Where is the love?

by zogger on Feb 19, 2012 8:24 AM EST

Where is the love from the fan base for what the Bucs have done this off season? I mean come on guys they went out, found some better players at key positions, lost no good players, and improved the team. Lets look at the list going into the off season and the actions taken:

1) Needed better starters. OK, got Burnett and Bedard. Let Maholm go. Net plus with the potential be net big plus

2) SS erratic. OK, got solid SS in Barmes.

3) Catchers kept getting hurt and had to play backups of the backups. OK, got solid C in Barajas.

4) Future star at 3B was hurt and played poorly, had to play backups, OK, got solid backup in McGehee who can also be platooned/backup/bench at 1B.

5) Hole at 1B. OK, got platoon for GFJ in McGehee. Have two young players competing in Matt Hague and Nick Evans. Did not fix the issue, but potential is there for solid 1B play.

6) Bench was poor in 2011. Added McGehee and McLouth.

7) Need better OF backups. OK got McLouth.

While none of the above is signing Pujos, Fielder, or a big name pitcher; we all know getting big names to sign with the Bucs won't happen untill the Bucs start winning. They will only start winning when the young players get better. The players they are bringing in are just to temporary to fill holes and not block the propects. Overall they improved the team and lost nothing.

I would rate the Front Office's offseason a B+.

This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of the managing editor (Charlie) or SB Nation. FanPosts are written by Bucs Dugout readers.

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Comments

We would have signed

Albert Pujols if Mark Cuban owned the team…. ;-)

Welcome to the new dark ages.....

by Trogluddite on Feb 19, 2012 10:24 AM EST reply actions

Mark's reaction:

________________________________
Free your ass and your mind will follow.

Follow @cocktailsfor2

by cocktailsfor2 on Feb 19, 2012 11:25 AM EST up reply actions

lol

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by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Feb 19, 2012 5:47 PM EST up reply actions

Because the yinz have unrealistic expectations.

Should the Pirates keep Neal Huntington?

http://www.bucsdugout.com/2011/5/16/2174135/poll-should-huntington-be-retained

by Kosstic518 on Feb 19, 2012 11:08 AM EST via mobile reply actions

or because the writers of the site decided it was a poor offseason in October.

by Mr. E on Feb 21, 2012 1:37 PM EST up reply actions

well, and we didn’t add a single long-term piece, and completely whiffed again on 1B. It’s a B- offseason with potential for anywhere from D to A by September.

by Mr. E on Feb 21, 2012 1:39 PM EST up reply actions

i think nh has something brewing to upgrade 1st base.

i just hope sweetleb or willy’s source stay mum.

by karreemofwheat on Feb 19, 2012 12:44 PM EST reply actions

I think their moves this offseason added 1, maybe 2, wins . . .

from what they would have had if they fielded the same team from last year, so I would think it was decent, a B- in my estimation.

Everything that guy just said is bullshit . . .thank you

by Scranton on Feb 19, 2012 4:03 PM EST reply actions

More like 4 or 5

I think more like 4 or 5.

Anyway, the key to our fouture is not the guys we added; rather how well the young players do. If Alvarez, McCutchen, Walker, Presley, Tabata, Karstans, Morton,and Hanranhan all improve-we can be competitive. Each one can give us 1 to 2 more wins apiece.

by zogger on Feb 19, 2012 4:11 PM EST up reply actions

our fouture is bright

by white angus on Feb 19, 2012 4:12 PM EST up reply actions

Its still about what the returning cast can do

Its up to Pedro, Cutch, Walker, Tabata, Presley to provide the value. I made a post on this before. Pedro at 2WAR, Cutch at 6-7WAR, Walker 3WAR, Tabata 2WAR and Presley 2WAR gives us an immediate upgrade of wins

Thats what she said! - Michael Gary Scott

by C Shint on Feb 19, 2012 4:10 PM EST reply actions

You beat me to it!

by zogger on Feb 19, 2012 4:11 PM EST up reply actions

it's very hard to love this offseason..

BUT it’s hard to hate it..

While adding Bedard was a great move; losing Maholm in the process makes it a wash. Adding Burnett was a great addition, but why could’nt we add Bedard and Burnett while retaining Maholm?

by FusilliJerry88 on Feb 19, 2012 4:24 PM EST reply actions

before adding Burnett

I had the Pirates offseason at a “D+/C-”, and after adding Burnett I’d say its at a “C+/B-” which is respectable…

by FusilliJerry88 on Feb 19, 2012 4:25 PM EST up reply actions

I agree with that.

I was going to say something like that.

You gotta aim high to fail so big. - Trace Beaulieu

by IAPiratesFan on Feb 19, 2012 4:25 PM EST up reply actions

D+/C-…. i totally disagree….probably a C/C+/ barajas was the best free agent catcher available, hes a rock defensively and is one of the best HR hitting catchers in the bigs in the past few years (which not many people know about that). you get the best FA shortstop not named reyes and rollins, which Barmes was. hes an upgrade over ronny hands down, better defensively and offensively. Brian Kenny on mlb.com rated the Barmes signed as one of the 5 best of the offseason. you seriously need to be realistic when it comes to guys they can obtain via the free agent market right now

by rinsana11 on Feb 19, 2012 4:41 PM EST up reply actions

I think I'm being very realistic..

I just think the fact they failed to address the firstbase situation is a reason this offseason was’nt an “A”. I also think they made mistakes in not bringing back Maholm, or Doumit. I can’t stand Doumit behind the plate, but we could’ve really used his bat this year; even if that means only 300-400 ABs between backup catcher and firstbase..

by FusilliJerry88 on Feb 19, 2012 5:11 PM EST up reply actions

i dont think they failed at the 1B situation

when the only “better than decent” 1B free agents out there are Pujols and Fielder, there really wasnt one to choose from.

a trade possibly could have been made for one, so i’ll give on that one.

by white angus on Feb 19, 2012 5:34 PM EST up reply actions

i don't know if they failed at firstbase either

I just know that there were trade options out there that made sense for us this year and the long haul.

I like Jones though, so that keeps me from being completely frustrated..

by FusilliJerry88 on Feb 19, 2012 8:19 PM EST up reply actions

but they did address the 1B situation by offering arbitration to Derrek Lee

the fact that he (apparently) chose to retire instead of accepting ~$8M to be the Pirates’ starting 1B speaks volumes about how difficult it is to attract free agents here.

As white angus points out, they could have tried to trade for someone, but I’m not sure who they could have realistically acquired that would be better than the Jones/McGehee platoon they will presumably end up with.

by gonfalon on Feb 20, 2012 11:37 AM EST up reply actions

Ramon Hernandez

is superior to Barajas.

by Wizard of Woz on Feb 20, 2012 4:40 PM EST up reply actions

Good post

Zogger. I agree.

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by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Feb 19, 2012 5:47 PM EST reply actions

Barmes...

Had a career best year in 2012, and I think people who call him a power bat are seriously exaggerating. 23 HR in 2009 is his only year w/more than 12 (he had 12 in ‘11). That’s playing home games in Coors, then Minute Maid Park. Now the Pirates have signed him to play shortstop for his age 33 and 34 seasons. At least he played a nice SS last year, but it’s hard for me to forget Chris Gomez and Ramon Vasquez—two guys NH signed to play short who couldn’t play short. I’m not convinced he’ll solve the problems there; I hope to see Mercer or d’Arnaud rip the position from him.

by nickp593 on Feb 19, 2012 7:54 PM EST reply actions

I don't care for the Barmes signing but

he’s much better than Gomez and Vasquez were. I question whether his offensive numbers will translate to PNC though but he should be a plus defender the next 2 years.

by JCBucs on Feb 19, 2012 9:34 PM EST up reply actions

Unmentioned extra value in Barmes/Barajas

They’re solid, unspectacular performers/placeholders. With a team like Pittsburgh that has to develop talent from within, there won’t be any outcry (or big chunk of change to swallow) if Mercer/D’Arnaud/Sanchez plays well enough to wrest the starting spot from one of them. If the young guys play crappy, Barmes and Barajas are probably good enough to avoid anyone calling for their jobs.

Yeah, I know, this isn’t a great point, and I clearly care more about PR than the Pirates do… but I’m talking myself into it.

by SuperBaes on Feb 20, 2012 3:14 AM EST reply actions

Agreed, Zogger

Very good offseason. And, despite not many ‘giving the love’, they are doing it in their own way: by being silent. That’s good enough for me….

by Mr. Smizik on Feb 20, 2012 10:05 AM EST reply actions

I HOPE all those points work out on the plus side.

I REALLY do. I have no intent to be negative, but it seems fair to point out that……

1. Bedard could get hurt and Burnett might not make the significant improvement which most are projecting. (After all, he’s 35 and his velocity has been declining for years.) Maholm’s loss could prove to be a negative. While I EXPECT the rotation to improve, there remains a significant chance that it could be a net negative.

2. Barmes may continue to play good defense at age 33, but Cedeno played pretty good defense himself in 2011. Most of Barmes 2011 “power” may disappear, and if he OPS’s higher than Cedeno, it won’t be by much. Barmes MAY be an upgrade, but he may not, and almost certainly won’t be a significant upgrade (except in Hurdle’s book).

3. Barajas seems unlikely to match the Pirates 2011 catchers in terms of WAR. His power should suffer at PNC, and he’s 36 (37 in September). So….. he’s likely to be an upgrade on defense (at least over Doumit) but a downgrade on offense. No better than a wash, IMO.

4. Casey McGehee (2011 slash line of .223/.280/.346/.626) should be better than the 2011 version of Alvarez. Little doubt about that. But unless he improves over last year, he won’t contribute in any capacity toward the Pirates becoming competitive.

5. The 1B platoon (may be Jones-Evans, with McGehee playing more at 3B) PROBABLY will be OK….. but not equal to what a competitive team normally has at 1B.

6. The 2011 stats of McGehee and McLouth (.228/.344/.333/.677) don’t inspire much confidence, let alone love. But yes, they’ll probably improve the bench.

7. McLouth almost HAS TO be better than Diaz and Paul, at least on defense.

if all items listed work out positively (kind of rare), it will be cause for rejoicing on the part of Pirate fans everywhere, and MAYBE the team will break the streak. At this point, I have some cautious hope….. but It seems to me that performance needs to precede the love.

by magnumo on Feb 20, 2012 2:53 PM EST reply actions