff.
Not actually affiliated with whygavs.
by WHYG Zane Smith on Jan 13, 2012 11:54 AM EST up reply actions
instant run-off
It would be awesome to do instant run-off voting, which we could do if everyone posted their top five remaining. It would be way too much work for most people, though.
My $.02:
No – to runoffs (unless there’s a tie).
Yes – to keeping the DSL/VSL guys in the mix.
by Midnight Moose on Jan 13, 2012 4:07 PM EST up reply actions
it'd be a lot of work for you too
Unless you’ve got some kind of program that does it — even then, seems like it’d be a lot of data entry.
Not actually affiliated with whygavs.
by WHYG Zane Smith on Jan 13, 2012 12:40 PM EST up reply actions
You could keep it the way it is
but on each subsequent post, put up a poll between the top 2 vote getters from the previous vote.
It would be half-hearted and a sort of consolation prize if there were any upsets but might prove interesting.
No runoff
I don’t think splintered is bad at this point in the process.
by SojourningPirate on Jan 13, 2012 2:19 PM EST up reply actions
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